View Full Version : Are you supposed to do that to a Glock???
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jpqbNz9AKb4
At 8:30. They guy sprays break-free to all the internal parts. You are not supposed to lube the internals, are you? BUT, if you detail strip a brand new Glock you find out all the parts are slightly oiled.
What do you think?
The only place too much lube is going to hurt anything in in the firing pin channel. Spraying everything in the lower group may not add much in the way of benefits but it isn't going to hurt anything either.
AngeredKabar
01-08-11, 18:12
I used a rag with a couple drops of breakfree on it to help wipe off fouling on those internal components. There's not really enough clp left after you wipe it off for lubrication purposes and those components get dirty on their own anyway.
arcticlightfighter
01-08-11, 18:54
I have seen several "over lubed" Glocks come across my bench that were pretty gummed up but still operated and functoned/fired without issue.
Athough not recommended nor ideal, it has been my experience that this will not always render the Glock inoperable.
I took my G19 3rd Gen and purposely lubed the firing pin channel as well as the frame and ejector housing and fired a couple hundred rounds through it without issue. Although not scientific and I dont recommend it, your Glock isnt going tits up if you inadvertedly get oil/lube in the FP channel.
Ive seen way more issues with dirty/oily chambers causing FTE/FTF issues locking GLocks and other pistols up solid.
It looks like he sprays them, then wipes off the lube. That's not the way I was trained, but whatever works for him.
I have seen Glocks that failed to fire due to issues stemming from too much lube in the FP channel. One was discovered at qulaifications after it would not fire at all. The officer in question had been involved in an OIS a few weeks prior to quals, but shot the BG with his rifle. Good thing, because his G22 would not fire. It worked fine the last time he was at the range, he cleaned it, loaded it, and carried it on duty. Next time he attempted to fire it.....nothing but repeated clicks as he would pull the trigger then tap and rack, over and over.
I stripped the gun. Over time, lube had gotten in the FP channel and collected debris. It looded like a green sludge. The sludge was thick enough not to allow the FP to strike the primer. No dents, no nothin'. I cleaned the gun, reassembled it, and it ran 100%.
CumbiaDude
01-09-11, 22:08
No, you're not supposed to do that. You're supposed to oil in the indicated locations:
http://www.glockmeister.com/images/lubing.jpg
Like people have said, though, it probably wouldn't hurt. Probably.
It looks like he sprays them, then wipes off the lube. That's not the way I was trained, but whatever works for him.
I have seen Glocks that failed to fire due to issues stemming from too much lube in the FP channel. One was discovered at qulaifications after it would not fire at all. The officer in question had been involved in an OIS a few weeks prior to quals, but shot the BG with his rifle. Good thing, because his G22 would not fire. It worked fine the last time he was at the range, he cleaned it, loaded it, and carried it on duty. Next time he attempted to fire it.....nothing but repeated clicks as he would pull the trigger then tap and rack, over and over.
I stripped the gun. Over time, lube had gotten in the FP channel and collected debris. It looded like a green sludge. The sludge was thick enough not to allow the FP to strike the primer. No dents, no nothin'. I cleaned the gun, reassembled it, and it ran 100%.
man that's scary :eek:
i dunno how guys can carry a gun every day and not take it apart and check it for issues once a month or so.
AngeredKabar
01-10-11, 01:25
man that's scary :eek:
i dunno how guys can carry a gun every day and not take it apart and check it for issues once a month or so.
Maybe the rules they have to follow say they can only field strip their weapons, then have it checked out by an armorer once a year.
I have seen more than a few Glock 21's downed due to too much CLP in the firing pin channel.
Glocks need very little lube to keep running. All you are doing by adding too much lube is creating a giant magnet for dirt and grime.
PdxMotoxer
01-10-11, 03:45
Thank you for putting "@ 8:30" because i tried to sit through
and couldn't.....
I even tried to FFWD to find the spot but i couldn't take one more second
listening to how dull and emotionless he talks for one sec.
As for the lube i've seen so much worse. at least he wiped the parts
after he sprayed them all.
No, you're not supposed to do that. You're supposed to oil in the indicated locations:
http://www.glockmeister.com/images/lubing.jpg
Like people have said, though, it probably wouldn't hurt. Probably.
That chart is out of date. Latest manuals include more lubrication points.
GermanSynergy
01-10-11, 06:01
Lube IAW the TM and you should be fine.
As others have stated, lubing the firing pin channel is a bad thing, for obvious reasons.
The officer cleaned what he could when he fieldstripped the gun. I appeared to be well-maintained when field stripped and examined. The problem was that the recommended annual armorer level strip and clean wasn't done on his weapon for a few years (department's fault, not officer's). Fortunately, all ended well.
I do not lubricate Glocks. No need to.
Fact:
I do not lubricate Glocks.
Opinion:
No need to.
The manufacturer of the handgun in question disagrees with you.
It will not hurt the gun and it will fire fine. However it is overkill and not needed. Too much lubricant and it will attract powder, dirt, etc. But whatever floats your boat man. Sometimes, I think you can dip it into a bucket of 10W-30 and it will be fine. Go figure.
CumbiaDude
01-10-11, 21:03
That chart is out of date. Latest manuals include more lubrication points.By latest manuals, do you mean the new Gen 4 manuals? That picture is an exact match to the one in my Gen 3 Glock 19 manual. I'd be interested in knowing what new places are indicated in the newest manuals. :)
What is the mechanism whereby lube ATTRACTS gunk. ;) No more so I don't suppose than an AR does; which runs very well wet.
But I digress. My Glocks have run superbly lubed and shot dry as a bone for one or two thousand rounds at a stretch.
By latest manuals, do you mean the new Gen 4 manuals? That picture is an exact match to the one in my Gen 3 Glock 19 manual. I'd be interested in knowing what new places are indicated in the newest manuals. :)
He's wrong. I have a Gen4 Glock 17 and the picture is the same.
The manufacturer of the handgun in question disagrees with you.
Considering how full of it Glock is about a lot of things they say, I'm unconcerned.
Considering how full of it Glock is about a lot of things they say, I'm unconcerned.
Please elaborate on this statement and the reasoning behind your assertion that Glock would deliberately tell customers to lubricate a handgun that allegedly doesn't need it, as it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. Also, please list the "things" that Glock says that would indicate that they are "full of it".
I'm aware that Glock handguns can operate without lubrication. Glock has routinely failure tested guns by running them without lubrication. I'm fascinated as to why people feel the need to failure test their own guns by running them without lubrication (especially the guns that they carry for defense). As if their knowledge of mechanical and chemical engineering (as it's related to the three states of lubrication) is somehow superior to that of the engineers who designed and tested the machine.
Ever run a Glock hard in a high dust environment? I can assure you with utter confidence that a Glock can and does fail in dusty conditions when run without lubrication. It fails in other conditions as well. Just like any other handgun. The "it doesn't need lubrication" theory ranks up there with the "clean it in the dishwasher" and "you never have to clean them" theories. They're all bullshit.
What is the mechanism whereby lube ATTRACTS gunk. ;) No more so I don't suppose than an AR does; which runs very well wet.
But I digress. My Glocks have run superbly lubed and shot dry as a bone for one or two thousand rounds at a stretch.
i prefer them nicely greased on all the wear points.
sometimes i'll throw some militec on top if i'm going to shoot a lot.
lube prevents wear. on a carry gun it can trap (not attract) some grit, i find grease is a little better for this. also grease doesn't tend to pool uselessly at the front of the slide like oil can.
CumbiaDude
01-11-11, 19:37
He's wrong. I have a Gen4 Glock 17 and the picture is the same.Thanks for the added info :) I guess I'll have to wait for Swatieson to get back to this thread to find out what he was referring to.
:confused:
The most bullshit line in the history of marketing. "perfection."
Glock is known for carefully shepherding their image, concealing recalls, etc. 9mm Glocks are the most reliable service pistols made... but not perfection.
And whenever I've used a Glock in a high dust environment, it was kept under a shirt.
The most bullshit line in the history of marketing. "perfection."
Marketing is all bullshit. Every company has ridiculous marketing slogans that no one should pay any attention to. Take HK for example: "No Compromise". They don't compromise? How about the safety of NATO forces around the world when they allow terrorist ridden countries like Sudan and Sierra Leone to license build their firearms and help them to do it. How about HK shipping weapons to Bosnia during the height of the conflict and even recently evading EU arms regulations to ship to SE Asia. Seems they'll compromise for the right amount of money. Your answer does not address why a company would allegedly design a gun that needed no lubrication and then instruct users to lubricate it.
Glock is known for carefully shepherding their image
What company in any industry doesn't?
concealing recalls
Glock issues public announcements pertaining to official recalls in accordance with U.S. Code and regulations set forth by the FTC and other federal agencies. Glock will provide recall information to any owner who contacts them for said information no matter how old the gun is or whether the owner is the original one or not. Just like automakers do. I'm a Glock armorer and I've not heard of Glock recalling a gun and doing it secretly. That makes no sense whatsoever and defeats the purpose of a recall. Do they issue some kind of internal memo that says "This thing is broken. We're recalling it. Don't tell anyone."
And whenever I've used a Glock in a high dust environment, it was kept under a shirt.
I'm not talking about concealing it and not firing it. I'm talking about shooting a Glock that was in a thigh holster or chest rig and been subjected to a haboob or dust on convoy runs for extended periods. The gun will fire most of the time, but not for long. It's been my experience, and that of many others, that most weapons don't perform well when run dry in that kind of grit. Even if the lube is capturing dust, it's still lubricating. So lubing it is better than not lubing it. I cite this article as a case:
http://www.militarytimes.com/news/2007/07/army_carbine_lubrication_070716/
How about this :
Would you want lube in your Glock if it looked like this guy's and you found yourself in a TIC:
http://i188.photobucket.com/albums/z257/ppd6576/412.jpg
The correct answer is: yes.
I spent several decades carrying Glocks for police work and overseas work. I have not seen any professional who relies on his weapons to protect his life and the lives of his teammates run any weapon without lubrication. I say with confidence that anyone who was foolish enough to do it would find himself in a serious disagreement and outbound on the next plane. Stupid shit like not drinking enough water and passing out from heat stroke, concealing injuries, not reporting broken gear, or not keeping your kit in working order can get people killed. It's as simple as that.
The only place too much lube is going to hurt anything in in the firing pin channel. Spraying everything in the lower group may not add much in the way of benefits but it isn't going to hurt anything either.
Family member's Glock 21 started getting consistent light primer strikes, this was the culprit.
Beyond that, I probably over lubricate guns, I spray down the internals, rub down the gun with excess lubricant on the heads, anywhere there's metal on metal contact, etc, and then wipe down the exterior.
You might get some slight smoke from a bit of lubricant getting burnt up worst case scenario (but again, as a side note to re-emphasize, do not get it in the firing pin channel), but, it really in my experience over lubricating or well lubricating a gun cuts down on cleaning time, and you can use a bounty paper towel to wipe off 98% (usually 100%, but I figured I'd fact 2%, because sometimes the feed ramp on pistol barrels needs a bit more attention) of the carbon/unburnt powder, rather than a solvent and a good scrubbing tool to get off built up carbon off of bone dry metal.
Makes life easy in my experience.
ETA: I didn't mean that was the only benefit of lubricating a gun, just one of the reasons I "over lubricate", because I don't really see a problem, also at the end of the day, it's a machine, what gun, car, automated, mechanical tool does not run better without more lubricant to smooth metal on metal friction, allowing a machine to operate more smoothly, and also reduces wear?
I just don't get the "don't lubricate the gun" mentality at all. But I also only have experience in the region I live in, and am not familiar with every gun known to man, but, those are generalities that I feel pretty safe saying.
I would likely maintain my handguns differently if I used them differently.
Numerous allegations have been made that defective Glocks were fixed en masse for le agencies without public announcement by Glock. Including a full time Glock employee stationed at the NYPD firing range.
I do have one Glock that I lubricate. It doesn't function dry. Gen 2 21.
John_Wayne777
01-12-11, 07:16
It's true that Glock does not produce "perfection" and that at least segments of the company have behaved like royal assclowns when problems have arisen with their imperfect products...
...but that doesn't really have much relation to properly lubricating a Glock pistol. All handguns, even Glocks, are more likely to work properly when they are properly lubricated. Thus it would behoove someone who is interested in using a Glock for personal defense to lubricate their Glock as instructed in the manual.
He's wrong. I have a Gen4 Glock 17 and the picture is the same.
http://img269.imageshack.us/img269/1050/manual3.jpg
http://img405.imageshack.us/img405/7683/manual4p.jpg
http://img189.imageshack.us/img189/2869/manual5.jpg
http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/7118/manual1.jpg
Maybe there are different issues.
CumbiaDude
01-12-11, 18:36
Thanks for the added pix, Swatieson! Looks the same, overall. Drop of oil on the "ceiling" of the slide, the rails and rail channels, the barrel, the locking area of the barrel, the top shoulder, and down the trigger connector area. :)
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