View Full Version : User Feedback Needed On MR556A1
Any feedback on this platform from real users/owners? I do understand the differences in gas/piston operation, but would like to know how HK's run at it in this platform is going.
If you have one what do you like or dislike about the HK556A1 over other PISTON systems?
How is your barrel and accuracy? Here is a quote from HK's product page.
" But unlike the HK416, the MR556A1 does not use a chrome-lined barrel. Chrome-lining can sometimes mask bore imperfections and negatively affect accuracy. For the new series of Heckler & Koch semi-automatic MR rifles, HK designers and engineers believe best accuracy comes with an unlined bore.
Used with the HK Free Floating Rail System, the barrel does not touch the handguard, ensuring the barrel is truly free-floating for maximum accuracy.
The unchromed barrel has an internal profile of 6 lands and grooves with a 1 in 7 inch (178 mm) twist. It is also moderately “swagged” with a slightly smaller internal diameter at the muzzle end than the chamber end. This feature has a positive effect on bullet accuracy and velocity. The thick, heavy contour 16.5-inch MR556A1 barrel also contributes to its excellent accuracy. "
http://www.hk-usa.com/civilian_products/mr556_general.asp
Thank you for your time and input.
Robb Jensen
01-15-11, 11:46
I know of no one in the USA that even has one yet. I know we have some on order. I think they're supposed to sale for SCAR money ($3K).
I know of no one in the USA that even has one yet. I know we have some on order. I think they're supposed to sale for SCAR money ($3K).
Ok good info! Thanks. I ASSumed they were all ready on the market. When you get them in could you give us an update on them and your impressions please.
Thanks for your time.
From the specs on paper and the rumored price point, I can't think of any reason to buy that thing.
variablebinary
01-15-11, 20:18
Looks like HK updated their site as a precursor to SHOT.
I wonder if it is a nitride barrel or just chromemoly deal
It is still 8.6lbs, which is disgusting.
Unless you're an HK collector I can't see any reason for someone's personal weapon to be a 416 derivative. At the price point compared to performance point its not worth it.
A direct descendent of the HK416, the MR556A1 is a semi-automatic rifle developed by Heckler & Koch as a premium level commercial/civilian firearm with match rifle capability. Like the HK416, the MR556A1 is a major product improvement over conventional AR-type carbines and rifles.
This is a round about way to say it's like the HK416, only not as good.
The MR556A1 also has a Picantinny rail machined into the top of its upper receiver for mounting optics and mechanical sights. Unlike earlier prototypes, major subassemblies, including the MR556A1 upper receiver/barrel assembly, are fully interchangeable with other high quality AR-style firearms. MR556A1 upper receiver kits can be used to retrofit competing legacy AR systems.
We couldn't import the MR223, so we had to make it here, rather than buying CMT receivers that took pmags and using the uppers we are making for the IAR, we went through the extra effort to make our rifles nearly as shitty as the MR223 you find in Europe, that is if you have $4,000 to spend on a boat anchor.
But unlike the HK416, the MR556A1 does not use a chrome-lined barrel. Chrome-lining can sometimes mask bore imperfections and negatively affect accuracy. For the new series of Heckler & Koch semi-automatic MR rifles, HK designers and engineers believe best accuracy comes with an unlined bore.
No chrome for you, because you suck, and we hate you.
The unchromed barrel has an internal profile of 6 lands and grooves with a 1 in 7 inch (178 mm) twist. It is also moderately “swagged” with a slightly smaller internal diameter at the muzzle end than the chamber end. This feature has a positive effect on bullet accuracy and velocity. The thick, heavy contour 16.5-inch MR556A1 barrel also contributes to its excellent accuracy.
We were too lazy to trim down the barrels more, because you suck, and we hate you.
Designed to function with a wide variety of high quality 5.56 x 45 mm ammunition, the MR556A1 uses a C.I.P. dimensioned chamber (a chamber with dimensions specified by the Commission Internationale Permanente).The MR556A1 also functions reliably with most quality Caliber .223 Remington ammunition.
If I'm reading this right, they're not chambering it for 5.56 NATO.
The MR556A1 rifle is now available. An accessory MR556A1 Upper Receiver Kit will be available at a later date.
May all you victories be final!
@armakraut
+1 on the chrome. While it is true that barrels made of one uniform material tend to be favored by match shooters as they broadly speaking tend to be more uniform on the inside, chrome lined bores are plenty accurate. All my chrome bored weapons are sub MOA with their preferred loads.
variablebinary
01-16-11, 03:04
Some things that caught my attention
MR556
http://www.hk-usa.com/-images/products/mr556/mr556_lg_4.jpg
16" HK416
http://www.hk-usa.com/-images/products/hk416/lg_hk416_5.jpg
-Fixed HK416 sights, which I prefer over the folding sights
-HK416 grip, compared to tango down, which was shown in earlier pics
-Proper HK416 mag compared to low cap mags in previous pics
As for the MR556 blurb, here is a summary without the fluff
-Made from German and American parts. Good!
-German made Cold Hammer forged barrel!
-No Chrome lining
-Super HBAR. Lame
-Two Stage Trigger
-Extended tactical latch charging handle
-Stock can be locked down and wobble free
-HK take down pins to improve upper and lower mating up
-Wylde like chamber to ensure function with 5.56 and .223 ammo
-Works with all AR15 lowers
-Uppers will be sold later
My guess on street price after the hk fans get their fill: $2500
the MR223 available here in europe is ridiculously heavy... :rolleyes:
as heavy as the 308 version...
-Wylde like chamber to ensure function with 5.56 and .223 ammo
weak...
variablebinary
01-16-11, 03:50
weak...
It's not a bad idea, considering 90% of the gun buying population can't tell the difference between their asshole, .223 and 5.56
It's not a bad idea, considering 90% of the gun buying population can't tell the difference between their asshole, .223 and 5.56
Not too long ago another soldier swore to me up and down that .223 and 5.56 are completely identical.
MR556A1 Presentation:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tjq0lvEmwTk
Thanks for your opinions.
So they are going after the match rifle market with this rifle. So there is also going to be a MR762, going after the REPR maybe?
In that vid, maybe he should think of a better place to rest his right thumb.
Magic_Salad0892
01-16-11, 10:39
I can't see why I'd buy this over an KAC SR-15 E3, or LMT MRP.
However, I light barrelled 10.5'' gun would be sweet.
They should have concentrated on making a semiauto civilian version of the HK416 that was identical to the military issue 14.5" barrel except it was semiauto only and had a 16" barrel--a rifle that can equal the HK416's reliability and durability in harsh environments with minimal care--even if civilians never run it that way.
This gun should have been to the Military Issue HK416 what the Colt 6920 is to an M4.
I am very glad that I already have my HK416 upper.
-No Chrome lining
This is a mistake. Unless they have some proprietary lining that manages the same, an unlined barrel doesn't offer the durrability of its military counterpart.
-Super HBAR.
Big mistake. I would think most buyers want something closer to M4 weight.
-Two Stage Trigger
Is it as reliable and durrable as its military counterpart? If not it doesn't belong there.
-Wylde like chamber to ensure function with 5.56 and .223 ammo
Dealkiller for me. I want something that I know can function with milsurp 5.56mm. Wylde chambered guns have been known to sometimes have problems with some ammo.
Why buy that when you can buy this (http://www.hkparts.net/shop/pc/HK-416-14-5-Upper-Kit-Exc-Shape-132p1551.htm) (the way you want it) for a little more? I would rather spend 4K on a 416 upper than 3K on the MR556A1
Why buy that when you can buy this (http://www.hkparts.net/shop/pc/HK-416-14-5-Upper-Kit-Exc-Shape-132p1551.htm) (the way you want it) for a little more? I would rather spend 4K on a 416 upper than 3K on the MR556A1
I don't know about yours, but my budget says there's a big difference between $3K & $4K!
For that kind of money, I'd rather get the KAC SR15E3 and a pile of ammo components and maybe some time with somebody who can show me how the adults use ARs
I don't know about yours, but my budget says there's a big difference between $3K & $4K!
For that kind of money, I'd rather get the KAC SR15E3 and a pile of ammo components and maybe some time with somebody who can show me how the adults use ARs
Not saying I would buy an HK. Just saying if I had to have one I wouldn't settle for an overpriced crap copy.
BufordTJustice
01-16-11, 12:52
weak...
That's some well-placed juvenile humor. :D
Trashy barrel.
Spend $3K and then another $3K to reconfigure it to proper HK416 specs and have $6K in a gun that has very little benefits over a standard M4.
variablebinary
01-16-11, 15:19
Also note, that a 16" MR556 is only two ounces heavier than a 16" HK416, so there isn't a huge difference.
Before having a firm opinion, I'll wait till some people buy the MR556 and start giving real feedback.
I've shot the HK 416 a few times, and it does feel porky, but it also worked great.
Hunter Rose
01-16-11, 15:40
Where's everyone getting the "Wylde" chambering from? All the literature says is that it handles 5.56x45mm ammo based on CIP dimensions. CIP is just a proof houses that says civilian firearms can handle a max pressure for their chambering. Wikipedia (the source of all true knowledge:D) says CIP .223 max pressure is the same as .556 NATO max pressure. I interprit the HK site as the MR556A1 being chambered in 5.56 and just proofed to international civilian standards for 5.56/.223.
I may be wrong, but I think people are jumping to conclusions that it is intermediately chambered.
The MR556 is much heavier than the 14.5'' 416, 416N or IAR
Regular 416's are reasonably lightweight (7.75 lbs) the IAR is 7.9 lbs.
MR556 is 8.6 pounds. Beefcake!
variablebinary
01-16-11, 16:14
The MR556 is much heavier than the 14.5'' 416, 416N or IAR
Regular 416's are reasonably lightweight (7.75 lbs) the IAR is 7.9 lbs.
MR556 is 8.6 pounds. Beefcake!
No, the MR556 is not much heavier and the the 416 is not reasonably lightweight in any configuration other than the 10.39" model which is 7.21lbs
The 14.49" HK416 used by many foreign military units is 8.24 lbs, and the 16.5" model is 16.5" 8.4 lbs. This is direct from HK's own marketing material.
These are the actual weights from the literature the HK supplied the military.
http://cdn5.thefirearmsblog.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/hk_iar_1-tfb.jpg
Backed up by the real HK website.
http://www.heckler-koch.de/HKWebText/detailPara/1928/337/4/19/338
variablebinary
01-16-11, 16:40
These are the actual weights from the literature the HK supplied the military.
http://cdn5.thefirearmsblog.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/hk_iar_1-tfb.jpg
Backed up by the real HK website.
http://www.heckler-koch.de/HKWebText/detailPara/1928/337/4/19/338
There is two points, but I think people that stare at the german site and American site long enough will see it
Bottom line, overall shooters can expect a naked MR556 to weigh .76lbs more than a naked 16" HK416
I regard the HK 416 to be too heavy in anything other than 10.39" form, and will feel the same way about the MR556.
If HK sells a 10.39" upper, I will buy an MR556 SBR it, and get an upper for it as well. I can't see HK getting this down this year.
we went through the extra effort to make our rifles nearly as shitty as the MR223 you find in Europe,
Educate me, what is so shitty in MR223 sold in Europe?
variablebinary
01-16-11, 21:01
Educate me, what is so shitty in MR223 sold in Europe?
I'm curious too.
That would like calling a Colt MT6400C shitty because it was made to deal with firearms regulations.
Educate me, what is so shitty in MR223 sold in Europe?
Probably not the best choice of words on my part.
The MR223 has a barrel nearly a pound heavier than found on the regular 416. I've seen a number of European members on HKpro have gunsmiths turn the barrel profile down at their own expense. The Gas block also lacks the bayonet lug. The rear pin is also offset to prevent either the upper or lower being used with standard AR15 uppers and lowers. This is the only thing they fixed on the US release, primarily because they were forced to domestically produce the receiver anyway. Hi-Cap receivers are non importable to the USA unless they are for government use.
It still runs as good as a 416, but it's way too beefy. I'm sort of not interested in spending $2,500 on a rifle that I'd need to send to a gunsmith to have material removed from the barrel in order to use it.
I'm curious too.
That would like calling a Colt MT6400C shitty because it was made to deal with firearms regulations.
Another term for accidentally shooting yourself in the foot should be called pulling a "Blue Label Special."
As for the Wylde chamber, in looking at their wedsite rather than copy what I read posted in this thread--which may or may not be correct on this issue--the website describes the chamber as:
"Designed to function with a wide variety of high quality 5.56 x 45 mm ammunition, the MR556A1 uses a C.I.P. dimensioned chamber (a chamber with dimensions specified by the Commission Internationale Permanente)"
I think I jumped we jumped the gun on the gun not being 5.56mm NATO chambered. This whole CIP thing seems to be some type of certifcation or standards process.
Nonetheless, I think some of the other criticisms of the gun have merit.
Educate me, what is so shitty in MR223 sold in Europe?
it's a little piece of art 200% reliable but
- non standard upper receiver
- non standard bolt carrier
- non standard muzzle thread
- doesnt take other handguards
- polymer dust cover (thanks HK for the huge weight saving)
- iron sights sold separately (at least here in Italy)
- civilian receiver extension
- proprietary spring and buffer (? just a rumor I dont know if it's true)
- .223 chamber
- useless bull barrel
- expensive replacement parts
- the prize...come on...2800 Euro for all the above?
I'll stick with a cheaper sabre/colt/bushy/norinco and customize it myself
the MR308 instead is interesting :)
it's a little piece of art 200% reliable but
- non standard upper receiver
As HK416 is
- non standard bolt carrier
As HK416 is
- non standard muzzle thread
This is shitty.
- doesnt take other handguards
As HK416 is
- polymer dust cover (thanks HK for the huge weight saving)
As HK416 is
- iron sights sold separately (at least here in Italy)
So what? Lot of rifles is sold w/o iron sights
- civilian receiver extension
So what?
- proprietary spring and buffer (? just a rumor I dont know if it's true)
Exactly like in HK416 - actually HDTP buffer and stronger springs are now one of most "cool" AR15 upgrades.
- .223 chamber
Not true. Rifle is marked as .223rem, but chamber is 5.56. Exactly same case as with SL-8. Chamber is specified by CIP requirements for 5.56x45 round (european companies use CIP specification that is NATO wide, while SAAMI is US only).
- useless bull barrel
Useless? Mine is quite heavy, but seem to shoot straight. When I decide it's too heavy or too long I will cut or reprofile it. Yours does not shoot - I think you must make warranty claim!
- expensive replacement parts
Parts for my Audi are expensive as well. Wish I got Fiat Panda instead. Luckily seem that I barely need any spare parts for both my Audi and MR223.
- the prize...come on...2800 Euro for all the above?
Expensive - yes. Show me cheap, quality AR15 in EU.
I'll stick with a cheaper sabre/colt/bushy/norinco and customize it myself
I'm sure you will be 110% happy with any of those.
But still I do not see anything shitty in MR223 beside barrel thread and fact that not everyone can afford it.
the MR308 instead is interesting :)
Why? It has even more "shitty" feartures than MR223 - add non-standard magazines here :no:
upper: I meant that it's not compatible with standard lowers due to the offest rear pin. the HK416 drop in perfectly.
bolt carrier: I meant it's not even compatible with the HK416
civilian RE = need to buy a new RE to install most of the stock out there
iron sights: an average AR cost about 2100 here...for 2800 I'd like at least the ironsights but that's just me maybe
expensive parts: lets say you damage the railed handguard.. you're forced to call HK and pay what they ask.
proprietary spring and buffer: springs wear out over time...again you have to call HK and pay what they ask.
bull barrel: I find a 1'' barrel still useless on a tactical/combat style carbine..you're not gaining anything in terms of accuracy
btw I've never said it's shitty, I'm just saying that for 2800 is not worth the headache of getting the MR due to the amount of proprietary parts and limited modularity & parts supply.
for that price I'd get a SOCOM with a Noveske barrel, or get a Colt a customize it myself within the 2800 price range
yes I find the MR308 interesting... already there isnt a standard between the few AR10style rifles available in EU...for example the AR10, KAC SR25, Oberland and HK all use their own magazine.
Kaasselslay
01-17-11, 12:25
So, who has ever shot an MR223?
upper: I meant that it's not compatible with standard lowers due to the offest rear pin. the HK416 drop in perfectly.
Why would I bother with that? I got complete rifle, lower plus upper.
For US readers: by European Firearms Directive even barrel or bolt are considered "a firearm" - so if I would need to have separate uppers for one lower, I would need separate permits for all uppers and lower, plus upper permits are for designated lower, not any lower. It counter-productive then to have If uppers only, complete riffles cost effectively same. If I have 2 AR15 and I will miss-match uppers and lowers - this will be illegal firearms manufacturing. Some users do not care - but this is general way it work in EU.
bolt carrier: I meant it's not even compatible with the HK416
Why would it be? Do you want to illegally convert MR223 into machine gun? MR223 was designed to fulfil legal requirements of German Criminal Police (BKA) in way that prevent easy conversion into machine gun by using HK416 parts. HK had choice - follow BKA guidelines or do not make MR223 at all. They also had choice of following AFT guidelines and 922r or do not make MR556 at all. I'm quite OK with what they choose to do.
If I would legally own machine gun then I would got HK416 instead - easy :thank_you2:
civilian RE = need to buy a new RE to install most of the stock out there
Or buy stock for commercial size. Magpul makes quite good stuff I heard :D Any other worthy stocks (Vltor A5, UBR, ect...) came with their own extensions.
iron sights: an average AR cost about 2100 here...for 2800 I'd like at least the ironsights but that's just me maybe
That is more than I expected. You can have decent AR15 (KISS with plastic handguards tec.) with good barrel and iron sights for 1500 here (no... not Norinco ;) ) while it's some 2700 for HK.
expensive parts: lets say you damage the railed handguard.. you're forced to call HK and pay what they ask.
You can always go with Norinco if this is problem. When I got HK, I know I will have to pay for HK. If I would be able to get KAC, I would pay KAC prices for stuff.
proprietary spring and buffer: springs wear out over time...again you have to call HK and pay what they ask.
Or take Wolff increased power spring.
bull barrel: I find a 1'' barrel still useless on a tactical/combat style carbine..you're not gaining anything in terms of accuracy
USMC would disagree. M27 IAR seem to be "very combat" stuff - uses same profile and length barrel as MR223. I agree that MR223 is not lightweight carbine. My, with all ARFcom stuff on it (FSC91, MBUD, CompM4S, BAD, AFG1, BCH Mod.3, VTAC light mount, Walther Tactical Light, MI sling adapter), weights 4.700g (10lbs 6oz) w/o mag. But I'm Botasky style of guy ;)
By the way, interesting theory on barrel thickness has nothing to do with accuracy. Some would disagree.
btw I've never said it's shitty, I'm just saying that for 2800 is not worth the headache of getting the MR due to the amount of proprietary parts and limited modularity & parts supply.
for that price I'd get a SOCOM with a Noveske barrel, or get a Colt a customize it myself within the 2800 price range
You do not like it or can not afford it. OK. Just say so, but do not create problems when there are none. You are free to not buy HK, as I'm free to not buy Sabre Defense. But I do not claim SD to be bad, just because I do not like or want it. Quite contrary I think that this is top notch stuff and putting it in line with Norinco is offending SD quality.
So, who has ever shot an MR223?
I had opportunity to shot it from time to time. Have one for almost 2 years now, only few thousands rounds trough it (including some classes), but seem to work despite all shitty features:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=voTJYOWlgSk&feature=related
Some more of my lame shooting there as well.
Why would I bother with that? I got complete rifle, lower plus upper.
For US readers: by European Firearms Directive even barrel or bolt are considered "a firearm" - so if I would need to have separate uppers for one lower, I would need separate permits for all uppers and lower, plus upper permits are for designated lower, not any lower. It counter-productive then to have If uppers only, complete riffles cost effectively same. If I have 2 AR15 and I will miss-match uppers and lowers - this will be illegal firearms manufacturing. Some users do not care - but this is general way it work in EU.
well...went to a IPSC style competition and a friend of mine had his MR...he broke the trigger in the middle of stage #2... hey these things happens (it was an aftermarket part btw)... if the upper were standard he could have mounted it on my lower and finish the match...nothing illegal about it
ETA: I think I've hijacked this thread enough...sorry OP
USMC would disagree. M27 IAR seem to be "very combat" stuff - uses same profile and length barrel as MR223. I agree that MR223 is not lightweight carbine. My, with all ARFcom stuff on it (FSC91, MBUD, CompM4S, BAD, AFG1, BCH Mod.3, VTAC light mount, Walther Tactical Light, MI sling adapter), weights 4.700g (10lbs 6oz) w/o mag. But I'm Botasky style of guy ;)
The IAR has a lighter profile barrel and is 3/4 of a pound lighter despite having a longer handguard.
(SMGlee picture)
http://photos.imageevent.com/smglee/ss10/huge/P1020957.jpg
You guys also have to remember that per the video on page one, the US MR556A1 has standard milspec pins so the offset HK pins don't matter when mating a Hk MR556 upper to what ever lower you want. It is not a proprietary part, any lower will work.
Guess it's just a waiting game to see the first few on the market here in the States.
The IAR has a lighter profile barrel and is 3/4 of a pound lighter despite having a longer handguard.
(SMGlee picture)
http://photos.imageevent.com/smglee/ss10/huge/P1020957.jpg
Naked IAR is 3.9kg, naked MR223 is 3.7kg - 200g difference make up for longer handguard, sights and grip on IAR.
Maybe 2lbs worth of gadgets make my MR223 heavier than IAR :thank_you2:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v286/montrala/MR223/MR223_3.jpg
Anyway, some MR556A1 first hand experiences should start to come in from SHOT.
Naked IAR is 3.7 kg (7.9 lb) also, but it has a steel bayonet lug, flash hider and longer handguard. It's essentially a stock HK416N with a long handguard.
Listed US weight for our MR556A1 is 3.9 kg (8.6 lb). Currently the 14.5 variant is 3.49 kg (7.69 lb) and the 16'' 416N is 3.56 kg (7.85 lb).
If they ever sell 14.5 uppers, I'll buy that variant and pin the flash hider... or maybe a 10.5 inch once I get my LMT SBR from Grant. :D
variablebinary
01-18-11, 04:48
From SHOT.
Have to admit, there is some sex appeal to the 416 and the MR556
http://www.gunblast.com/images/SHOT2011/Day0/DSC02675.JPG
Summary:
What we seem to agree on:
It is heavy. HK416 is heavy, M27 IAR is heavy (for AR15, but quite ok for IAR), MR223 is heavy and MR556 is heavy as well. For me it's ok, because I like rifle to be balanced forward a little and I can still lift up so much as 10 or 11 lbs - but this is personal preference.
What is inevitably crappy in MR223:
Trigger. It is plain "mil-spec" AR15 trigger - only worse that one that I got in Stag for example. HK could do better in "Match Rifle". But MR556 is advertised to have 2-stage trigger - HK learns? Other crappy feature of MR223 that is not present on MR556 is M15x1 barrel thread instead of 1/2"x28tpi. Offset pins are no problem for me (given EU gun laws) but this important matter for US market was corrected as well. Looks like only real downside is no choice on barrel.
What I would like HK change in my MR223:
- give me IAR handguard!
What I do not agree on:
I do not understand whining about non-standard lower receiver. MR556 is supposed to be civi version of HK416, not "next piston AR". It is quite natural that it carries over HK416 lower receiver. As it carries non-standard upper receiver, barrel extension, barrel nut, bolt, carrier, etc. It does not take all AR15 mags? Sure, HK416 was developed to take STANAG mags, not AR15 mags. There are several orther systems that do use STANAG mags, while can not utilise all AR15 mags. That is why STANAG was invented in first place.
Problem with HK416 and MR223/556 is that it is technically too close to AR15, so people think about it in AR15 "LEGO bricks" terms. While in fact it is more like what F2000/FS2000 or SCAR/civi SCAR are. Nobody seem to have problem with FS2000 or SCAR lack of compatibility with AR15 - they either like them or not. People did not get HK SL-8 becouse it was so great civi self loader. It was just as close to G36 as it could be in given time and law regulations.
Closest example to HK416/MR556/MR223 ideology seem to be SR16/SR15 - great rifle, full of proprietary parts but everyone seem to accept fact that KAC is KAC, not just "another AR15".
Hunter Rose
01-18-11, 18:47
Greg Bell mentioned this and got me thinking, maybe view the MR556from another perspective, i.e viewing it as DMR. If viewed in this respect, to me it makes a lot more sense. HK's info release so far has really emphasized the "Match Rifle" aspect of MR556. I have a secret suspicion this may have been a part of HK-USA getting HK Germany to sign off on this:
"No, Karl, it is not a 416 so don't worry about exporting weapons of war. It is a "Match Rifle" meant for sport and matches. Even says it in the name."
Anyway, if it turns out to be extremely accurate and live up to the Match aspect it's not that off the mark for a DMR, and is pretty ready to go out of the box. Add optic of your choice and run with it. Plenty of people would recommend a Noveske 16" or 18" rifle w/ unlined SS barrel for this purpose, and those run around $2300. Most seem to think street price will be about $2500 for the MR556 after the intial price gouging dies down.
As for the barrel being unlined, HK does use arguably the best barrel steel in the world in their rifles. HK91s and HK93s were all unlined, and they're known for having long barrel life. Plenty of those have been used as machineguns with sear packs too and they last thousands and thousands of rounds.
So, while the MR556 isn't being released in the exact configuration most probably wanted it in (myself included) it will hardly be an unmitigated disaster. Yes, it is expensive, but you will most likely get an extremely accurate, extremely reliable rifle that really doesn't need much out of the box.
Granted, the above only works if the MR556 proves to be very accurate. We'll see.
Closest example to HK416/MR556/MR223 ideology seem to be SR16/SR15 - great rifle, full of proprietary parts but everyone seem to accept fact that KAC is KAC, not just "another AR15".
KAC actually included tangible benefits in the SR15E3 rifle. Not to mention that even if the HK "street price" is only $2500, the KAC rifle can be had for around $2K. Also, the HK seems to be marketed as a precision type weapon vs. a "fighting" carbine role of the SR15E3.
The biggest problem is not the brand, features, specs, etc. but instead the price point. It offers nothing over other rifles that are (alot) cheaper.
I have never seen so much HK hate in one post ever.:rolleyes:
Why don't you hate on robinson arms or something.
variablebinary
01-19-11, 01:55
Good read.
http://larrycorreia.wordpress.com/20...d-we-hate-you/
This wasn't all that funny the first time you posted it.
Even less funny the 2nd time.
MichaelVain
01-19-11, 18:52
It's hardly truth, there are so many inaccuracies in that post.
Not sure why you insist on propagating such nonsense.
The last company literature I saw on the HK416 cited its accuracy as ~4MOA. To me this is unacceptable, whether its for personal or duty use. Maybe there are easy fixes out there to get the accuracy up but if there are not, very lame.
By all means MichaelVain, apparently being well versed on the subject, please outline the inaccuracies in that post. The floor is yours.
I started this thread and would really appreciate it if the who's weewee is bigger stays out.
Please refer to post one on page one if you have forgot and then post your relevance to that topic please.
variablebinary
01-20-11, 05:18
The last company literature I saw on the HK416 cited its accuracy as ~4MOA. To me this is unacceptable, whether its for personal or duty use. Maybe there are easy fixes out there to get the accuracy up but if there are not, very lame.
I've shot a 10" 416 off a bench. It was about 2MOA with M855 in my hands at 50 yards, which is about the same as I shoot with a 6920
I've shot a 10" 416 off a bench. It was about 2MOA with M855 in my hands at 50 yards, which is about the same as I shoot with a 6920
I've shot my MR223 sitting, from bag filled with sawdust, only front supported.
I used Amipoint CompM4S as sighting device. It is slight problem as I have astigmatism, so dot is more like comet or starburst to me. This was not accuracy testing, I was just checking if ammo id good enough for 3Gun use, Aimpoint was zeroed for 50m.
100m (110yard), RUAG 55gr FMJ bulk ammo:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v286/montrala/Range%20reports/RUAG100m3.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v286/montrala/Range%20reports/RUAG100m2.jpg
This is definitely not what this rifle is capable of with match ammo and decent optic. I actually expect sub-moa when I'll put some optic here and use 69+gr HPBT ammo.
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