James Yeager- Tactical Response

[brantley65]

Mr. Yeagers training facility/home is not far from a family member in Tn. Having never taking a training class, this might be an option for me. Has anyone ever trained under him or do you know of his reputation. I have visited his site " Get off the X " and found some good info there.

[ashooter]

Mr. Yeagers training facility/home is not far from a family member in Tn. Having never taking a training class, this might be an option for me. Has anyone ever trained under him or do you know of his reputation. I have visited his site " Get off the X " and found some good info there.


Some people love him, and some people HATE him, but I don't think that has anything to do with his training.

I've taken 2 back to back pistol classes with James and I felt it was VERY good training. Only complaint I might have is that it felt like he might have been trying to cram too much knowledge into 4 days. BUT I brought home a lot of new skills and knowledge, and I actually wear my pistol every day now. Good stuff!

[Jay Cunningham]

I have never trained with Yeager, so I can't tell you about his training program. I can tell you that the advertised round counts for most of his classes seem very high in comparison to say, Vickers or Rogers.

Some would view this as getting a lot more shooting in, others would view it as making brass piles for brass piles sake.

[KevinB]

I've taken two TR classes.
A fighting rifle - and one of his HRCC classes - (the Driving one done with Tony Scotti).

I will admit I took the Fighting rifle for fun - I did not go expecting to learn all that much. It was the first "open class" I had ever been on and it was an eye opener into the lack of skills some people have. That said James did get students in two days - some who had never shot an AR before doing team drills involving fire and movement.
I came out of it with a few good ideas on how to do some low level training. I was the only active duty guy there, however there where a few reservists and LE guys - but the majority where what I would call a flat faced civy ;) It was more mindset that working on fine skills though.
However he's a good guy and I enjoyed the class.

The driving one was the first that Tony and James had done together - so there where hicups - and the 5 students has a HUGE disparity in skill level coming up to the course. I learned a lot - on that course - even with some previous emergency driving training.

One of the best selling features of his Camden classes is he opens his house to his students -- he converted the basement to a Team Room - where you can sleeep - and provides WiFi - all at no extra charge.


Love him or hate him one cannot dispute he noticed a market and filled it.

[Matt Edwards]

James is a good instructor and a great american. Like all classes, take what you need and disregard what you don't. If you have a "touchy feely" bone in your body, you may be offended. He dishes it out. Understand you can give it back. I, personally, don't understand where his rep for having an abrasive personality comes from. I come from a world where it was bush league.
I DO recomend training with him.
I was "injured" when I atended his "fighting pistol" class and he took me both to and from the range all weekend. Don't be fooled. He is a good dude!
Matt

[MaceWindu]

I DO recomend training with him.
I was "injured" when I atended his "fighting pistol" class and he took me both to and from the range all weekend. Don't be fooled. He is a good dude!
Matt

Solid dude. Solid training...

Mace

[Snake RAH]

I've taken Fighting Pistol, Fighting Rifle, Intermediate Fighting Rifle, and Advanced Fighting Rifle from him. I have enjoyed his classes and learned several new things.

I would classify all the above excluding Intermediate as more mindset classes than skill classes (Intermediate was shooting from 50-350 yrds with stock ARs). Fighting Pistol involves a use of force lecture on day 2 that I think was informative and necessary for anyone who carries a gun for self-defense. All classes had some team stuff either on day 1 or day 2. Most instructors don't teach any team stuff so it was refreshing to be exposed to something new.

Another item we got during Advanced was a block of instruction on use of medical gear in your blow out kit. Most shooters don't seem to carry any med gear, or if they do, it's a toss up if they actually know how to use the gear. I've always thought that if you learn how to put holes in things, you should be just as capable in patching those holes up.

As for the "thick skin" stuff, there are some folks out there who can't take a little razzing. Everyone gets razzed a little, so it's no big deal. If you've been in the military, law enforcement, fire department, or a sports team, the razzing won't be an issue.

I will admit that the round counts are substantial. I've either shot what was recommended or slightly in excess of recommended (except for Intermediate, where I shot less, but it was the first class of its kind). I have found, though, if you have any problem with a gun or equipment, it will show up here, most definitely.

Therefore, if you want some good training local to you, give Tactical Response a try.

[Don Robison]

I've never trained with him, but from what I've seen generally speaking, people who have trained with him at TR like him and say he's solid. People who haven't trained with him or have an ax to grind try to discredit him. I keep trying to take his tactical shotgun, but the schedule dates just haven't worked out. But then again, I like to get training from guys who are controversial so I can make up my own mind.
Like someone else said, take out of it what you need and shelve the rest. One day it you might decide you need it and will at least have something to pull out of the depths of your mind.

[Submariner]

I trained with James Yeager twice for carbine. Once in a cow pasture near Big Sandy (Nov. 2001; Brad Nelson was my team mate) and once at Memphis PD's excellent range and shoot house (Mar. 2002). Shot almost as much in two days as we have been shooting in three-day EAG classes. (Ammo was cheaper then; quantity is no good unless quality shooting is required.) He was big on Glock 19's (and down on Colts); big on Bushmasters (and down on Colts); big on isosceles (and down on Weaver). But that's how Andy Stafford, with whom Yeager was then affiliated, differentiated himself in the training marketplace at that time (anti-Gunsite/Modern School.) Yeager is a great marketer. (Google both and see who comes up sooner.)

I carried away a few of things: A2 iron sights work (but later discovered an Aimpoint on a flat top carbine is faster and much better at night where irons suck); FAST (Fight; Assess; Scan; Tactical Reload); "Melt-down Drills"; and that a Glock 19 might be a nice tool to add to the box along with a Colt 1911. (Never bought the BM is as good as or better than a Colt, though.) The shoot house experience was a real eye-opener (Yeager gave the lecture and Mike Aultman ran us through.)

If you can train with Yeager locally and save money, go for it. Make sure you have enough ammo. Consider it a smörgåsbord; take with you what is good and leave the rest. Or if you have never trained before, use the skill sets he teaches until you are exposed to something better. Like all instructors (whether they admit it or not) Yeager teaches "a way," not "the way."

[Snake RAH]

Consider it a smörgåsbord; take with you what is good and leave the rest....Like all instructors (whether they admit it or not) Yeager teaches "a way," not "the way."

That's good advice. If your instructor insists on "his way" is the best way for all circumstances, then that instructor is not worth the money you're paying him.

[SIMPLYDYNAMIC]

That's good advice. If your instructor insists on "his way" is the best way for all circumstances, then that instructor is not worth the money you're paying him.

+1

besides James instruction has nothing to do with (as far as I know) discredit... he had a "incident" in Iraq that has been following him around but that "shouldnt" make people automatically discredit his instruction ability.

[Neville]

I took 6 days of training when Andy Stanford and James Yeager were a team (Options for Personal Security) and for me it was really a huge boost in performance and mindeset. Andy is a very methodical and analytical teacher, while Yeager provided the reality input of a long serving police officer. But there is only so much time in a class and you have to choose want to bring across. So, while the OPS training was more focused on learning civilians how to shoot (with great mindset lectures in between), Tactical Response seems now focusing on providing contractor-style training and a "fighting"-mindset, which should be gained through stressful drills. My other 4day Tactical Response carbine class (in 2006) didn't spend much (if any) time on basics like trigger control or reload techniques.

So for an absolute beginner I don't necessarily recommend a TR class as the first one. A newbie may be overwhelmed by the team techniques and tactics and may not realize that for him as an individual, they may not be the universal answer (if it exists at all). What didn't fit me in the recent class was that now not only drills, but even most techniques seemed tailored for a team environment. The problem I see there is that you have to introduce certain new techniques in order to make larger team drills relatively safe. If I have to "unlearn" things as movement to the side (for cover) or low ready during the class, just to be safe at the "team drill test" at the last day, isn't this just as artificial as IPSC? Especially if one is told that its low ready again in CQB- which may be just "a bit" more relevant to the average civilian and police officer?
I have a MA in psychology and don't see the value of team drills at all as I don't buy the "learning through stress" thing, since according to the basic learning theory and stress inoculation training, you can't learn new skills under stress.

Imagine a civilian novice taking just this one class- would team drills, and logically the special skills set that go with it, really be on your list of priorities? Is announcing that he is emtpy or has a malfunction by yelling for cover really the thing you want the lone home defender or rural cop to train? In case of a home invasion, I am not going to call six buddies so that we can do an Aussie peel... Sadly the industry seems shifting towards guys that want to experience the contractor feeling for a few days and don't care if the tactics and techniques are realistic. Demand and supply...

What I really don't get is the character assassination going on. Armchair warriors, who don't have a clue of the details, take hours and hours to judge a split second decision. Reminds me of the courtroom when self-defense cases are judged. I have heard Yeagers explanation of his actions and IMHO his only fault was to stay on the team when the severe lack of professionalism was becoming obvious to him. But a single event- even if it was a turning point for him- can't be the sole ground on which to judge a man.

Best Regards

Cato

[NCPatrolAR]

Over the years I have done several courses with Tactical Response (Tactical Rifle, Tac. Pistol, Tac. Shotgun, Fighting Rifle, Fighting Pistol, attended an Aulmni shoot) and have found the older "tactical" era material to be better than the new "Fighting" material. Of course this is personal opinion. One of the greatest issues when training with Tactical Response is who you get as an instructor. I have done courses where the instructors were outstanding. I've done others were the instruction was marginal. All depends on who you get.








Tactical Response seems now focusing on providing contractor-style training and a "fighting"-mindset, which should be gained through stressful drills. My other 4day Tactical Response carbine class (in 2006) didn't spend much (if any) time on basics like trigger control or reload techniques.

I noticed the same thing. There is a much greater emphasis on doing team drills than working as an individual. It seems this occured once the "contractor" classes start getting pushed harder and harder. Also, it seems fundamentals weren't covered in any detail unless someone was having serious problems on the line.







What I really don't get is the character assassination going on. Armchair warriors, who don't have a clue of the details, take hours and hours to judge a split second decision. Reminds me of the courtroom when self-defense cases are judged. I have heard Yeagers explanation of his actions and IMHO his only fault was to stay on the team when the severe lack of professionalism was becoming obvious to him. But a single event- even if it was a turning point for him- can't be the sole ground on which to judge a man.



Seems a lot of people get hung up on what occured in Iraq and do judge Yeager on that. However, he has also done a fair amount of damage his own self through things he has posted and how his forum has been moderated. Hard to take someone serious when there are repeated calls to "do God's work" or you have posts moved and deleted because they are going against the product of the month being pushed.

[Snake RAH]

I attended Fighting Pistol and Fighting Rifle in Feb, 2006, and two things that were taught in Fighting Rifle were trigger reset and reloading the rifle.

Prior to this class I've had some instruction on trigger reset, but not to the point of building a cadence in using the reset. On James' Fighting Rifle DVD, he goes into instruction of shooting multiple targets, but with the proper use of trigger reset and cadence, you can learn to fire the gun faster and make your hits very well.

Also, my first experience in "tactical reloads" was in the local IDPA style pistol and carbine matches. It seemed that no one really had a good way of demonstrating how to change magazines with retention and not drop them or fumble about. Subsequently, when I began seeking my own training, I had been shown a way of changing mags, but nothing that worked for me. When James showed us his method of "flat to flat" for the AR mags, I picked that method up and it works well for me. I also learned during fighting pistol an easier way to do a tac reload as well.

James has this thing where he talks about mindset, tactics, skills, and equipment. I don't view his classes (except for Intermediate Rifle) that I've taken as primarily "skills" classes. You probably should be at a certain level for taking a class. Some skills are taught, but for the most part, if you want to improve your skills, taking an instructor's course (Paul Howe's tactical rifle instructor class) has given me more insight in what I've been doing, right and wrong, as a shooter, since I've first picked up a rifle.

As far as the team stuff goes, to me, it's the next logical step to have a fighting course.

[they]

I considered taking class there, but after a little research changed my mind.

Watched his rifle vid, and though he can shoot, he was winded after a simple drill, pretty pathetic (barring medical conditions).

Makes me wonder if he takes it seriously.


ETA, may be great guys though.

[TheDutchman]

I would take a Paul Howe or Pat Rodgers class, also doesn't SIMPLYDYNAMIC teach?

[markm]

I have never trained with Yeager, so I can't tell you about his training program. I can tell you that the advertised round counts for most of his classes seem very high in comparison to say, Vickers or Rogers.

Some would view this as getting a lot more shooting in, others would view it as making brass piles for brass piles sake.

I agree. I've not trained under Yeager either, but some of my better training experiences have been with instructors who had us doing less actual shooting and more thinking.

On a limited budget for training and ammo, I'm reluctant to sign up for a class that says bring 2000 rounds of ammo.