View Full Version : AK bolt over malfunction
Well had my first problem with my Draco. I had multiple "bolt over malfunctions". I'm thinking it was the magazine but just not sure. I shot over two rounds last week and had this happen with two out of ten mags. Put those aside and the rest others were fine. Cleaned the two problem childs up. One of the two, had the same problem as before and then another that had not given any problems before.
What is the "common" cause for this in the Ak system???? The Draco was clean and oiled. I only put hundred rounds thru it tonight. But other than those mulfunctions, it was a blast.
I feel its weak springs in the mags, but please give your input and ideas. I'm open.
Thanks
Brad
Heavy Metal
01-18-11, 19:54
Could be a ride height issue with your rear mag catch. It the mag isn't held high enough in the rear you will get what you describe.
Sounds like a Century Arms problem.
I don't plan on sending it back to century arms. I loaded a mag to see if I could
make it happen again. The bolt would not go al the way forward. I tried the mags in question in a wasr and they work fine. It maybe an issue with the Draco itself. I was already planning to send it in to Rifle Dynamics after awhile. But now it looks likes it will be sooner than I thought. I really don't want century dicking with it .
sidecarnutz
01-19-11, 11:20
I had one I built that tried to over ride like that. And the mag was fitting snug in the well and no looseness in the latch to mag fit.
I wound up removing the trigger gaurd and grinding material off the plate the TG sits against to allow the rear of the mag to sit higher into the receiver. That meant I also had to add weldment to the bottom of the mag catch to raise it too. Then test fitted the parts with machine screws and nuts and played with it one more time until the mag sat high enough that the bottom of the bolt was catching the rounds well to shove them forwards.
Had no problem cycling the bolt afterwards. So that was the fix it needed.
On yours you mention not even being able to cycle the bolt with other mags in it. That is really an odd issue.
Who manufactured your receiver?
ETA.
Have you cleaned the mags inside? Sticky cosmo residue will gum them up. I would try more mags that are known to be OK in other rifles.
I've cleaned all my mags, due to followers getting hung up awhile back. That was my first.thought. Just thinking, I wonder if the feed ramp is not right. I don't know much about AK's so I pulling straws here. I need to compare it to my wasr. I know that's not the best to compare to but its never giving me major issues.
On the make of the receiver, all it says is Draco-C and imported by century. I double check tonight.
sidecarnutz
01-19-11, 12:01
The feed ramps work best if they have a slight chamfer even across their whole surface side to side. Then they will feed HP ammo with no problem. occassionally you'll see a ramp that needs chamfered. Most already have it. A dremel tool and a small 1/8" diamond dust barrel shaped bit can be used to gently chamfer that surface. Just go back and forth lightly. Let the bit do the work. You want just a 1/32" wide surface chamfered. No need for a widow's peak shape. You don't want that much material removed. "Even" side to side is OK. You're just removing that sharp edge there.
With no chamfer, the square edge on the ramp will often catch the nose of an HP round. Snags it just so like a fingernail.
But even with no chamfer, FMJ rounds normally feed just fine. Soft points get shaved a bit, but feed OK. Its HP rounds that snag there with no chamfer.
ETA. The reason I asked about who made the receiver. If it is not an NDS, it may have an OOS dimension and need parts hand fitted to work well. On the AK kits I built myself I have found OOS problems with the TG and rear trunnion dovetail height for the spring loaded guide rod tail piece. I have found the tail pieces to vary in height as well needing changes to fit right. Just because AKs have loose tolerances doen't mean that ALL the parts work together. Some require hand fitting due to tolerance stacking issues.
Draco's have factory Romanian receivers not US Made.
They aren't built in the US from parts kits.
Other than that I have no idea why you are having the bolt over issues, but wish you much luck in resolving them and am interested to hear what the cause is.
Rd62
Have you had a chance to take yours to the range? If so, any issues? I've already decided to send to Jim Fuller to go thru it and correct any thing else to might be wrong. But I would like to know what's causing this issue. I guess it could be the ammo combined with the ramp. The guys that were shooting with me last night brought their own ammo. One who had the most issues told me today that the ammo he had was a hollow point.(just got off the phone with him) I had standard.
Rd62
Have you had a chance to take yours to the range? If so, any issues? I've already decided to send to Jim Fuller to go thru it and correct any thing else to might be wrong. But I would like to know what's causing this issue. I guess it could be the ammo combined with the ramp. The guys that were shooting with me last night brought their own ammo. One who had the most issues told me today that the ammo he had was a hollow point.(just got off the phone with him) I had standard.
Unfortunately, no.
Between weather, work and family obligations I just haven't had the time yet.
For shame I know....
Hopefully this weekend or the first of next week.
I'll let ya know how it goes.
Just curious but what type mags were you using?
Also are you sure it's bolt override? Could it be short stroking?
I've heard of some short stroking with the Draco when new. Seems most cleared up with additional rounds. I know mine has a fair amount of hammer drag. This may explain why the mags work in the other gun too. You may wanna try another hammer, polishing the one you have, or replacing the FCG if you plan to SBR it anyway.
Just a thought...
RD62
You might be on to something here. I guess I could be wrong with my malfunction terms. The bolt was on top of the round, but that could be caused by the bolt not coming back far enough to catch the rear of the round. I'll look into it tomorrow. This is why I ask questions here.
Did you find anything out?
Haven't been back to the range. But I did load up "known" go mags with ball ammo and it cycles fine. I loaded the wolf hollow points and had issues. When I pull the bolt all the way to the rear and let it go the rounds doesn't make it in the chamber, the bolt is over the round and gets pretty dinged up. I will do it a again and take pictures.
sidecarnutz
01-22-11, 18:49
Look at the back edge of the feed ramp. Chamfered? Or a hard 90 degree angle there?
sidecarnutz
01-22-11, 22:15
OK. My suggestion would be to look at how much kinetic energy the carrier loses when riding over the hammer.
I had a PSL whose bolt would ride so hard over the hammer that it didn't have enough KE to feed a round on it's way back forward.
Grinding just 1/32" off the hammer face and then polishing it solved the problem.
Good luck. Hope it is just something simple like this.
On the make of the receiver, all it says is Draco-C and imported by century. I double check tonight.
The Draco-C is a parts build contracted by CAI. Draco is straight import model. Only thing the CAI monkeys do is tack the muzzle nut, install G2. My Draco hasn't missed a beat yet. I like to get it smoking and keep it smoking. :D
Nope!
Still having same issues. I'm working out details to send it to Rilfe Dynamics. I want it to be right when I get it registered.
Rd
How's yours? Is it running fine?
Nope!
Still having same issues. I'm working out details to send it to Rilfe Dynamics. I want it to be right when I get it registered.
Rd
How's yours? Is it running fine?
So far so good with Wolf and Golden Tiger ammo, and 5rnd K-Var and 30rnd Euro mags. Zero malfunctions.
Only issue I can find is that my safety lever is incredibly tight. The body of the lever seems to be touching the receiver along it's entire length expect where it bends slightly away due to the point at the end.
Heavy Metal
02-05-11, 12:46
You can adjust the the tension on the safety.
You can adjust the the tension on the safety.
Yea, I know, I've been trying to adjust it but haven't been successful yet.
If you have a tip, I'm all ears.
Heavy Metal
02-05-11, 20:06
Remove top cover, bolt and recoil spring. Rotate safety straight up and down. Bend it away from the reciever.
Make sure you don't inadvertantly sweep the tail ends of the hammer spring off the end of the trigger.
If you do, just take a pair of pliers and put them back on.
Remove top cover, bolt and recoil spring. Rotate safety straight up and down. Bend it away from the reciever.
Make sure you don't inadvertantly sweep the tail ends of the hammer spring off the end of the trigger.
If you do, just take a pair of pliers and put them back on.
I've tried this with no luck so far.
I've put a pretty good amount of force into it, but am afraid of damaging the receiver if I put any more into it.
I need to chuck it in a vice and try again.
I've tried this with no luck so far.
I've put a pretty good amount of force into it, but am afraid of damaging the receiver if I put any more into it.
I need to chuck it in a vice and try again.
Take care. They can snap. I had to replace mine with a Chinese safety..I ordered a Rommy but a Chinese showed up. Eff Military Gun Supply, lousy CS.
Are the safety levers pretty drop in or do they require fitting to the particular rifle/fcg?
Maybe I'll just get a Krebs lever or something...
Are the safety levers pretty drop in or do they require fitting to the particular rifle/fcg?
Maybe I'll just get a Krebs lever or something...
Minor fitting, just a little work with a file as long as the tip of the safety that actually blocks the FCG is long enough. If too short you need to try another safety. The Krebs is very nice but can be wiped off unintentially by gear and may interfere with some right side folding/underfolding stocks.
My draco is almost finished up at Rifle Dynamics. While Dan was reworking it, he notice the head space was not right, the sight tritium and the bolt were not inline. He said "It was a bomb waiting to go off". I mentioned all the issues I had with feeding and rounds going into chamber but not going bang, or not going all the way in and his opinion it was all due this. He also said that most of the Dracos that come through RD have had this problem.
So to all my draco having friends, I would check or have a gun smith check the head space and make sure everything is inline.
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