View Full Version : Trigger Job
I want to put a match trigger in my m4. Where can one be found without paying $300?
Timney Comp. triggers are about $200.
The Geissele S2S is $125 and the Geissele SSA is $170. The SSA is well regarded and so far the S2S is getting good reviews. If you search, there are a few threads about the Geissele triggers on here.
What rifle?
What do you do with that rifle?
What type of optic, magnified or non-magnified?
What is your budget, we know it isn't $300?
Do you want a single stage or a two stage trigger?
What rifle?
What do you do with that rifle?
What type of optic, magnified or non-magnified?
What is your budget, we know it isn't $300?
Do you want a single stage or a two stage trigger?
I was gonna ask the same thing.
His post count and lack of knowledge of where to find a trigger says he is new to AR's.
Have you got a rifle?
Have you shot it yet?
If not, why do you think you need a Match (or aftermarket) trigger?
Forgive me if I am wrong, its just an odd question if someone is familiar with the AR platform
Gunn-Fighter
07-06-11, 19:01
You can find good deals in the equipment exchange section
I was gonna ask the same thing.
His post count and lack of knowledge of where to find a trigger says he is new to AR's.
Have you got a rifle?
Have you shot it yet?
If not, why do you think you need a Match (or aftermarket) trigger?
Forgive me if I am wrong, its just an odd question if someone is familiar with the AR platform
Yes I have an AR rifle and I do shoot it as often as I can. I have been doing some long range shooting, which I am new too. I figured the lighter the trigger the more accurate one can shoot (less motion). There are so many out there that I was just wanting some help trying to narrow the field. I'm not sure if I want a two stage or a single stage. Any suggestions would be appreciated.
Yes I have an AR rifle and I do shoot it as often as I can. I have been doing some long range shooting, which I am new too. I figured the lighter the trigger the more accurate one can shoot (less motion). There are so many out there that I was just wanting some help trying to narrow the field. I'm not sure if I want a two stage or a single stage. Any suggestions would be appreciated.
I would suggest you save $200 on a trigger and buy ammo and go shoot at the range. I use plain old boring mil-spec combat triggers in my rifles and I have no problem hitting at 300yds. Trust me.
Gunn-Fighter
07-08-11, 17:24
The Hogan Gold standard can be had for around 200 bucks and it comes with KNS anti rotation pins
http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c275/lucksthename/DSC_0013-8.jpg
http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c275/lucksthename/DSC_0011-8.jpg
http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c275/lucksthename/DSC_0017-8.jpg
To tell you what you need without knowing any particulars of your situation, would be disingenuous. Keep shooting, try someone else's equipment, ask others like you have here. But remember to do your research and keep your bs filter on. I learned that the hard way. Shoot more, learn more, then decide for yourself.
There is nothing wrong with not knowing, thats why youre here and why you asked. If you want to spend a couple hundred dollars on something you DO NOT NEED...then by all means.
This thread has recently been resurected and there is some very good information that puts your current situation in perspective.
I highly recommend it...to you sir...free of charge
http://m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=28658
There is nothing wrong with not knowing, thats why youre here and why you asked. If you want to spend a couple hundred dollars on something you DO NOT NEED...then by all means.
This thread has recently been resurected and there is some very good information that puts your current situation in perspective.
I highly recommend it...to you sir...free of charge
http://m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=28658
I thank you very much sir.
Any suggestions would be appreciated.
Send your trigger and $45 to Bill Springfield. Search this forum and elsewhere for evaluations of his work and his contact info.
All of the standard AR triggers I've shot (not many, I admit) were unacceptably gritty and heavy. After Springfield worked his magic, mine is now wonderful.
Send your trigger and $45 to Bill Springfield. Search this forum and elsewhere for evaluations of his work and his contact info.
All of the standard AR triggers I've shot (not many, I admit) were unacceptably gritty and heavy. After Springfield worked his magic, mine is now wonderful.
That sounds like it might be what I am looking for. I don't like the gritty feeling either. I have seen on other forums people cutting and polishing on the trigger assembly. That is something if I tried myself, would wind up costing me alot more than 45 bucks.
That sounds like it might be what I am looking for...
I've posted this in another thread about Springfield's trigger jobs, but I'll say it again here:
I originally thought I'd gamble $45 on a Springfield trigger job while I saved my lunch money for a Giessele.
After my trigger came back from Springfield I was so happy with it that I decided I didn't need a different trigger, after all...
No disrespect to anybody who spent $150 on a new trigger, but I just didn't see the point.
a 'good' trigger is indeed, helpful in accuracy, but in the end, YOU, the shooter, determine overall performance.
IMO, i go to my BA precision, rifles if i want precision, long range shots.
(and, I'm NOT saying an M4 cannot be precision, either.)
a 'good' trigger is indeed, helpful in accuracy, but in the end, YOU, the shooter, determine overall performance.
IMO, i go to my BA precision, rifles if i want precision, long range shots.
(and, I'm NOT saying an M4 cannot be precision, either.)
As of now I am just getting started in the long range shooting. If I can get out to 500-600 yards tahat would suite me fine for now. As far as the springfield trigger goes, does anybody know about what kind of turn around time it is?
There is no way in hell I would trust a bill springfield trigger job....esp. as of the last few years. That's just not good advice at all, and I hope people don't listen to it...no offense.
There is a reason ussocom uses Geissele triggers rather than sending their g.i. type triggers to Bill Springfield.
I have just finished reading some posts about Bill Springfield and there are some good ones. However, some of the problems people have been having is nerve racking and scary. I don't know about it now.
a 'good' trigger is indeed, helpful in accuracy, but in the end, YOU, the shooter, determine overall performance.
Again, all of the "standard" AR triggers I've shot were distractingly gritty and creepy.
Could I shoot with them? Yes. Was it pleasurable to do so, or easy to shoot accurately? No.
Given all the attention paid on this forum to other "fit" issues like pistol grips, foreends, buttstocks, and the "feel" issues with secondary controls like ambidextrous safties, bolt releases, mag releases, flashlight switches, etc. etc. etc. it seems like improving the single most important control (the trigger) is well worth it.
Could I shoot without a decent cheekweld, or with an uncomfortable pistol grip, or operate the gun with an awkward mag release or bolt catch? Yes. Would it be better to fix them? Yes.
As far as the springfield trigger goes, does anybody know about what kind of turn around time it is?
He turned mine around within a week... you contact him ahead of time to let him know it's coming, and he does it right away.
I've seen some of the stories of failures with Springfield trigger jobs, but they seemed to be few and far between, and I've seen legions of positive reviews.
LMT has a pretty solid trigger.
This last post is the best advice you have got so far, IMO. I had my LMT trigger done by Mr. Springfield but didn't like it. To be fair tho, I was used to a Krieger/Milazzo in my Service rifle. LMT now sports a JP Rifles trigger. All that being said, Giesselle would be my choice now.
I have a Bill S. trigger on one of my AR's and it feels good, crisp and consistent. I have been using this trigger for about 2 years with 6000+ rounds on this 16" carbine.
I decided to go a different route on all my other AR's since I like the feel of a take-up / break for precise shooting when the situation calls for this.
With some ruby stones and diamond compound I was able to bring all my single stage triggers to work as I described above with very, very little material removal while removing grittiness and creep.
To find what works for you requires time behind the wheel and in the situations you would be required to use the gun. I can't give you the correct item to purchase just a suggestion to try a few styles while training.
BufordTJustice
07-11-11, 16:26
Here's one for Geissele. I just installed an SD-C (It's got the 'guts' of an SSA and a flat trigger bow).
I've used a Springfield trigger. Based on feel alone, the Geissele is still obviously better (and crisper). The bonus is that it is ALSO a full-fledged combat-ready trigger...tolerant of drops, shock, fouling and mud in ways that other 'match' trigger could never be.
Buy once cry once....get a Geissele and be done with it. If you shoot one, you'll be ruined for all but a KAC unit. It's that good.
I personally recommend the 4.5lb SSA or SD-C (same guts, SSA has a round trigger bow, SD-C has a flat one). I don't recommend a lighter pull like one of the 3.5lb models for defensive/duty use....and you won't need one.
EDIT: I should also note that I've got several thousand rounds through my AR using my stock trigger before the upgrade. If you haven't had at least 2K rounds through it, it's difficult for you to really understand what you want.
Lastly, if this gun is for defensive use...getting an adjustable trigger on a combat gun is not acceptable. LMT, Geissele, or KAC tirgger that is non-adjustable is the best option.
Here's one for Geissele. I just installed an SD-C (It's got the 'guts' of an SSA and a flat trigger bow).
Is this absolutely true? I was under the impression they had more differences.
In any even I just put in an SD-E and it is great. That said I would prefer it to be a bit heavier though it is a perfect match for my primary HD pistol. If the SD-C is a pound heavier but I have not tried it to feel how clean it breaks.
I replaced my stock Colt trigger because it was VERY heavy and super gritty. I moly greased it and it helped a bit, but it made transitioning to my pistol unnerving because that trigger is so much lighter. My friend just bought S&W and the stock trigger is great. ZERO creep and about 6-7lbs.
I own and have shot many firearms with custom triggers. Geissele's are outstanding.
I don't have but about 1000rnds thru mine, but I really don't like the stock trigger. It just don't feel right to me since my other rifles don't feel that way.
The factory LMT single stage triggers have been all I needed for a randy cain carbine 1 class that included 200 yard shots. I have them on an SBR and a 16" carbine. I don't see any need to change them.
Having shot precision .308 bolt guns at 1000+, I think that is where the change is needed. I have just ordered a Geissele DMR for my LMT MWS which I will be shooting to +/- 800.
I think I am going to go wit the $125 Geissele. I checked it out and think that is my best bet.
BufordTJustice
07-11-11, 22:50
Is this absolutely true? I was under the impression they had more differences.
That is what the folks at Geissele told me. Not only are they identical, the pulls feel identical except that the SD-C has the flat bow and this really does reduce the perceived trigger pull. I tended to grip the trigger more toward the toe...the SD-C let me put it exactly where is most comfortable for me (just above the toe). If you put your finger in the same spot on both triggers...there is essentially no difference.
I love that I can have my refinement and eat my reliability too. :D
Other than LMT or KAC, I don't know of a battle ready trigger that is as refined and reliable as the SSA/SD-C.
That is what the folks at Geissele told me. Not only are they identical, the pulls feel identical except that the SD-C has the flat bow and this really does reduce the perceived trigger pull. I tended to grip the trigger more toward the toe...the SD-C let me put it exactly where is most comfortable for me (just above the toe). If you put your finger in the same spot on both triggers...there is essentially no difference.
I love that I can have my refinement and eat my reliability too. :D
Other than LMT or KAC, I don't know of a battle ready trigger that is as refined and reliable as the SSA/SD-C.
I thought they said the trigger was a little forward on the SD line. In any event, I really like the the flat trigger too.
BufordTJustice
07-12-11, 01:32
I thought they said the trigger was a little forward on the SD line. In any event, I really like the the flat trigger too.
It might be, but the folks at Geissele didn't mention that to me when I was on the phone with them and I specifically asked about the differences between the two (It was between the SSA and SD-C for me). Since the trigger pulls feel so similar, and the listed weights are the same, I don't think they moved it forward enough to affect the pull weight. I A-B'd mine w/ my buddy's SSA and neither he nor I could tell a difference in pull weight when using similar finger placement.
They are both listed with identical pull-weight specs per their break-down sheet, as well. I could be wrong though.
They are simply great folks over there at GA and I'm sure they would clarify via email or a phone call if you wanted to contact them.
Both the SSA and SD-C are a cut above the rest. I have not tried the S2S (the $125 model), so I can't comment on that one.
EDIT: I'm wrong. I read through Trident's thread here
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=65283
It is clearly stated that the bow had been moved forward about 1/8th of an inch relative to the SD line, per member 'sagmill'.
Sounds like a fantastic decision to me:)
If you pick one up, and remember...drop us some feedback in the S2S thread I started once you put some time on it.
I love mine thus far, and they have been flawless in use to date.
No problem will do. I hope to get to order on payday. Fingers crossed.:D
Southpaw2011
07-21-11, 19:30
Timney Comp. triggers are about $200.
I second the vote on the Timney AR10 Trigger, it is precise and flawless in my pair of Lewis Machine & Tool LM308MWSE, i get extremely close target shots and groups since i installed these drop in triggers and they feel great!
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