View Full Version : The m16 A1
Heavyweight
02-03-11, 14:57
Is it just me or would anyone else give a testicle to own this firearm? I know the platform has come a long way but when I think M16, this is the image that pops in my head....simple, elegant beauty!
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=214505232
http://smcfirearms.com/gunbroker/20101012_Colt_M16A1/m16a1-2L.jpg
Be Safe!
Heavyweight
fivefivesix
02-03-11, 15:08
im building one right now. but your right when i hear m16 that what comes to my mind is the triangle handgaurds and 20 rnd mags. although im building an a2 my next is an sbr then an a1. i love the rifles
Well I have a RR M16A1, but mine no longer looks like that.
http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s157/Glocktogo/CIMG4177.jpg
FWIW, I just shot it at a rifle match this weekend with targets ranging from 5-110 yards. I shot each stage FA just to prove to myself that FA is of limited use in the real world. Inside of 20 yards, it actually worked pretty well when using 2-3 shot bursts on standard IPSC targets. Anything over 20 yards and it became a hindrance.
I was also able to shoot each stage with a dedicated .22 upper. That was surprisingly effective. I could get fist sized 3-5 round bursts on target with ease out to 50 yards, which allowed me to rapidly transition from target to target without hesitation.
I have a 602 clone built using an actual Colt upper and an NDS retro slickside receiver.
The parts on the lower weren't correct so I ordered some newly made retro parts from a guy that goes by the name of HeanBeat (link from NDS website).
All I need for the rifle to be functional is a chrome slickside bolt carrier group. I see a few for sale on GB, but I want a quality one even though it is just for a clone collector rifle that won't see a lot of use. I'd prefer it to be an M16 style carrier versus the neutered styles as well.
I also have a 607 carbine clone in the works. That one is going to be expensive !
I know this site is geared more towards the end result of being proficient in using your chosen firearms for the protection of the well being of yourself and your family, but I know there are others on here who also just enjoy the general owning, collecting, and shooting of many varieties of firearms.
M-FOURTEEN
02-03-11, 21:18
The A1's are my favorite. Hard to beat something that is that classic and distinguishable.
Is it just me or would anyone else give a testicle to own this firearm? I know the platform has come a long way but when I think M16, this is the image that pops in my head....simple, elegant beauty!
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=214505232
http://smcfirearms.com/gunbroker/20101012_Colt_M16A1/m16a1-2L.jpg
Be Safe!
Heavyweight
I have one and both testicles. My upper and stock is now on a NODAK SPUD retro lower and the lower is built into a 12.5" Noveske Crusader SBR. Runs well with my HALO suppressor. One of my favorite guns and I run the piss out of it with crappy steel cased ammo W/O problems.
That one didn't sell for $19000.00 but I think if you look around you can find them in the $13,000.00 to $15,000.00 range.
Until that day,
Darkop
I also built an A1 with a Nodak lower, as my second rifle. The lower and LPK are the only parts that aren't original USGI from the 70s and early 80s (probably). The upper is even GM-Hydromatics, which is cool, given that I'm from the MI and my dad worked for GM.
My A1 is lighter and more wieldy than than my carbine. It's what is currently inspiring me to try selling my carbine and building a BCM LW middy from the ground up to be lighter and better balanced....
Jake Bauer
02-03-11, 23:13
What do you guys make of these?
http://www.hendersondefense.com/store/pc/Century-M-16A1-Semi-Auto-Rifle-5p82.htm
Eurodriver
02-04-11, 01:35
I would be terrified I would somehow crack/damage the lower and throw $13000 away.
I did not like ARs until the A2 flat top was introduced. The stock of the A1 is too short and the sights do not line up naturally for me when I bring the rifle to my shoulder. I'd love to have a full auto AR but if it were an A1, it would quickly be modernized
I actually prefer the A1 to the A2. I like the A2 handguard, pistol grip & buttplate. I like the simple A1 sights, shorter stock & full auto better.
For that time period, I would have preferred the Diemaco C7.
is there any major differences between the original M16 A1 & A2 lower receivers themselves??
I'm waiting on delivery of my BCM A2-style rifle. :thank_you2:
What do you guys make of these?
http://www.hendersondefense.com/store/pc/Century-M-16A1-Semi-Auto-Rifle-5p82.htm
I personally wouldn't buy anything from Century. Their reputation is terrible in the AK world, and I doubt their quality is any better with ARs. Supposedly, their entire staff is made up of drunk monkeys.
:agree:
is there any major differences between the original M16 A1 & A2 lower receivers themselves??
The A2 has reinforcements at the front pivot pin area & the rear of the receiver
You can see the differents here: http://www.nodakspud.com/index.htm
A1:
http://www.nodakspud.com/AR%20Lowers.htm
A2:
http://www.nodakspud.com/newstuff.htm
I actually would prefer an A1 with a FN cold hammer forged chrome lined 1/7" twist barrel over an A2.
Having said that, we do have a Retro section. ;)
Heavy Metal
02-04-11, 09:25
is there any major differences between the original M16 A1 & A2 lower receivers themselves??
Yes, the RE Ring reinforcement and the front lug reinforcements.
I personally wouldn't buy anything from Century. Their reputation is terrible in the AK world, and I doubt their quality is any better with ARs. Supposedly, their entire staff is made up of drunk monkeys.
:agree:
I have firsthand experience with their lousy AK products - most notably their barrels. :fie:
Heavy Metal
02-04-11, 11:20
I actually would prefer an A1 with a FN cold hammer forged chrome lined 1/7" twist barrel over an A2.
Having said that, we do have a Retro section. ;)
My thoughts exactly. I remember an A1 we had in the armory back in 91 that had an A1 upper with a deflector bump, an FNMI 1/7 barrel and an A2 lower but was a full auto A1. Round A2 handguards too. Everything else in the armory was early 70's production Colts.
I think the rifle was cobbled together by direct support but I am not sure. It was close to being the perfect A1.
Eurodriver
02-04-11, 12:01
I'm waiting on delivery of my BCM A2-style rifle. :thank_you2:
I wish BCM Sold A2 uppers.
Heavyweight
02-04-11, 13:46
I wish BCM Sold A2 uppers.
Don't even go there....Bravo already holds the mortgage on my house!
My thoughts exactly. I remember an A1 we had in the armory back in 91 that had an A1 upper with a deflector bump, an FNMI 1/7 barrel and an A2 lower but was a full auto A1. Round A2 handguards too. Everything else in the armory was early 70's production Colts.
I think the rifle was cobbled together by direct support but I am not sure. It was close to being the perfect A1.
Maybe not. What you describe is an M16A1E1 - I saw one just like it in ROTC in the mid-eighties. My instructor was pissed because he couldn't get one of the A2's released to him to show our 2nd year class. Frankly, I was surprised when he showed up in class with that rifle. They had ltwt A1 profile barrels but in 1:7, which would be damn near the ideal light rifle barrel. Not many were made that way - the A2 profile was deemed 'superior'. CMMG was making duplicates of the barrel for awhile, but stopped just about the time I was ready to buy one. :shout:
Some of these had A2 marked A1 lowers as well. Colt was clearly cleaning off their shelves. ;) I believe a number of M16A1's were 'upgraded' with A2 furniture in the field to bring them up to A2 'spec' but the A2 being issued in quantity put an end to that eventually. A real M16A1E1 swould be a rare bird. I'd love to find a real upper assy. At the time the main selling point was the A2 sights, and it was the same as it is now - every unit wanted the latest and greatest, so no one wanted reworked A1's - at least that's the sense I got of it from my instructor at the time.
I'm trying to think of anything better about the A2, and aside from the large rear sight aperture, handguards and twist rate, I have nothing.
I managed to get 2, with both boys still in place and in tact thankfully. :lol:
One is a complete rifle with A2 furniture and the other just a lower. I have to admit, the rifle is no more than a safe queen. I refuseto fire it as it was a very rare find. the lower on the other hand has an M4 upper sitting on it and will fire it once that build is complete.
I managed to get 2, with both boys still in place and in tact thankfully. :lol:
One is a complete rifle with A2 furniture and the other just a lower. I have to admit, the rifle is no more than a safe queen. I refuseto fire it as it was a very rare find. the lower on the other hand has an M4 upper sitting on it and will fire it once that build is complete.
Pics or it didn't happen! ;):D
The rifle in Post # 1 of the full auto thread:D no photo of the A1 lower yet though.
Combat_Diver
04-05-11, 09:30
When I think M16A1 its when I entered the Army in Oct 83-Jul 87' then we traded for M16A2s. Actually when I got to 5th SFGA in Nov 84' got issued a XM16E1. Classic lightweight rifles but not something I would want in Astan. Here I want rails and optics.
CD
A yes/no question please and thanks, as far as original Colt M16 parts go, was there a difference in the auto sear for a full auto VS. 3 rnd burst? I came across a website that had Original Colt M16 parts and there was a "Colt 3 round burst (auto) sear" and a seperate "Colt auto sear". Thank you
Damn, almost $20k????
Shit, if you're patient you can get one for like $10k.
Is it just me or would anyone else give a testicle to own this firearm? I know the platform has come a long way but when I think M16, this is the image that pops in my head....simple, elegant beauty!
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=214505232
http://smcfirearms.com/gunbroker/20101012_Colt_M16A1/m16a1-2L.jpg
Be Safe!
Heavyweight
I built myself one like that. DEZ Arms (http://www.shop.dezarms.com/product.sc;jsessionid=A2E13C8D796E06B2ED7C97C41821975C.qscstrfrnt03?productId=121&categoryId=-1) offers a 1/7", but it isn't chrome lined. That's what I used though, as I don't expect to get into extended firefights or use it in hot and humid environments for weeks on end. About the only things that are actually over a year or two old are the furniture and FSB. Shoots great.
http://img833.imageshack.us/img833/7863/ar603clone.jpg
torquemada055
04-19-11, 01:48
I love my clones!!! XM-177E2, 16" A1 middy, 603 like the Marines gave me long ago...:blink:
http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x140/torquemada55/PICT4424.jpg
In the Army we were issued A2's for BRM, and then got A1's when we went on FTX near the end of Basic.Fun doing mag dumps, even though they were with blanks.
Maybe not. What you describe is an M16A1E1 - I saw one just like it in ROTC in the mid-eighties. My instructor was pissed because he couldn't get one of the A2's released to him to show our 2nd year class. Frankly, I was surprised when he showed up in class with that rifle. They had ltwt A1 profile barrels but in 1:7, which would be damn near the ideal light rifle barrel. Not many were made that way - the A2 profile was deemed 'superior'. CMMG was making duplicates of the barrel for awhile, but stopped just about the time I was ready to buy one. :shout:
Some of these had A2 marked A1 lowers as well. Colt was clearly cleaning off their shelves. ;) I believe a number of M16A1's were 'upgraded' with A2 furniture in the field to bring them up to A2 'spec' but the A2 being issued in quantity put an end to that eventually. A real M16A1E1 swould be a rare bird. I'd love to find a real upper assy. At the time the main selling point was the A2 sights, and it was the same as it is now - every unit wanted the latest and greatest, so no one wanted reworked A1's - at least that's the sense I got of it from my instructor at the time.
When colt geared up for A2 production they stopped making A1 barrels and uppers. As needs arose for spares for A1's in service I am not aware of further 1/12 barrel production after that time but a good many C7 uppers made for colt under contract found their way into the US supply system for rebuilds/repairs. One of these turned up in a rack of A1's when I was at Ft drum and the supply guy ever the packrat had some spare barreled uppers squirreled away. I had some things he was needy of and he got me that barreled upper in swap. everybody covered each others losses to make good and we were all happy. I just recently found for $225 a new A1 barreled upper - flat new never had a bolt in it , but it's upper is an Anchor Harvey C7 !. I saw one exaclty like my upper fetch $135 on arfcom. I think I'll swap my C7 flat new upper for an A1 and I'll have two nice retro fun shooters. I loved the A1 in service and rather disliked the A2 when they issued them out. When I got out and went nasty guard they had A1's still for some time.... Happy again !. Then they took away the 1911's...but then that's another story altogether.
Oh ; on the A1 uppers with A2 barrels... I only saw that in naval issue rebuilds of older A1's... and a couple airforce guards I knew carried those mixmaster rebuilds with A2 barrels.
It was also very very common for A1 handguards when being replaced to be given round HG's when the old style ran out to be had. I recall in the late 80's in the guard all the rambos wanted the round HG's to make their poodle shooter look more "tacticool". I hated the roundies and still do. Not too keen on all the rails and gadgetry add ons...but that's another story too.
What do you guys make of these?
http://www.hendersondefense.com/store/pc/Century-M-16A1-Semi-Auto-Rifle-5p82.htm
The quality of the Century lowers are quite rough. But out of the lot that came through the shop, I inspected each and they did come with M16 Colt BCG's. That's about as cool as it gets though.
I have firsthand experience with their lousy AK products - most notably their barrels. :fie:
They mutilate the hell out of the hammer and bolt carrier to make it legal (they still think M16 carriers are illegal to own) Definitely wouldn't buy again but I didn't know better and it looked like the A2 I had as a Marine recruit.
That said, I made mine a shooter. Others weren't so lucky (canted FSBs, misaligned gas ports, etc.)
I'm thinking about putting this together- it's a 1/7 twist barrel, with an A5 lower.
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/cc295/B055H0GG/RetroA1upper.jpg
I wish BCM Sold A2 uppers.
I wanted to build an A2 upper using a 20" BCM barrel. Can anyone verify if the 20" barrel has the M4 style feed ramps? Anyone know where to get an A2 upper with M4 style feed ramps? TIA for any information anyone can provide.
I wish BCM Sold A2 uppers.
I dream of the day BCM sells a complete A2 upper. If anyone at BCM is reading this thread, please, please, PLEASE make this an option. Thank you!
Beautiful rifles, but would not give a testicle.
steelonsteel
10-01-11, 09:33
The 20" uppers BCM sell all have m4 feedramps. Not a bad thing, really. not historically correct, and you don't really need them on a 20" upper, but it doesnt hurt to have them either.
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