Cheap Bolt Gun-Mosin 91

[Quick Stick]

I didn't want to hi-jack the on going thread about cheap scout rifles, as I am considering going with a Mosin 91. I'm not expecting a precision long gun out of this, just utility.

What are your guy's thoughts on the rifle. I don't have or ever really had a bolt gun and I'm new to this weapon.

The price on these are cheap as with the ammo. I would be wanting to chop the barrel to something shorter and put some type of optic on it.

What realistic range would this be good out to? With them being surplus, how durable are they? Would this be a wasted effort? Anyone done something similar?

[Avenger29]

Wasted effort. If you want a fun rifle and a piece of history, buy a Mosin and don't do anything to it but shoot it. Learn the irons. But don't try to make it into something it's not.


If you want a bolt rifle for a utility rifle (and maybe later more of a precision rifle), then buy something more modern. There are basic models of the Savage and Remington 700 series that will serve you very well, check out the Stevens 200, a very basic version of the Savage rifles.

[The Cat]

Wasted effort. If you want a fun rifle and a piece of history, buy a Mosin and don't do anything to it but shoot it. Learn the irons. But don't try to make it into something it's not.


If you want a bolt rifle for a utility rifle (and maybe later more of a precision rifle), then buy something more modern. There are basic models of the Savage and Remington 700 series that will serve you very well, check out the Stevens 200, a very basic version of the Savage rifles.


^^^ Absolutely right.

[Slater]

If you want a short-barreled Mosin, try one of the carbine versions (M44, M38, or M91/59). The downside is that nowadays they're more expensive than the M91/30's.

[a1fabweld]

Last year there was a guy who brought his scoped Mosin out to our 1K match. I somewhat watched him up until about 800-900 yds & he was actually on target at those distances with surplus ammo. I'm not sure if he grouped well, but he was scoring points. I was impressed.

[BamaM4]

I have not gotten my 91/30 or my M44s out to the range, yet, but all I have read....I am expecting them to be accurate. But the 1st responder is right, be sure to not try and make it something it is not. It's an old battle rifle, not meant for complications.

[SOTIC1993]

I had a FIN 39 that shot .25 to .5 MOA @100, engaged targets out to 725 meters,
photo of M39
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v198/FMSNIPER/47b3dc30b3127cce9e3011450f3c0000001.jpg
3 years ago I did a major work over on a FIN 39 replaced the barrel trued the action, replaced the trigger, stock and much more, bottom line is the other posters are on it, I have about 600.00 into the rifle not including the Sightron S3 scope. I only did it because I was stationed at NTC and well not a hell of allot more to do out there but use the rifle range and work 20 on 4 off..
here is the rifle.

originally I made this in all blue but recently changed it to silver and blue
it has M39 receiver, Rock solid mount, Sightron S3 scope, LW match barrel, richards microfit stock and I added a side safety timmeny trigger.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v198/FMSNIPER/P1030460.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v198/FMSNIPER/DSCN4848.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v198/FMSNIPER/IMG_0013-1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v198/FMSNIPER/IMG_0014-1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v198/FMSNIPER/IMG_0015.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v198/FMSNIPER/IMG_0017-1.jpg

[SHARP1983]

I think when you buy a Nagant you get a whole lot of rifle for very little money. I had a 91/30 that was a damn good shooter. Thought I could make it better my turning the bolt and adding a scope mount. If you're thinking of doing that DON'T because its not worth it. Ended up shooting worse afterwards. Went back to iron sights and still shot great. My only complaint about the one I had was it would knock your d#*k loose when you fired it. I intend to get a M44 here soon, always liked the "shorter" version.

[drrufo]

I bought a 44 from Big 5 sporting good store, got it on sale for 80 bucks. Kicks like hell, but I added a rubber shoulder boot and scope for the hell of it. It shoots softer with the boot but the scope doesn't want to zero so I might have to spend a little more range time to get it to ork right.

[v3n0m]

I agree with avenger 100%

[rojocorsa]

I stand by what Avenger said 100%.

Since I'm starting out, the Mosins are still my main weapons that I shoot.

I don't think the recoil is unreasonable, unless you exclusively shoot it on a bench. Also, I find that shooting Russian, Polish, etc. "light ball" also really helps. Though the heavy ball Yugo surplus is usually really nice and clean (and comes with a normal lead core); this load would probably be better for longer ranges. I want to say that the majority of the surplus ammo out there is usually FMJBT.

Or it could be that I am so used to these bolt action milsurps that I'm somewhat "immune" to recoil. Hell, the other day I tried shooting an M1A for the first time, and it felt like nothing. I guess that an AR with a battle comp would feel like air. (I've never shot an AR :eek: )

As far as the guns themselves go, in my experience, there really isn't anything wrong with the standard layout of the 91/30. People used them to shoot other people no problem for a long time, and they still do. It's a good gun, I really do think that.

It comes with basic AK style sights, a bolt that only consists of 7 parts, and shoots a powerful cartridge that doesn't cost too much. (Yes, while most are corrosive, I think the modern stuff from Russia costs the same as .308 or .30/06 surplus). The cartridge is pretty much like an Imperial Russian ".308" round. I would argue that it can match or even exceed .308 performance and compete head to head with 30/06 military loadings. These cartridges are really all in the same category.

The stock isn't the best, but it isn't the worst either. The LOP is reasonable, IMO. I am a lefty, and that short and straight bolt handle is perfect for southpaws. It's very easy to reach over and cycle the bolt. My guess is that for right handers, they'd probably do better with a bent bolt, but still...look how much these rifles cost. I wouldn't complain either way; they just happen to very compatible with me right now, in terms of price and usability. I'd like to believe that it shouldn't be too difficult to find a decent 91/30 with a decent bore--this will give you acceptable accuracy. Even when I shoot it (and I am not that experienced in marksmanship overall), all the groups I get are always "combat accurate." This is a combat rifle, not a fancy shmancy target rifle that is only going to be shot off a bench and cleaned every two rounds. This Russian iron is the AK of the bolt guns. That's why there's also no point in complaining about the triggers. For what they are, the triggers are fine. I could never understand why most people get all fussy about triggers, especially when it comes to combat arms. :rolleyes:

You may probably have heard of all the sticky bolt stories people have. I believe that this comes simply from having an improperly cleaned chamber with cosmoline in it. To dismiss these rifles because of their sticky bolt is only ignorant in my opinion. A lot of people also blame this on lacquer coated ammo, but I also think that's BS. I took out my second Mosin for a spin last Sunday. It only had a very small degree of sticky bolt (as I'd like to think I did a good job in getting 99% of the cosmo off it), and that little happened to me with brass cased ammo, so yeah. I cleaned it out, so I shouldn't have any more problems.

Also, don't worry about the rim on the cartridge. You won't get rimlock on a properly working Mosin. Just remember to push the cartridges all the way down and to cycle the bolt like you got a pair. Lastly, in my limited experience, I've come to learn that these guns prefer to be lubed rather than dry. At least all my ejection issues were gone after I made sure to oil around the bolt head where the extractor is. The tolerances on the receiver are usually generous, and the bolt slides around easily this is a good thing. I heard that German Mauser bolts during the Stalingrad winters seized up. These bolts? Not so much...

When I first got my first 91/30 (I own two), I thought of how I was going to upgrade and modify the shit out of it--this was the weeks before I shot it. Then I shot it. Sound familiar like all those guys who want to gucci up their ARs and whatnot? The rule of thumb is the same: Just Shoot it.

That rifle is in my safe and it's still the same. Will I touch my [much nicer] second Mosin? Hell the **** no!

One drawback is that it's apparently difficult to find good clips for it these days. But overall, I think Mosins are very much worth owning. Even a roughly-machined WWII darkest hour rifle will work fine because the inside is still machined properly. I own a gun like that.

I can keep going on and on about these, but the bottom line is that a stock Mosin in the hands of someone who knows what they're doing is something not to be taken lightly. I mean, how many times do our boys have to duck and cover from some Talib taking pot shots with WWI era Enfields? Imagine if those bastards actually knew how really shoot. :eek:

I have to say that SOTIC1993 has done a wonderful job on his Mosin. Usually more people **** these up than really improve them. Especially because I always see a lot of cheap gun show shit on them from the usual suspect brands (UTG, NCstar, etc) :suicide2:

Anyhow, here is my input on a gun I actually own and have experience with. I don't know of any other guns where you get this much firepower for that much cost.

http://7.62x54r.net/ is a great web resource, but it is oriented more towards the collector than anyone else. Though the best part of it is where they do all the ammo performance evaluation of all commonly available surplus. These all include ballistic charts.


eta:One last thing that I wanted to add is that I personally wish I could get more experience shooting at realistic targets somewhere that isn't a standard public range that only goes out to 200 yds and is primarily meant for people to shoot their hunting rifles off benches. But I'll make do with what I have for now. Oh, and the standard Soviet websling isn't half bad--especially as a "hasty" sling. It's still doesn't compare to a real USGI websling, of course.