First AR

[Growler67]

So I have been interested in doing this for some time now but due to finances and other things cropping up, it has continually been put on a back burner. I first started looking into this 6-7 years ago. Based on my experience in the Army I wanted a "sealed" upper. Rapid cycling or the occasional hot round would send that blast of gas through the opening at the charging handle and right into my eye. I got out after the Gulf War if that is pertinent for some. Eye protection mandate wasn't implimented Army wide at that time as it is now.

So when I started the only options I found were the ASA left side charging upper and the XCR. The XCR was brand new and uber expensive, well at least well out on my affordable range. ASA at the time was having its issues with QC and CS. No need to rehash. I've been keeping track of ASA over the years and have still sought the benefits (as I perceived them) with their side charging upper. My concept began to take form. I was looking at two builds; a 20 or 24 inch tack driver and a CQB. This one will be the CQB.

So with the ASA upper I want I looked into all the rest of the goodies available out there for the rest of the build. Reading here and elsewhere I determined there are two basic trains of thought. One is to build from scratch in one is inclined and has the resources (workbench with a vise and so on), the other is to buy a pre-built (or pre-built upper and lower assemblies) and swap out the components to "customize" it to suit ones needs/wants. I am mechanically capable and inclined to go the first route, but having moved recently and about to do so again, I do not have a workbench in the garage to be able to pull it off - the right way without marring my bits and such or worse. So I am tredding the path of the pre-built.

Anyway, over the years new and kewl things have come into the market as well as a myriad of options for each category of add-on. Stocks, muzzle breaks, EBR's, sights and so on. Though I don't have ALL my answers and bits listed I've gotten this far. Right now this is how the vision of my CQB "concept" is crystalizing:

ASA M4A3 (complete) Flat top (http://www.americanspiritarms.com/products/ASA_M4A3G_AR_15_Rifle_M4_Carbine-3-1.html)
MagPul CTR (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=509)
Smith Enterprise AR Style Comp/Muzzle Break (http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/sid=31063/pid=12789/Product/_223_Muzzle_Brake)
ASA Quad Rail (http://www.americanspiritarms.com/products/Carbine_Quad_Rail-121-4.html)
DD 16" Lightweight barrel (1:7) (https://danieldefense.com/cold-hammer-forged-barrels/16-5-56mm-lightweight-carbine-chf-barrel-stripped.html)
YM LITE BCG (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=509)
Phase 5 Tactical EBR #100-004-899 (http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/sid=61177/pid=31943/Product/EBRv2_Extended_Bolt_Release)A little Bling (http://www.molonlabeshop.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=19&products_id=44&zenid=1798c923c57e84b379397c7df315be6b)
ERGO Grip (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=1242)

I will say that I have had nothing but great service from any of the vendors I have contacted with questions, inquiries or orders. I will not name names but I have been impressed and will not hesitate to recommend any of them that I have had experience with. Top notch folks across the country. I have to decide which BUIS I am going to go with along with sling and other such things. Riding the fence on drop in triggers at the moment too.

I'm probably a couple of weeks from dropping bones on the whole project though I do have a few of the parts listed above. ASA does install customer provided parts and so once I have all of my add-ons and stuff I can ship the one time to ASA for my build. I'm sure I've forgotten to mention a thing or three and likely haven't considered a thing or three else. Use will be range, zombie extermination and eventually some limited varminting - nothing over 200 meters though. Optics aren't on my shopping list just yet, I figure the flip up irons I decide on will meet my immediate needs while I consider my optic options. What do you with more experince in AR's think so far?

[jonconsiglio]

What's wrong with the barrel included with the ASA? I own(ed) three side chargers, 2 SCARs and a LWRC REPR that is gone. The SCAR is it's own design and I like it fine. I see no need for converting an AR to a side charger, especially for the reasons you stated.

I think you need to just go for a basic rifle from a quality manufacturer then go from there. This is just. I hav no experience with the ASA. It just doesn't seem like the way to go. Other stuff is fine if when weighing your options, those were the ones with the most pros.

EDIT - I don't see a need for the brake really and definitely could go for a different bolt carrier group. Why do you feel you need that particular BCG? I'd go for a DD, Colt BCM or LMT auto carrier.


Good luck with the purchase.

[Growler67]

Nothing with the barrel that would come with, I just visited Rainier Arms the other day and was introduced to the DD Lightweight and was terribly impressed with the lack of weight. Going for a lightweight CQB built this time out the gate. The muzzle break is to help mitigate muzzle flip, it being lightweight and all.

I appreciate the input and feedback.

[jonconsiglio]

I'd really suggest just getting a Daniel Defense lightweight upper. As for the comp, if it has ANY defensive use at all, I'd strongly suggest a standard flash hider or a BattleComp if you really want the brake. The BattleComp with greatly reduce the muzzle rise but will also spare you of the concussion associated with most other gaming brakes like, which is what classification the Smith is in, I believe.

There's a great ongoing thread in the AR General Discussion subforum about the BattleComp.

I think you're headed in the right direction.

[Growler67]

Thanks for the input. I'll look again for the thread you mentioned when I get home from work.

[Clarkm]

I like your barrel choice. But personally I hate the ergo grip. I hate it!! Actually I like the .mil grip, the MOE grip, the MIAD grip and the Tango Down grip about equally. I know the MIAD has sharper edges for a better bite but I havenot found that itmatters.

As for the BCG, why a lite?

[Growler67]

I asked about the grips on another forum and was seeking a comparison from personal experience there. I am familiar with the Hogue products as I have them on most of my handguns. I wanted to know what the "feel" difference there was. I got a couple of good responses but still didn't have enough information to make an "informed decision". When I went to Rainier Arms the other day, they had several including the Hogue and ERGo on display. I did a touchy feely for myself and validated some of the comments i got. The rubber that Hogue uses is "tackier" in feel where the ERGO is grippier due to their molded stippling.

I have big hands and I liked the girth of the ERGO too, it just felt better in my hand. The A2 style and others were a bit narrow, like a 1911 compared to my double stack SiG's. My hands prefer the double stack over the 1911 and I learned long ago, what fits and feels comfortable - one shoots more "naturally' with. I'm just translating it to rifles is all and the ERGo felt best.

As for the LITE BCG, again, going for a lightweight build. I may not be the only one shooting this and I'm taking some other factors into consideration. That BCG also ups the cyclic rate a bit and the weight added overall with the heavier buffer is mitigated by the fact that that weight is at the rear and in the most supported area of the weapon. I'm trying to reduce as much as I can from the front and center areas. Any additional weight that HAS to be added I'm trying to keep it as much to the rear as I can.

Thanks for the input and picking my brain. Keep 'em coming, it's all appreciated.

[Iraqgunz]

Most all of what you have selected is a FAIL. I encourage you to do some research and look at other options. The side charger is not something that I would look for, for a serious use weapon.

The cyclic rate "upping" is going to be rather insignificant since you are going to be shooting semi-auto. Correct?

Get a BCM lightweight hammer forged upper and add an MOE handguard with rail sections where you need them. I also encourage you to use an auto BCG.

[Growler67]

"FAIL" seems so finite. So having features similar to an HK MP5 isn't something you would look for? - being able to charge the weapon from the ready/up position. In a conventional AR setup, one has to drop the weapon from the cheek weld to charge it with (in my case) my right hand which is my firing hand. With the side charger the weapon can reamin in the ready/up position and be charged with my support hand.

This build is intended as fun and practical and not duty use. It has the features I have sought and I have considered many factors, not all of which I have discloed here. I realize that my time in the Army probably doesn't compare to your training and experience in the sand box, but I've done quite a bit of research. I am not discounting your input but I have considered the pros and cons of this system.

Thanks for your comments and thank you for your service.

[Iraqgunz]

Enjoy your purchase and keep us informed on how it works for you.


"FAIL" seems so finite. So having features similar to an HK MP5 isn't something you would look for? - being able to charge the weapon from the ready/up position. In a conventional AR setup, one has to drop the weapon from the cheek weld to charge it with (in my case) my right hand which is my firing hand. With the side charger the weapon can reamin in the ready/up position and be charged with my support hand.

This build is intended as fun and practical and not duty use. It has the features I have sought and I have considered many factors, not all of which I have discloed here. I realize that my time in the Army probably doesn't compare to your training and experience in the sand box, but I've done quite a bit of research. I am not discounting your input but I have considered the pros and cons of this system.

Thanks for your comments and thank you for your service.

[C4IGrant]

"FAIL" seems so finite. So having features similar to an HK MP5 isn't something you would look for? - being able to charge the weapon from the ready/up position. In a conventional AR setup, one has to drop the weapon from the cheek weld to charge it with (in my case) my right hand which is my firing hand. With the side charger the weapon can reamin in the ready/up position and be charged with my support hand.

This build is intended as fun and practical and not duty use. It has the features I have sought and I have considered many factors, not all of which I have discloed here. I realize that my time in the Army probably doesn't compare to your training and experience in the sand box, but I've done quite a bit of research. I am not discounting your input but I have considered the pros and cons of this system.

Thanks for your comments and thank you for your service.


As IZ stated many of the items are less than ideal. The DD barrel is a great choice though.

Charging the weapon when shouldered? Why? Shouldn't the weapon already be chambered and safety on before shouldering it? Sorry, not following this logic (and have an MP5 and HK53 type weapons).

I am not sure how much research you have done on THIS forum because if you had, I am not sure you would choose any of the items you selected.

At the end of the day, it is your money so buy what you like.

C4

[Iraqgunz]

See my comments.

ASA M4A3 (complete) Flat top- Again, why? Your logic isn't sound. I have also been to their factory and examined how they build stuff.

MagPul CTR- Make sure you get a Milspec stock and tube and not commercial

Smith Enterprise AR Style Comp/Muzzle Break- Have you researched this choice?

ASA Quad Rail- Look carefully. This is a YHM rail system and they are worthless. Unless you don't plan on using the weapon.

DD 16" Lightweight barrel (1:7)- Great choice. Don't couple it with crap.

YM LITE BCG- Another questionable choice and not something I would choose for a serious rifle/ carbine.

Phase 5 Tactical EBR #100-004-899A little Bling- Are you familiar with this gadget? Have you trained with it before? Do you really need it?

ERGO Grip- Personal preference.

[hunt_ak]

ASA Quad Rail- Look carefully. This is a YHM rail system and they are worthless. Unless you don't plan on using the weapon.

YM LITE BCG- Another questionable choice and not something I would choose for a serious rifle/ carbine.

Can you elaborate on the YHM rail system being worthless? Is it the mounting system? Something else?

Also, is your beef with the Y/M Lite or Y/M BCGs as a whole?

[mikeahe]

I can't disagree with anything IG said, he was much more restrained than I was going to be.

Check out the stickies at the top of both General Discussion and the Technical Discussion. You will have all of your questions answered.

[hunt_ak]

I can't disagree with anything IG said, he was much more restrained than I was going to be.

Check out the stickies at the top of both General Discussion and the Technical Discussion. You will have all of your questions answered.

I've got more days worth of reading on here to do and was wondering if a quick reply would've sufficed, but I get your drift...

[Iraqgunz]

The way they mount to the weapon among other things. As for the BCG, simply because it's a lite. Neutered BCG's belong in the trash.


Can you elaborate on the YHM rail system being worthless? Is it the mounting system? Something else?

Also, is your beef with the Y/M Lite or Y/M BCGs as a whole?