View Full Version : How does this build sound? Would you change anything?
Here's my first SBR.
Specs
11.5 Wilson 1/9 chrome lined barrel/chamber
RRA Upper Receiver - Rifle Feed Ramps
DPMS bolt and carrier group
Stag Factory lower
I'm going to get some kind of 7" free float rail (Daniel Defence most likely) and Noveske flash hider.
Would you change anything. I lubed it generously and took it to the range once so far. 200 rounds on winchester white box 55/62 grain with zero malfunctions.
Now pics.
http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e193/Dragnaath/AR-1.jpg
http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e193/Dragnaath/AR-2.jpg
http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e193/Dragnaath/AR-4.jpg
Thanks
Paul
Since you asked, yes, I would make some changes. A lot of changes.
No 1/9 barrel in an SBR for me. In theory, you're already losing stability at range. I'd opt for the 1/7 or at least 1/8 to get the bullet spinning ASAP.
Rifle feed ramps? Not for me on an SBR. I'll take the M4 ramps.
DPMS anything? Nope. Sorry. I have just seen too much junk from them over the years. Perhaps some things have been changing over there, but I'm from Mississippi--you gotta "show me".;)
Bear in mind that the majority of these changes are due to barrel length and ammo, as they relate to reliability. SBRs are fun, but if you intend to fight, or even train to fight with one, steps should be taken to ensure utter reliability. While I am neither a gunfighter, or an engineer, I am sure others may come along with info more valuable than what I have posted. However, what I have posted genuinely reflects my experiences.
Hi
Thanks for the info. I too was leary about the DPMS bolt and carrier but thats what the upper came in with. So far it has been functioning properly. I have a spare stag bolt and carrier that I might swap. Keep in mind that we are limited to 5 rounds in the mag by canadian law so I won't be blasting 30 rounds in a hurry as I would have to change the mag 6 times :(
Its my first 11.5 I'm still learning.
Woludn't 1/7 barrel require a heavier bullet?
Swap that bolt now. No, I'm serious. Right now.
1/7 will work fine for 55+ in my experience, and I have shot much more than a few hundred rounds. In addition, if things keep going the way we're heading, nothing but M855 is gonna be available anyway.:eek:
Here's my first SBR.
Would you change anything.
Paul
No, you should leave it alone and shoot it. Why screw with it, it is a toy right?
Swap that bolt now. No, I'm serious. Right now.
1/7 will work fine for 55+ in my experience, and I have shot much more than a few hundred rounds. In addition, if things keep going the way we're heading, nothing but M855 is gonna be available anyway.:eek:
1/9 will handle 855 without a problem.
Guys
For now I'm going to shoot it and see how it works out. Its not a duty firearms just a range toy. I'll look into a better barrel with M4 ramps and 1/7 twist in the future.
Thanks
Paul
1/9 will handle 855 without a problem.
Of course it will. Most will effectively handle the envogue heavier projectiles, too. That does not mean, however, that they are well suited to the task. For the SBR platform something faster than 1/9 would be more "universally" beneficial.
The gentleman asked what I would change, and I answered the question. One step further, I provided the reasons for the changes and the manner in which I use the SBR, so that he can gauge his needs and use against mine. I thought that was a pretty well-laid out answer to the query without being overly loquacious. Unlike you, I did not assume that it was a toy. I was operating under the assumption that the gun was a tool. I was trying to provide insight as opposed to saying, just "shoot it". I was also taking into account the fact that 200 rounds fired says nothing for reliability. Silly me.
Since I am either being unclear, or have no idea what I'm talking about, I'll bow out and leave it to the experts.:rolleyes:
Good luck, Paulinski. I hope your new range toy provides you with all of the therapeutic range time you can possibly take. I know mine do!!!:cool:
Of course it will. Most will effectively handle the envogue heavier projectiles, too. That does not mean, however, that they are well suited to the task. For the SBR platform something faster than 1/9 would be more "universally" beneficial.
The gentleman asked what I would change, and I answered the question. One step further, I provided the reasons for the changes and the manner in which I use the SBR, so that he can gauge his needs and use against mine. I thought that was a pretty well-laid out answer to the query without being overly loquacious. Unlike you, I did not assume that it was a toy. I was operating under the assumption that the gun was a tool. I was trying to provide insight as opposed to saying, just "shoot it". I was also taking into account the fact that 200 rounds fired says nothing for reliability. Silly me.
Since I am either being unclear, or have no idea what I'm talking about, I'll bow out and leave it to the experts.:rolleyes:
Good luck, Paulinski. I hope your new range toy provides you with all of the therapeutic range time you can possibly take. I know mine do!!!:cool:
Edited by Mod - No personal attacks.
That means none, nada, zero.
Keep it polite and professional.
Carry on.
Your professional psychoanalysis is greatly appreciated. How much do I owe you?:rolleyes:
Hey Guys
Please keep the flaming to minimum. I appreciate everybodys advice thats why I asked the question in first place. Since I'm new to the SBR thing I still have lots to learn. I don't see my gun as a toy but its not something I use for work that I had unlimited budget to spend. If I were to start all over and belive me I will in the future I will build it differently.
For now I'm going to shoot it learn the basic of SBR's and enjoy as much as I can, and ask questions as I go along. :)
Cheers
Paulinski
I'll be glad to help wherever I can. Enjoy your first SBR. I am sure it will not be your last. It never is!!!:D
His is just for fun like mine is. He'll be at the 50yd. range a lot and won't have any problems.
If it is just a toy and not a tool like mine, when you do want to start upgrading I wouldn't worry about a new faster twist barrel unless you see keyholes on your paper. M4 feedramps will require a new upper and barrel. You can use a barrel with M4 feedramps in a "rifle" upper but there'd be no advantage.
Practice practice practice with what you have. When you get good enough to know that accuracy problems are the fault of the gun and not you, come back and ask for more advice and give details.
Since you have that Stag bolt and carrier- change them out. No reason to try and keep the upper all DPMS.
Go ahead and get a rail if you want. It will make you like your rifle much more, more than likely and won't hurt. It's your money.
Your professional psychoanalysis is greatly appreciated. How much do I owe you?:rolleyes:
Edited by Mod - Let's cool down and relax.
dubb-1 is highly respected by all on this forum and his advice should be listened to. It's still up to whether you choose to do so.
Please consider this a warning.
Since you asked, yes, I would make some changes. A lot of changes.
No 1/9 barrel in an SBR for me. In theory, you're already losing stability at range. I'd opt for the 1/7 or at least 1/8 to get the bullet spinning ASAP.
Rifle feed ramps? Not for me on an SBR. I'll take the M4 ramps.
DPMS anything? Nope. Sorry. I have just seen too much junk from them over the years. Perhaps some things have been changing over there, but I'm from Mississippi--you gotta "show me".;)
Bear in mind that the majority of these changes are due to barrel length and ammo, as they relate to reliability. SBRs are fun, but if you intend to fight, or even train to fight with one, steps should be taken to ensure utter reliability. While I am neither a gunfighter, or an engineer, I am sure others may come along with info more valuable than what I have posted. However, what I have posted genuinely reflects my experiences.
I was going to post pretty much the exact same thing.
I have a Colt 6933 on the way that addresses all of these issues. Barring that I would contact bravocompanyusa.com and try to find one of their 11.5" uppers (http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/BCM-11-5-Upper-Receiver-Group-p/bcm-urg-m4-11.htm) and a CMP MPI bolt carrier group (http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/CMT-M16-Auto-MPI-Bolt-Carrier-Group-p/bcg-cmt-mp-m16.htm)
Since you have that Stag bolt and carrier- change them out. No reason to try and keep the upper all DPMS.
The only DPMS part is bolt and carrier the upper receiver is RRA. Eventually I will either opt for quality 11.5" or assemble one from quality parts.
SinnFéinM1911
08-10-06, 13:13
dubb-1 is pretty much right on it with the rounds. The optimal twist is a 1/7. The tighter the twist the more accurate your shoot will be (provided you can shoot).
The more travel time the projectile spends on the lands and grooves as it leaves the chamber to reach its maximum vel, the better control the round will have after it exits to a "free-flying mode". Stability leads to accuracy.
You are able to fire lighter grains out of a faster twist to a reasonable distance, but you cannot go the other way. The heavier grains will exit, and not to far past 45-60 yrds it will start to yaw, then tumble. Soon the projectile will lose so much velocity it will soon crash to the ground.
I hope I made sense.. At least this is the way I understand it.
Bottom line how far can my SBR shoot accurately 55 gr and 62 gr winchester white box ammo with the current 1/9 twist barrel? Everything else beeing optimal including the shooter :)
nevermind, logic won't help.
SinnFéinM1911
08-10-06, 13:52
nevermind, logic won't help.
What do you mean ? Please enlighten me.
I've shot 40gr rounds from 1:7's except some early 90's Federal Blitz -stuff it works. Depends on a lot of things like the thickness of the jacket and the "sharpness" of the lands.
I would NEVER buy a 1:9 for ANYHTING -- let alone a SBR.
You guys are rough. As an uneducated newbie I build my SBR with 1/9 twist barrel. Back to my question how far can I accurately shoot 55gr and 62 grain bullets out of my ill fated gun. :(
You guys are rough. As an uneducated newbie I build my SBR with 1/9 twist barrel. Back to my question how far can I accurately shoot 55gr and 62 grain bullets out of my ill fated gun. :(
PM sent.
You guys are rough. As an uneducated newbie I build my SBR with 1/9 twist barrel. Back to my question how far can I accurately shoot 55gr and 62 grain bullets out of my ill fated gun. :(
I wouldnt change a thing until it breaks. Its not what I would want for my own, but I wouldnt leave it behind. If you practice and learn how to shoot, a bullet in the brain box from a 1:9 or 1:7, is going to put an end to the story. In the mean time spend money on practice ammo.
If its functioning, dont worry about the M4 ramps either. My SBR doesnt have them and I have over 5K rounds including a bunch full auto lately without any problems.
How far you can accurately shoot, depends on you more than anything. I have a "match" barrel on my SBR, and I know I could hit a human sized target at 600yds with my EoTech using MK 262. I'm sure yours is more than accurate enough.
I'd suggest you try another persons SBR with a Krink. It works for what it is, but its also a half pound on your muzzle. Be honest defining your requirements and you'll be happy with your choices.
You guys are rough. As an uneducated newbie I build my SBR with 1/9 twist barrel. Back to my question how far can I accurately shoot 55gr and 62 grain bullets out of my ill fated gun. :(
I would not change one single thing.
Ask yourself one question; how much of the super expensive MK 262 are you going to be shooting in reality? While it’s true that a 1/7 barrel would have given you more versatility, that does not mean much in the real world. For example, I have not shot a single round heavier or more exotic than 55 grain (M193) in the past two years. It’s just too damn expensive. Your 1/9 barrel will do just fine with 55 grain (M193, Q3131, etc.) or the heavier 62grain (M855). Just go shoot the hell out of it.
Robb Jensen
08-11-06, 07:33
You guys are rough. As an uneducated newbie I build my SBR with 1/9 twist barrel. Back to my question how far can I accurately shoot 55gr and 62 grain bullets out of my ill fated gun. :(
I was shooting the steel at 300yds on the KD range at Blackwater in May with my 11.5" SBR using an Eotech 552. It is 1x7 twist an I shot 55gr American Eagle. Yours is likely just as accurate. If this is a toy and you've already stated your shooting 55-62gr ammo then 1x9 will serve you very well.
My 11.5" is my 'go-to' gun and goes pretty much everywhere with me and it's in it's Eagle case with four 30 round HK mags loaded up with Black Hills 77gr. I like the terminal ballistics of the 77gr so that is why I went with 1x7 on my gun.
Voodoochild
08-11-06, 07:41
I was shooting the steel at 300yds on the KD range at Blackwater in May with my 11.5" SBR using an Eotech 552. It is 1x7 twist an I shot 55gr American Eagle. Yours is likely just as accurate. If this is a toy and you've already stated your shooting 55-62gr ammo then 1x9 will serve you very well.
My 11.5" is my 'go-to' gun and goes pretty much everywhere with me and it's in it's Eagle case with four 30 round HK mags loaded up with Black Hills 77gr. I like the terminal ballistics of the 77gr so that is why I went with 1x7 on my gun.
Christ reminder to myself dont mess with Robb. I pitty the fool who tailgates you...
Paulinski - Enjoy your blaster! Shoot the living piss out of it and when something breaks upgrade at that time. OR build another one with the specs there were recommended in this thread ;)
Thanks for the info guys for now I will shoot it and practice with it. I also have an eye on LMT 10.5 upper. 1/7, M4 ramps (receiver, barrel extension). What do you guys think about this upper?
Thanks
Thanks for the info guys for now I will shoot it and practice with it. I also have an eye on LMT 10.5 upper. 1/7, M4 ramps (receiver, barrel extension). What do you guys think about this upper?
Thanks
Great choice ;)
I would tend to agree "shoot what you have" but I would also change out that bolt/carrier. It's just me and I wouldn't want the bolt to break in the middle of a class or a match.
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