View Full Version : Any love for Jeep CJs?
I'd love to get an older Jeep CJ, preferably a CJ7. It may be nearly a year before we are ready, in the mean time I'm trying to educate myself as much as possible. Right now I'm a little drawn to the small block Chevy conversions. Any thoughts or tips or advice on what to look for?
It is cheaper to purchase a TJ than to swap an engine into a CJ.
It's also much more reliable.
I sure loved my '77 CJ7 with 304 V8, Edelbrock SP2P aluminum manifold, 4 barrel Holley carb (did have vacuum leak and carb base warp issues), side pipes/mufflers. It had plenty of power but was rough on concrete washboard roads.
Jeepman1320
01-23-11, 20:40
It is cheaper to purchase a TJ than to swap an engine into a CJ.
It's also much more reliable.
How ya figure? Last I checked a basic 350 swap with tbi or propane could be kept in the 3k range...
I drive an '85 scrambler on tons with a 468 BBC... Would not trade it for an LJ unless you threw some serous cash at me.
TJs and LJs are far from ideal, and to make em really work well major suspension modifications must be made. Factory style work well up to 3 inches and moderate trails, but after that long arms and triangulated 4 links are where it's at...
Don Robison
01-23-11, 20:44
I've got a 76 Bronco I built up 18 years ago. After several years of working on it, whenever someone tells me they want to build one, I tell them to build a Jeep. It's cheaper, aftermarket parts are more readily available and they are just as capable.
That said I wouldn't trade my Bronco for a Jeep.:)
Robb Jensen
01-23-11, 21:24
Avoid the 81s. I had a 81 CJ7. It was sort of a transition year for some parts. I drove the hell out of mine breaking all kinds of stuff. Fun but costly.
Thomas M-4
01-23-11, 21:39
I wouldn't swap in a chevy v-8 if you want more performance from your straight 6 there is only one place I would go Hesco
http://www.hesco.us/ They have a very nice shop. And are known for jeep performance.
It is cheaper to purchase a TJ than to swap an engine into a CJ.
It's also much more reliable.
Let me add a bit more for clarification. I'm looking for something older that is easier to maintain. I am completely fed up with trying to maintain an electronically controlled vehicle. And this comes from someone who manufactured automotive electronics for 4 years. I probably would not do the engine swap myself but I love the idea of a mild sb chevy. I have the most experience with sb chevys and 302 fords. If I were to find a good CJ still with a 4 or 6 I would probably leave it as it. I have a lot to dig into before it is time to buy but I've always wanted a CJ. I thought I would start here as this is just about the only forum I visit and I trust the majority of advice I find here. I remember seeing some nice jeeps before in a thread about BOVs, I'll try to find it again.
As always, thanks for the help guys.
I had a 1978 Jeep CJ5 with a 304V8 back when gas was $0.75/gallon. It was easy to work on and was a beast off-road. I think I averaged around 8mpg. I wish I still had it.
Thomas M-4
01-23-11, 22:54
Well if you are dead set on using a chevy v-8 I would suggest a known quality 350ci with vortec heads create motor or low mileage factory motor [good luck with that]. With a stock roller hyd cam or at most towing roller hyd camshaft. With a 570- 670 cfm [street avenger holley carb] I haven't tried the truck avenger it might be worth a try. I wouldn't mess with a regular holley carb never had any luck with them :mad: Find some long tube headers, and install a good HEI ignition system, performer intake manifold will make for a good high torque, peppy motor with out breaking the bank.
Well if you are dead set on using a chevy v-8 I would suggest a known quality 350ci with vortec heads create motor or low mileage factory motor [good luck with that]. With a stock roller hyd cam or at most towing roller hyd camshaft. With a 570- 670 cfm [street avenger holley carb] I haven't tried the truck avenger it might be worth a try. I wouldn't mess with a regular holley carb never had any luck with them :mad: Find some long tube headers, and install a good HEI ignition system, performer intake manifold will make for a good high torque, peppy motor with out breaking the bank.
I like the idea of a sbc, and I've seen some interesting conversions while searching the south east on craigs list but I would most likely stay with the original engine unless I found one that was already swapped out. Just found some aftermarket jeep suppliers, I could build a brand new cj from all the aftermarket parts available, wow. I'll keep looking, thanks.
Thomas M-4
01-24-11, 00:22
I like the idea of a sbc, and I've seen some interesting conversions while searching the south east on craigs list but I would most likely stay with the original engine unless I found one that was already swapped out. Just found some aftermarket jeep suppliers, I could build a brand new cj from all the aftermarket parts available, wow. I'll keep looking, thanks.
Hesco has some nice stuff for sure for a I-6. I have seen funny cars parked in front of there old shop its been a decade since I have been in there old shop I know that they have a new one now. They have the highest reputation in these parts and could probably build anything that you wanted.
Good luck.
oddballmkg
01-24-11, 01:47
I've got a 79 C7 that I've done the engine transmission and running gear swap in. I did the swap about 15 years ago. It's got a 383 small block with about 400 hp. The front end is a Dana 44 out of an old scout with an ARB locker. The rear end is a Ford 9 inch with a Detroit locker. I used a T18 transmission out of an old Ford pick. The transfer case is Dana 300 out of a 1980 CJ. I’ve pretty much used it for only four wheeling/camping. Over the years, I've twisted drive lines in half, 4 sets of front axles, the rear springs where also starting to tear/crack because of the engine torque. And now the frame really needs to be replaced because the front areas where the springs and steering box mount too are cracking out. If where to do it a gain, I would install a 305 small block Chevy with an automatic and a Atlas transfer case with a 4.1 ratio and I would do the same running gear with some type of four link set up. And I would use an after market frame, since the CJ7 have a some what weak frame around the front frame horns. With a 180 hp 305 small block, you would not have enough power to break as much. This would give you about 60 more hp than either the 304 or the 258 straight six and cost less than doing a 360/400 AMC swap. AMC used a lot of different transmission in Jeeps so you’re probably going to have to swap in a transmission that can deal with the hp of the engine you swap in and that will be geared low enough to use it the way you want. For the money, it’s really hard to beat just going out and buying a Rubicon TJ. The windshields wipers, heaters, steering, soft top design, wheel travel and the over all ride in the Rubicon are way better than the CJ. I really do not see where it’s any hard to trouble shot a computer control OB2 car than an older car especially if you have experience with computer components. I have an after market ECU in my car that has about 450 hp that I use a lap top with to tune/control the car with and I do not find it any hard to trouble shot it or my Jeep. To trouble shot an OB2 car all you really need is a cheap lap top and OB2 software along with the cable to connect the lap top to the cars OB2 port. The OB2 software will tell you the system that is bad and all you have to do is trouble shoot that system to find the component that is bad.
Check out Daveysjeeps.com. I would build a salvage title TJ with a GM factory crate engine(290 horse part # NAL-19244450) from Summit Racing. You can find TJ parts under every rock. Advanced Adapters has everything you would need for the swap( also sold at Summit) .
Check out Ebay, for Cj's I got a decent deal on a CJ8 Scrambler that I restored. Toy box jeeps in fla. has some examples of restorations.
Any one thinking of updating their vehicle by installing a different engine, transmission, I would suggest going to some of the off road sites as this is done all the time also call advance adapters as they carry adapters that will allow you to hook up just about any transmission and engine and a lot of time they can even send you a manual with a lot of information. I installed a 5.7 LT-1 engine and 4L60 automatic transmission in an 1979 toyota landcruiser so just about anything can be done.
TJs and LJs are far from ideal, and to make em really work well major suspension modifications must be made. Factory style work well up to 3 inches and moderate trails, but after that long arms and triangulated 4 links are where it's at...
There is no need. Buy a highline hood and fender kit and you can fit 35 inch tires with no lift at all. That suits most peoples purposes just fine.
I put a 350 and a GM SM465 4 speed in my '79 CJ5 about 15 years ago, I also rebuilt my '90 YJ,about 10 years ago, and was going to put the GM parts in it but ended up rebuilding the 258 boring it .060 over, mild cam, Howell GM TBI, SS header etc.... After I did the YJ the first thing I said was I should have put a 350 in it. If your doing a complete tear down its really not that much more, depending on how crazy you want to get which is easy with a 350, to put the GM motor in it espically when a fairly stock 350 has alot more power than a 258. I will eventually go back and put a 350 in the YJ just wish I had saved myself the trouble the first time around. Just my .02, YMMV.
couch_potato
02-20-11, 08:04
I've done a few Jeep builds. Do yourself a favour and forget about the CJ. Replacing worn out shit is an endless cycle; finding the parts to fit is even worse.
I have an '81. Make me an offer. Comes complete with speed holes. Ha, ha, ha.
The 4.0L in the YJ series is twice the engine that the 4.2 was. Have the same thing in my work Cherokees. Properly maintained, they're good for a half-million miles, give or take.
If you absolutely have to have a Jeep, try out the YJ before you go dumping lots of coin into swapping engines.
I would do a portal axle conversion or Unimog axle swap before doing a lift. Ground clearance rocks.
I shall resume my lurking.
I've owned a '49 Jeep wagon (flathead 4!), a '63 Jeep wagon (OHV 230 6), a Land Rover, a '69 F-250 6 banger, and rebuilt a '72 CJ-5 (258 6, 3 speed, posi). from the frame up. Also have a nice '87 Toyota 4 cyl. PU.
With the exception of the F-250 which was a tank, the Toyota is by FAR the best vehicle. As an exasperated friend of mine in the early 70's said sarcastically, 'The joys of owning a jeep!'
My CJ-5 is a fun toy and incredibly good in the snow. Great concept, but iffy execution. Tons of nostalgia and every toddler knows a Jeep when he sees it. I never owned an old Land Cruiser, but if they were made today I'd grab it. As it is my 87 PU is rock solid, very low maintenance, and 100% reliable. I did a lot of bleeding under 4x4s in my day, and now I want boring reliability. The Toyota will definitely outlast me.
BTW there is an incredible video on You Tube about how these little trucks refuse to die. Well worth watching.
gdubyacobb
03-11-11, 00:25
I've got a '79 CJ7, best car I've ever owned. I've put in tons of hours under it, but its never let me down.
But with that said, I got lucky and found one that was 99% stock, no testosterone filled boys had jacked it up.
I've put an '89 YJ body on it and replaced damn near every thing on it. With a HEI distributed I get about 17mpg hwy.
My experience is that parts are easy to come by (years and years and many makes interchangeable, Ford breaks & GM steering etc)
Next to a horse, I reckon its a great SHTF transport.
If you are looking for cheap, stick to the 4.0 YJ. They were designed for the weights of the 4 or 6 cyl and when you swap in a heavier V8 it changes suspension characteristics. Of course if you are a trained driver this may not be an issue, or if you want to spend extra cash on upgrades to suspension(not saying the average Joe can't handle it, but easy is better). But a stock small block Chevy doesn't offer a considerable advantage over the power characteristics of a straight 6 unless you want to spend more to upgrade.
If you are considering this for a survival or SHTF fantasy, a stock rig will out last anything. If it breaks, find a junkyard or abandoned auto store. Can't mail order replacement aftermarket suspension parts when the world is in ruins.
I owned a 93 with the 4.0 HO. I put a SYE on the transfer case, 33in tires, kept the stock rear end ratio because I like its power. It had a small lift from Rancho before I bought it, but all suspension parts could be swapped with stock and still work. I was able to take it over obstacles that these high end offroad shop guys were being winched over. One guy bragged about having just dumbed several thousand into a full coilover set up and powerful 383, but he was the one keeping everyone else waiting every time he had to hook to a tree and get pulled out.
There is a reason these things are so popular, they do what you tell them to. No need to mess with something proven.
It ultimately depends on what you want to do with it. Do you want to just mess around in the woods, or are you looking for that doomsday scenario. I had a ’53 Willys, and I purchased an ’86 CJ7 new. The Willys could climb a wall but the top speed was 55 mph. It was fairly dependable, but when it broke, parts were a little tough to find. The CJ7 was a good all around vehicle – it could climb well, you could go down the highway at speed, it rarely broke but when it did parts were easy to come by. The one thing I didn’t like about it was the computer controlled carb, but that was easily remedied. A friend redid a CJ7 with a fiberglass body and a Chevy SB, but was a big pain. When he finished he was happy, but swore he would never-ever do that again. Lots of special parts. I’m hesitant to purchase a new Jeep with all of the electronics. When you break down – it’s down. There’s no working on electronics by the side of the road, but they’re good for messing around in general. If I ever wanted to prepare a Jeep for that massive emergency, I’d go with a mid-80’s CJ7, replace the plastic valve cover with a metal one, stick with the old carb, and have a spare ing. module.
you could also swap in an ls based motor. you could swap in a 4.8/5.3 with mild cam heads on bolt ons, and get great gas mileage while your at it. my h/c/i silverado runs 10.44 in th 1/4 and i still get 20mpg hw with 3.73 gears.
I love the old Jeep's I grew up with a few buddies who had them, we would trade for a day or two. He would take my motorcycle and I got the Jeep.
Pathfinder Ops
04-10-11, 15:44
Nope I hate 'em........;)
This is how I suffer....
8059
8060
8061
8062
1978 CJ5
Straight 6 cyl 3 speed.
Fold up back seat.
Fiberglass tub.
55K miles on a rebuilt motor.
I bought it 8 years ago on ebay as is for $1500.
It was in Orlando, Fl. I bought a $75 one way plane ticket and took 3 days to drive home. About halfway home it blew a brake line someplace in S.C. but no biggie. Got of the interstate and had it fixed within 2 hours.
It doesn't do much more than 55mph on the road but thats plenty fast enough and going fast isn't really what that sweety was built for.
My wife LOVES it and she looks forward to summer when the top comes off. (The Jeep's not her's ya pigs.....:p).
Pathfinder Ops
04-10-11, 15:45
wow sorry for the huge pics.... I'm not so savvy at this.
CJs are awesome Jeeps, but ya gotta know what to look for. I admit to a bit of bias, being a fan of Fords, but I wouldn't put a SBC in a baby Jeep. Maybe a big Jeep. like a Gladiator or Wagoneer, but even then I'd rather have a 401 AMC V8 for nostalgic reasons. The SBC gets poor gas mileage on the trail and it's heavy. I remember one trip over the Rubicon with a group of guys with CJ8s. I ran my 91 Cherokee (XJ) with the 4.0 straight six. At the end of the day, the CJ8 guys with the SBCs were running around camp making sure everyone had enough gas for the following day, and we'd only made it as far as Spider Lake! The gas gauge on my XJ barely moved and I ran the same trails and obstacles as the others.
A Ford fuel injected 5.0 is much lighter and makes more than enough power for a Short Wheel Base Jeep.
After it's all said & done, I'd recommend looking at a 1991 or newer Jeep Cherokee with the 4.0 and transmission of your choice. The frames are more rigid and they are more stable than CJs. They also have good suspension. With the right kit, they're easy to lift and with a bit of fender trimming and the right back spacing on the rims, 35 inch tires can be fitted with minimal rubbing with no more than 5 or 6 inches of lift. They offer more interior room and you can sleep in the back if needed. Doors can be modified to be easily removed and reinstalled without tools and it's easy to figure out how to remove the side and rear glass for an open feeling while maintaining the safety and convenience of a hard top. They are cheap to buy, reliable and easy to work on. They have their quirks, as any vehicle does, but nothing that can't be fixed. They are also much lighter than CJs. On the trail, they really perform, even when stock.
During all the years I have owned & operated XJs (the mid-sized Cherokees) I have never been left stranded anywhere due to electronics. The computers never failed and the fuel injection always worked. (Carbs need special tuning to work at some of the extreme angles off-road vehicles find themselves in.)
Regardless of what you decide, keep in mind that choosing a Jeep is much like choosing a family dog- you don't buy one, it's an adoption process. Also, it's like getting a good AR- With the right parts, they can be relied on. There are some Jeeps that come with components that need to be replaced with upgrades as soon as possible
Inkslinger
04-16-11, 10:01
Don't f around. Get a jeep rubicon. Best product offroad vehicle on the market. Mines basically stock and i've driven that thing over shit you wouldn't believe. Only been stuck once. Future plans to covert it to diesel so I can fill up from the heating oil tanks of abandoned homes after shtf. Or I could make my own bio-diesel by rendering the fat form the caloricly challenged who didn't make the cut.
Recently I've been thinking about a '97-2000 Wrangler. My thought would be to drive it till dies and along the way prepare for an engine swap. I would also probably lean toward a carbed jeep six banger. I used to manufacture ECUs (engine control units) and I despise electronics in control of a mechanical system. From my experience of making the electronics, 2002-2006, I will say I feel the ealier electronics are more robust and reliable. Begining with the 04-05 new models, certain makes of vehicles were begining to convert to what I would call "micro" electronics. I was not the least bit suprised by the electronic issues that came to light in the last couple of years. Of course all this depends on whether or not I make it through this year with out getting laid off. The problems in Japan have already slowed my companies business down, now with gas prices soaring higher and higher the future is far from certain.
BUT, I still love the Jeep CJ's. To me these are the all time classic Jeep. I'm just not sure I could afford one in a really good condition.
Don't f around. Get a jeep rubicon. Best product offroad vehicle on the market. Mines basically stock and i've driven that thing over shit you wouldn't believe. Only been stuck once. Future plans to covert it to diesel so I can fill up from the heating oil tanks of abandoned homes after shtf. Or I could make my own bio-diesel by rendering the fat form the caloricly challenged who didn't make the cut.
How much work and money to convert to diesel? I wish I could have bought my Chevy 1500 in diesel. We need more diesels here in America.
shooter1201
04-20-11, 10:42
My everyday ride is a 1998 Jeep Wrangler 'Sport'. I've owned it for 5 1/2 years (purchased for $2795). Its original 2.4L 4-banger is showing 235K miles. It was rebuilt at 190K miles. Since purchasing it I've installed a new rag top, new water pump, new distributor, new alternator, plugs, hoses, belts, etc. It got a set of new Goodyear Wranglers yesterday. Other than routine maintenance issues, it has been a GREAT vehicle. It burns NO oil. TOTAL investment to date is still UNDER $5,000.
Here's a little inspiration for you, my first vehicle, 1981 Jeep CJ-7 Laredo:
http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x83/xanderzuk/craigslist2.jpg
http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x83/xanderzuk/craigslist1-1.jpg
http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x83/xanderzuk/DSCF6452.jpg
http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x83/xanderzuk/DSCF6457_2.jpg
More inspiration...
http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x83/xanderzuk/DSCF6458_2.jpg
http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x83/xanderzuk/DSCF6462_2.jpg
http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x83/xanderzuk/DSCF6464_2.jpg
http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x83/xanderzuk/DSCF6469_2.jpg
Just a tag for an interesting thread. I had a 98 Cherokee Classic at one time and always thought about a Wrangler, if only for a weekend ride.
Here's a little inspiration for you, my first vehicle, 1981 Jeep CJ-7 Laredo:
http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x83/xanderzuk/craigslist2.jpg
http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x83/xanderzuk/craigslist1-1.jpg
http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x83/xanderzuk/DSCF6452.jpg
http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x83/xanderzuk/DSCF6457_2.jpg
That is awesome. I can't get the CJs out of my head, they are classic jeeps. In my searching the CJs are generally a little cheaper than the 97-00 Wranglers, more for me to think about.
Image Group
06-09-11, 00:29
I'm on my fifth Jeep. My first one was a 53 Willys when I was in High School followed by a 72 CJ and then an 85 CJ I drove for 2 years then did a complete mod including Chevy 350, axles and trans. It was a wicked Jeep. I then parted with it and moved to a 2001 TJ bought new off the lot and tricked it out and I'm now running an 03 Rubicon. I have never been happier than when in my JEEP. I have driven suburbans, Volvos, Mercedes, Nissan, H-1 (work vehicle), Tahoe, Mustang GT and I always came back to the JEEP.
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