New Member has a Bushmaster Question

[M4orgery68]

I joined the forum primarily because I hope to get an answer to the nagging question I have about my Bushmaster. I have noticed that, the internet as a whole, eviscerates all Bushmaster products, and I am curious as to why. I have noticed that there seems to be a good deal of knowledge here and hoped someone could help me understand the basis of the criticism.

A little background on the gun in question, myself, etc.

The Gun
Bushmaster XM-15E2, purchased 2Q 2006
LAR Lower Receiver
Cerro Forge A3 Upper Receiver
Cardinal Forge A3 Carry Handle
5.56 Chamber
1 in 9 Twist (non-milspec, I prefer it to 1 in 7)
14.5" M4 profile barrel with welded Izzy FS
Non-M4 feed-ramps (Appear larger than rifle ramps, but do not extend into the receiver)
Non-F forged front sight
Extended height front sight post
Front sight taper pinned
Standard Bushmaster BCG (Staked Key)
BCM Milspec Extractor Spring
BCM Milspec (Double Heat Shield) Hand-guards
BCM Milspec (GEN 2) Stock
BCM Milspec H Buffer
Staked Castle Nut
BCM M4 Milspec Receiver Extension


Myself

Former FFL holder/Gunshop Owner
Shooting M16/AR10 variants longer than many of our fine fighters have been alive
Not a fan of dressing-up the gun for the sake of cool


Ok, so what is all the chatter about how bad Bushmaster is? I have owned quite a few AR's the oldest of which was a late 70's Colt A1 model (forgot the mod no.). I have had Colts, SGWs (Olympic), Bushmasters, you get the point. I have inspected and sold many more. I "GASSSSP!" actually traded my personal Colt R-6600 HBAR for a Bushmaster A2 back in 1989.

Obviously, I don't think Colt makes a bad product, but, while they have always been very high-quality, they omitted things from civilian products and made stupid changes like sear channel blocks and FCG pin size changes. I know the newer LEO marked products are not that bad for that these-days, but until recently Colts civilian products were not truly milspec either, and I suspect that a Bravo Company rifle is actually more milspec than a Colt today.

But on to the question; what makes Bushmaster so awful?

Like my A2 Bushmaster, this one has run flawlessly (even before I put any BCM parts in it). In thousands of rounds it has never misfired/jammed/etc, I can hit a soda can offhand at 100 yards with iron sights and I have astigmatisms in both eyes. This was true for my A2 as well, both proved to be well built and reliable guns.

My A2 however did have the BC Key staked when I purchased it, the M4orgery did not, I immediately rectified that issue along with the staking of the castle nut. That is basically the only real problem I have seen with the gun.

The fit and finish is (IMHO) as good as what I have seen on my Colts and other manufacturer's rifles. I have seen pictures floating around of supposed Bushmaster receivers that have lots of forge flash, and look like the drunken monkeys at Century Arms got at them with a Dremel tool, but I have never owned nor sold a Bushmaster that looked like that.

From what I gather the bulk of the Bushmaster gripes are

Barrel (not bad quality, just non-milspec material/twist rate)
No phosphate under FS
Non-M4 feed ramps
Many don't have F front sight
This/That/The Other is not HPT/MPI/WTF
Commercial receiver extension
Standard carbine buffer
Carrier Key not staked
Castle Nut not staked


While I think that Bushmaster should rectify the issues, especially the staking of parts that tend to come loose, realistically most of us could fix the bulk of the problems in our sleep.

There are manufacturers that to this day sell complete junk and I see almost no mention of them, but I'm not here to start a flame war so I won't go that direction.

Mind you, I'm not criticizing any manufacturers products, least of al Colts. I'm just curious, my experiences with Bushmaster have been good, but is there something I don't know?

[markm]

My gripe with bushmaster is that the sights aren't mil spec. Both Bushmaster uppers I've had sported out of spec Rear sight assemblies.

One was replaced, but the other is still bad. If I dial up elevation my POI moves right at about 1 MOA for every 2 MOA of elevation.

[TOrrock]

https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=7376

http://m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=13532&

Glad you like your Bushmaster.

There are several SME's here who had to deal with them as issued to PMC's in Iraq and Afghanistan who don't share your love.

Might want to do a search.....I know there's been more than one or two threads concerning this subject.

[Hmac]

For your needs, your Bushmaster may very well be "good enough". Others use their rifles hard and have higher standards - would rather pay a couple of hundred dollars more a get a rifle where corners weren't cut.

[justin_247]

The problem with Bushmaster is that they have the capability to easily rectify *all* of the issues that exist with their rifles and produce a reliable one, but time and again have instead opted to cut corners.

That rifle should be good-to-go straight out of the box, especially if you're catering to personnel who are putting their lives on the line and depend on their rifle. If they were just hobby guns that they're trying to sell to plinkers, that's one thing, but it's quite another when they're actively seeking out military and law enforcement customers.

It may suit *your* needs just fine, but it isn't suitable for those who are in the line of fire.

That's the problem with Bushmaster.

[The Cat]

While I think that Bushmaster should rectify the issues, especially the staking of parts that tend to come loose, realistically most of us could fix the bulk of the problems in our sleep.

They could, and should, and it would be dirt simple for them to do it. The fact that they don't is what urinates so many people off.

Also, these aren't really petty gripes. For instance, I thought the lack of parking under the fsb was nitpicky, until I pulled the fsb off a bushy barrel and saw that it was rustung.

[orionz06]

What carrier is it, semi or FA?

[C4IGrant]

First, all that matters is that you like your gun.

With that said, if you are REALLY interested in what is wrong with BM rifles, read this thread: https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=13532

If none of the above issues bother you (like the 1/9 twist barrel), then just drive on.

The biggest thing now is that you can get a mil-spec gun for about the same price as a BM. So the question is, why buy one??


C4

[JEL458]

OP, just out of curiosity, why do you prefer a 1/9 twist?

[M4orgery68]

Thanks for the replies, I'm going to review the links when I get a little more time.

As to a few questions I was asked: my carrier is what I have always called the semi-m16 carrier, it is like the m16 with the fully shrouded firing pin and fully enclosed rear, but with only about 3/4 the material length, when compared to the m16, at the rear where the auto sear would engage.

Why I like my 1 in 9: better accuracy with the smaller bullets I shoot, more versatile, better wear, and I don't shoot big ole tracers anyway, but I'm not involved in a war, so I can pick my rate.

If I'd had the option to buy a BCM when I bought this one I would have done that, then I wouldn't have had to switch anything, but they weren't on my radar in 2006. So I just replace the questionable stuff with BCM stuff.

REV: Just noticed C4IGrant's link posting; yep it bothers me, but like I stated, I fixed most of those problems, immediately and I replace what I don't like. Granted, you should not have to repair a brand new gun, but compared to fixing a Century AK, bringing a Bushmaster up to milspec is a walk in the park on a beautiful spring day.
That's why I asked this, I have had good luck with my guns, and quite frankly, while they don't see combat, I shoot the crap out of them, and have had not problems.

They do need to stop cutting corner with staking and testing. I understand that most of the newer Bushmasters have been using the M4 ramps and front sight, if that's the case, good for them.

Does anyone know about the crappy looking receivers though? That's what really got me thinking about this in the first place. I have seen quite a few pictures detailing this, and I have never held a BM that was not adequately milled/fininhed. Did they have major QC issues or something at some point?

[Spiffums]

I love my Bushmaster.......... I fixed it too!!. I put a BCM upper on it. :haha:


I honestly think it's the best looking roll mark so that is why I have 2 lowers.

[Iraqgunz]

Just when I thought I wasn't loved, along comes another Bushmaster thread.

Use the ORANGE search button at top and you can spend most of the day reading about Tier 1 Bushamsters.