View Full Version : New to the world of Carbine, need advice...
Greetings all,
I am new to the world of shooting firearms of the M4 family (and semi automatic rifles in general) and want to start out right. I have a few questions, and would greatly appreciate your thoughts.
1. Are there any brands/models of the M4 that are considered a good entry level M4, and if not, what are your recommendations?
2. I've been loading my own ammunition for my bolt actions since I learned to shoot. This usually amounted to around 300-400 rounds a year. Is loading my own ammunition for an M4 (or any semi) feasible? (this may seem redundant, but I am curious as to whether anyone else who made the transition to semis found that loading their own ammunition went from being a pleasure to a nightmare)
These were my two majors concerns, though any other advice you would like to give would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you all in advance for your time,
Dass
Welcome!
If there is one thing this site will provide plenty of its advice and information. Most of it well worth listening to.
There are lots of companies that produce quality out of the box rifles that are good to go. What kind of budget are you looking at for your your rifle?
One of my new favorites, being that they are made nearby, are the rifles from Accurate Armory. They are relatively new and haven't made a name for themselves yet, but they put out a quality product. I know several people with their complete rifles and haven't heard one bad thing about them.
You can get their basic carbine for under $800
http://www.accuratearmory.com/Firearms/ClassicCarbine.aspx
There's a lot of information on this site. Someone will be along shortly to suggest you do a search.
In the meantime, look at all the stickies on the AR Technical Discussions. In particular, you may be interested to review The Chart (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=pwswheghNQsEuEhjFwPrgTA&single=true&gid=5&output=html). It's a compilation, perhaps a little out of date, of certain rifles from the major AR brands and lists their general adherence to the US military's specifications for the AR15/M16/M4 platform. If you believe that professional grade weaponry is better that the consumer versions put out by some rifle mfgrs, then you will find The Chart helpful.
while there are a few threads already, I will help you :)
1. Some good brands include Daniel Defense, Lewis Machine and Tool, Bravo Company, and Colt. (Cant go wrong with any of them)
2. I dont do much reloading, but have a few cousins that do and it doesn't seem too bad from what they had to say about it.
I hope I helped you some :)
FishingFool
02-22-11, 20:40
lots of people reload for the ar-15 platform its no big deal.
Since the ar15 platform is so versatile and the aftermarket accessories are almost limitless its hard to make suggestions without a few simple things to narrow it down:
What do you want to do with your rifle.
What distances do you expect to be shooting.
What is your total budget for all the toys and accessories.
Thanks for the replies so far everyone. I spent a few hours on the site before posting and was amazed at all the information compiled here.
In regards to my budget, I want to buy a quality rifle, and am willing to spend the money for one.
I reviewed the chart mentioned, and found it very helpful. I had originally been looking at Colt but then came across names like Daniel Defence, LMT, Sabre, etc and wanted to find out if there was one that would work well for me as a beginner with the M4.
Welcome to what to my mind is the finest firearms forum on the internet!
Go to the AR General Discussion and AR Technical Discussion sections, and check out the stickified threads. Dig in. I recommend starting with this thread:
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=6642
...and go from there. Dig in - you'll see what's recommended feature-wise, and when you're reading that and other threads you'll learn why those features are recommended.
I am by no means the most knowledgable person in the world as far as ARs are concerned, but I have enough experience to know that the M4C 'elders' here know what they're talking about :)
Enjoy!
Other than the quality you'd get from a Colt, Noveske, LMT, BCM, DD, the rifle you need isn't brand-specific...it's model-specific. First thing you need to do is define what you want to do with the rifle. That will determine the configuration and the model.
You'll find that when buying from the respected names vs the "others" there isn't much price difference while the quality is superior.
In regards to my budget, I want to buy a quality rifle, and am willing to spend the money for one.
As said before, the platform is so versatile that anything you buy now can always be swapped out/upgraded later. For starters, a basic setup like this: http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/BCM-M4-Carbine-AR15-Bravo-Company-s/141.htm or any of the others would do you well.
I'm new to AR's as well and researched for months before I finally "pulled the trigger".
This site is BY FAR the best single resource for learning about practical/self defense/fighting rifles. I ended up spending 80% of my time researching here. I would spend a considerable amount of time searching this forum. I have been on a nightly basis for over a month.
Definitely check out the "Chart". Also, here is a link to a very informative discourse explaining what to look for in a "fighting" AR:
http://forums.officer.com/showthread.php?81462-So-you-want-to-buy-an-AR-15-huh
It will help you understand the "Chart" better. Keep in mind the post is 3 years old. Some things have changed with the manufacturers (ex. Colt now uses standard size FCG pins). Also Bravo Co. is not mentioned. However it has been edited and the thread is still active with newer product info. I used the search function here to double check things
If you notice, the "Chart" would imply Colt is the rifle to beat. Colts have commanded premium prices in the past and thus building a rifle from Bravo, etc has been the more economical path to a quality rifle.
However, Colt LE6920's can be found for $1100 on Gunbroker and from some internet sites right now making a Colt a very attractive option.
That's what I did.. Just got my rifle tonight.:dance3:
This place http://www.cdnninvestments.com/ has been selling them for $1099 w/ free shipping but they were out of stock as of last week.
I ended up getting one through Gunbroker from a shop who had several of them for sale. I paid $1100 + $15 shipping
Also of note, my experience with firearms has been with the competitive and accuracy side of things and I had read several books on competitive AR 15's. But then I decided I wanted a "fighting rifle".
Most of the advice on this forum deals with "fighting" rifles. There are different priorities here. If you go to a CMP or Service Rifle forum you will find many endorsing rifles like Rock River's NM, etc. The short comings with these rifles are not a concern for that application.
Welcome!
Read the stickies in each sub-forum. Many of your questions have been asked before, and answered.
Really, really, really, really recommend you get some professional training.
While you can reload for a 5.56 self loading rifle (small base sizing die would be good), you may find it more cost effective to buy, in addition to a quality M4 type rifle, a .22LR M4 type rifle such as the Smith MP15-22.
RogerinTPA
02-22-11, 21:54
I'm new to AR's as well and researched for months before I finally "pulled the trigger".
This site is BY FAR the best single resource for learning about practical/self defense/fighting rifles. I ended up spending 80% of my time researching here. I would spend a considerable amount of time searching this forum. I have been on a nightly basis for over a month.
Definitely check out the "Chart". Also, here is a link to a very informative discourse explaining what to look for in a "fighting" AR:
http://forums.officer.com/showthread.php?81462-So-you-want-to-buy-an-AR-15-huh
It will help you understand the "Chart" better. Keep in mind the post is 3 years old. Some things have changed with the manufacturers (ex. Colt now uses standard size FCG pins). Also Bravo Co. is not mentioned. However it has been edited and the thread is still active with newer product info. I used the search function here to double check things
If you notice, the "Chart" would imply Colt is the rifle to beat. Colts have commanded premium prices in the past and thus building a rifle from Bravo, etc has been the more economical path to a quality rifle.
However, Colt LE6920's can be found for $1100 on Gunbroker and from some internet sites right now making a Colt a very attractive option.
That's what I did.. Just got my rifle tonight.:dance3:
This place http://www.cdnninvestments.com/ has been selling them for $1099 w/ free shipping but they were out of stock as of last week.
I ended up getting one through Gunbroker from a shop who had several of them for sale. I paid $1100 + $15 shipping
Also of note, my experience with firearms has been with the competitive and accuracy side of things and I had read several books on competitive AR 15's. But then I decided I wanted a "fighting rifle".
Most of the advice on this forum deals with "fighting" rifles. There are different priorities here. If you go to a CMP or Service Rifle forum you will find many endorsing rifles like Rock River's NM, etc. The short comings with these rifles are not a concern for that application.
That info is already contained in the explanations and features tabbed at the bottom of the "chart". IMHO, that guy piggy backed off of the "Chart" by Rob_S, et al, after it was already developed and established here.
That info is already contained in the explanations and features tabbed at the bottom of the "chart". IMHO, that guy piggy backed off of the "Chart" by Rob_S, et al, after it was already developed and established here.
His goal was to do a pictorial "buyers guide" and his inclusion of photographs was of immense help to me. He does give credit to others and mentions the Chart in the thread. But again, its the photographs that are of value here.
Verbally explaining proper gas key staking vs looking at pictures of it are 2 different informational experiences.
Do you know of one single link that has as many pictorial illustrations of what goes into a quality AR? If so I would love to know so I can bookmark it.
RogerinTPA
02-22-11, 23:10
His goal was to do a pictorial "buyers guide" and his inclusion of photographs was of immense help to me. He does give credit to others and mentions the Chart in the thread. But again, its the photographs that are of value here.
Verbally explaining proper gas key staking vs looking at pictures of it are 2 different informational experiences.
Do you know of one single link that has as many pictorial illustrations of what goes into a quality AR? If so I would love to know so I can bookmark it.
Do some reading of the tacked threads. It has all been available right here...for a long long time.
#1 http://m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=6993
#2 http://m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=6994
#3 https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=14534 , need I go on?
I did say one single link for...useful for a quick reference bookmark....but I stand corrected. The other link is of absolutely no value.:sad:
Do some reading of the tacked threads. It has all been available right here...for a long long time.
I had read the threads but thought I'd give the guy a another place to look being that people had already suggested them to him.
It is evident to any reader that the date of the "Chart" post predates the the other post so I did not intend to imply his was first, better, more accurate...etc......just anther take on the subject.
Just using my recent experiences to help the guy shorten his learning curve.....
alpha.kilo
02-23-11, 00:53
Reloading for the 5.56 is absolutely feasible. The question is, what type of reloader do you have? If you are sporting a single stage press, then you are going to need to upgrade if you intend to do any type of quantity shooting. I reload with a Dillion 550. It's not the fastest progressive press, but it loads safe, accurate ammo.
Reloading really can defer the high cost of today's ammo, depending on how smart you buy your components.
That doesn't mean I don't seize the opportunity if quality bulk ammo is available in 5.56. I really don't buy the .223 anymore. I will reload the low power stuff. But if I can get quality 5.56 at training ammo prices, I will.
5.56 and .223 are easy to reload on the right press. And it is half the fun of shooting. Good luck.
AK
RancidSumo
02-23-11, 00:57
Nevermind.
All inclusive linky. https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=7009
RogerinTPA
02-23-11, 07:08
I had read the threads but thought I'd give the guy a another place to look being that people had already suggested them to him.
It is evident to any reader that the date of the "Chart" post predates the the other post so I did not intend to imply his was first, better, more accurate...etc......just anther take on the subject.
Just using my recent experiences to help the guy shorten his learning curve.....
No worries. Just wanted to set the record straight.
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