View Full Version : FNX 40 Vs. Beretta 96A1
azairman86
07-06-11, 05:55
I've been looking into either getting a Beretta 96A1 or an FNX 40 for some time now and I'm really at a draw. Both seem like Excellent hand guns and just wanted to know what others thought about them and maybe which one would be better. The only real advantage I think the FNX has is the higher capacity and the safety decocker not on the slide. But I'm very comfortable with a Beretta and I love their reliability and accuracy. Does anyone have any ideas?
crazymoose
07-06-11, 07:54
I've only shot the FN in 9mm and .45, so I can't speak to long term durability and reliability, but they seemed like well thought-out, decent guns. The Beretta 92 is not a firearm which fares the transition to .40 S&W well at all. I've read numerous reports online, and known a couple of guys forced to carry them on duty. They have a bad and apparently well-deserved reputation for fragility.
I think the jury is still out on the FNX, although it seems like a good gun. The three plastic guns I'd consider first in .40 would be the HK USP/P30 series, the Glock (late 3rd or 4th gen.), and the M&P. All of them are pretty well known quantities at this point. The Glock has had some issues in the past in this caliber, and I still hear about a few here and there, but there are a metric shitload of Glock 22's in police holsters across the U.S. That in and of itself is not a guarantee that it's a quality gun, but it does give a pretty good sample size as far as determining what's wrong and right with the weapon.
The 96A1 is a new design Beretta 92. The slight is just a little beefier than a standard Beretta 96. And, it also has a new recoil buffer built in. I think the design is sturdier than a standard Beretta 96 would be.
I have 8 Beretta 92s, and I love the platform. So, I would suggest getting that.
ALso, if you change your recoil spring every 4-5k, along with your trigger return spring every 5k, you will be fine.
As for the FNX - I would be worried about this issue:
http://fnforum.net/fnx-9-apparently-won-t-fire-when-it-s-warm-outside-vid-t28121.html
azairman86
07-06-11, 10:59
Wow, that is a major defect. And where I live that is definitly a malfunction I would not want to have happen. As for the M&P and the glock, I'm looking for something with a hammer that can be decocked and has a manual safety which is why I was asking about these two.
azairman86
07-06-11, 11:10
What about the FNP 40? Does anyone have experiance with that?
Wow, that is a major defect. And where I live that is definitly a malfunction I would not want to have happen. As for the M&P and the glock, I'm looking for something with a hammer that can be decocked and has a manual safety which is why I was asking about these two.
That screams Heckler & Koch to me...
What about the FNP 40? Does anyone have experiance with that?
I owned one once - in 9mm. The FNP quite often, but not always, needs a break in period for the recoil spring. Some need to hand cycle the gun and leave the slide back a week or two in order to minimize issues on your first range trip. I would recommend doing that.
Also, the FNP series has suffered from weak mag springs in the past. This may be fixed. FN would replace the mags easily when they would stop locking the slide back on an empty mag.
But, there were/are no after market mag springs for FN handgun magazines. Until there is, I wouldn't consider an FNP. And, that heat complaint about the FNX (I linked above) seems to be a show stopper for me.
I personally would look at the PX4 Storm Beretta. Its my fav 40 cal handgun. I prev owned one in 40, and now have a 9mm Storm. I'm not a 40 cal fan, personally. BUt, the PX4 is the only one I'd ever buy again if I wanted a 40 cal gun again.
To echo what Shipwreck said, I have 2 of the 90-Two pistols in .40s&w. One is at 1400rnds right now, the other at just over 2k. No problems and very minimal wear when compared to the original 96 platform. I had the frame on an original 96 crap out at 3200-3600rnds. The 96A1 has all the upgrades to better handle the .40 round. Seems like they really did their homework before bringing it back.
Two of my friends picked up the FN pistols in 9 and 40, and had some minor feeding issues, traced back to the weak mag spring issues. I believe they are running fine after new springs. In reading more on the FNP, seems there are still growing pains to overcome. The FNX as well, especially after reading about the heat issues!
The 96A1 is a new design Beretta 92. The slight is just a little beefier than a standard Beretta 96. And, it also has a new recoil buffer built in. I think the design is sturdier than a standard Beretta 96 would be.
I have 8 Beretta 92s, and I love the platform. So, I would suggest getting that.
ALso, if you change your recoil spring every 4-5k, along with your trigger return spring every 5k, you will be fine.
As for the FNX - I would be worried about this issue:
http://fnforum.net/fnx-9-apparently-won-t-fire-when-it-s-warm-outside-vid-t28121.html
As a guy who carried a 96D Brigadier for several years my advice is to avoid the Beretta. You can reinforce the slide all day long, our Brigadiers had reinforced slides but Beretta has done nothing, and can't really do anything to the frame and that was where we had our problems and you'll have yours. The frames crack. If you hold a Beretta with the slide removed in your right hand and look at the corner of the magwell on the right side, next to the breachblock, that is where the frames crack. Our 96D's were 5,000 round guns. They were so bad that they did not last the typical 5 year intended life-cycle and were replaced by HK USPc's early. If your Beretta broke on the range and they'd hand you an HK and a new holster. I have fired the FNP in 9mm but not the FNX in .40. There is a lot to like in the platform but I'd prefer a LEM or striker fired trigger system.
To the OP, is the decocker that important to you? If so, why?
RE: the 'shooting in the heat' issue, I've been shooting mine with heat indexes of 105+ regularly with no issues...and the gun will heat up far beyond that if you shoot it much, whether its summer or winter. I think this was some early issue that FNH has fixed in the production line, as well as fixed for free for the very few people who have had that issue. The Glock 19 Gen4, with it's legendary reliability, has been having ten times the issues of most pistols on the market (or had been when I bought my FNX). As we all know, there is a very large demographic on message boards of people who are purely on them to complain ;)
And while the FNX-9 is my favorite handgun I've ever shot, I don't consider myself biased, nor am I a fanboy. It fits my hand perfectly and mine hasn't had a misfire of any sort yet, after probably 500-600 rounds minimum...inside, outside in the heat, outside in the cold, once in the rain, no issues yet. I'd go to a local gun store and see which fits your hand better, and buy it.
mkmckinley
07-06-11, 21:01
I haven't used a .40 Beretta but I've seen several M9s break locking blocks using NATO 9mm. I'm not sure I'd want one in .40 S&W if I was going to be doing much shooting. I'm guessing from your screen name that you have some military experience and may want to stick with what Uncle Sam loaned you. However unless you have some really compelling reason to get a Beretta you might want to pick a different platform, different caliber, or both.
azairman86
07-07-11, 05:26
The decocker is mostly just something I'd like to have rather than need to have. I like the idea of carrying with the hammer down so the hammer spring doesnt have as much tension on it. I have an XDm 40 so I'm familiar with the striker platform but I just like the having DA/SA. I'm very comfortable with the M9 and love its reliability and when I looked into the 96A1 and saw all the upgrades they made to it in order to withstand the 40 S&W it really perked my interest however they are slightly on the larger side which is why I looked at the FNX cause it seemed like a slightly smaller frame.
azairman86
07-07-11, 05:54
Other than looks, what is the difference between the 96A1 and the 90-Two?
Other than looks, what is the difference between the 96A1 and the 90-Two?
Here is something I previously typed comparing the 92A1 to the 90-Two... Just interchange the number 92A1 with 96A1... The same will apply:
-------
90-Two - Commonly known as the "90-Dash-Two" or "The Dash." This is a redesigned version of the 92FS that came out in 2006. The slide and frame were redesigned. The guiderod is captured, and there is a recoil buffer built into the frame. It also has a front, dovetailed sight. Several of the small parts are totally different from the standard 92 design (hammer, mag release, trigger bar, slide safety switches).
The biggest difference is the grip. While the gun is not polymer, it does come with a polymer, slip on grip. This gun will be in limited production for 2011 (so get one now if you want one). There is hardly any aftermarket support, and the lack of aftermarket grips is really hurting sales. These are ONLY made in Italy. Available in 9mm and 40 cal. The gun comes with factory 17 round mags (in 9mm)
(I personally do not like the polymer grip - too slippery. I tried several solutions to this issue, but found none worthwhile)
92A1 - Newest release of the 92 - Released in the summer of 2010. This design takes some of the best aspects of the 90-Two... The rail, internal recoil buffer and dovetailed front sight (all great changes), and puts it into a more "normal" 92 frame. The 92A1 (and 96A1) will use standard Beretta 92 grips. The trigger guard is curved; however, like that of the 90-Two. The guiderod is also captured (which is a pro or con, depending on who you ask).
In addition - the slide is a little bit beefier than a standard 92 slide.
The gun is available in 9mm and 40 cal (the 96A1), and the 9mm version comes with THREE 17 round factory mags (the same mags that come with the 90-Two). These guns are only made in Italy.
This is a such better choice to the 90-TWO, IMHO. Also, the 92A1 balances the best in a 1 handed grip out of any of the railed models. I also personally find the 92A1 is my second fav Beretta 92 variant - right behind the standard 92FS (which balances the best 1 handed, IMHO).
There is also finally aftermarket night sights for the 92A1 from Trijicon now. And, while others may disagree - I personally like the regular front and rear strap serrations over the checkering on the M9A1. The checkering is rather shallow - so its not nearly as grippy as checkering on a 1911. I think the standard serrations on the front and back strap give a better grip.
azairman86
07-07-11, 06:52
So in your opinion, would you pick the 92A1 or the 96A1 and why? I see the potential in both calibers but would like to get as many opinions as I can
What about the FNP 40? Does anyone have experiance with that?
I bought one in 2008, right after I graduated from college. I haven't shot a large number of rounds through it but I don't have anything bad to say about it. It fits my hands well, shoots well, and has had zero malfunctions to date (again, not a lot of rounds). Soon after I bought the FNP-40, and just before I enrolled in my first training class, I purchased an M&P9fs. Because of the cost of ammo I shot the M&P and have stuck to striker fired handguns since.
Why is the P30 not a contender?
So in your opinion, would you pick the 92A1 or the 96A1 and why? I see the potential in both calibers but would like to get as many opinions as I can
I'd pick the 92A1... I used to want the biggest bullet, and tended to go with the 45 because of that. I never cared for the 40 - to me, it has more felt recoil than a 45.
However, after reading a lot and seeing tests and such - all bullets really suck as man stoppers. They make tiny wholes.
It is shot placement that counts. I can shoot 9mm more accurately, on a more consistent basis, than 45 or 40. So, between that and ammo costs, I just decided to go all 9mm.
In 9mm, you won't have any issues with the 92 series if you change the recoil spring every 4 to 5k rounds, and the trigger return spring every 5k.
EVERY gun, including Glocks, will have some internal spring or something break down the line, if you don't do preventative maintenance with periodic small parts replacement. So, don't let that put you off.
As for the caliber - the tiny difference in size increase in a good brand of JHP doesn't really seem to be that much in real world tests. I'm fine with 9mm.
I have eight 92 variants currently, and have owned several others over the years... So, I have a lot of experience with the model. ANd, it's actually very easy to modify the gun and/or change out parts.
Hell, there are some simple videos online that show you how to strip the frame and replace parts. I am no gunsmith - far from it. But, from watching those vids 1x a few years back, I can quite easily work on the guns...
And, a simple $6 "D" spring (a factory part, and a spring that was originally used in the DAO variant) will lighten your double action trigger pull by about 3.5lbs, and take about 1lb off your single action pull. Makes the gun great, and it's basically a drop in trigger job...
As you can see, I love the platform:
http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g320/mistershipwreck/8-beretta-label1.jpg
When I was handgun shopping, the weight of the 9mm is what knocked it out of the running early for me. It felt great in my hand but far heavier than the FNX-9 I went with. Higher weight may be perfect for a nightstand gun and detrimental to carrying it, so since I only have one handgun (instead of night stand gun and a carry gun), weight was a big factor in my choices.
Well, its around 33 oz unloaded.
It has a metal frame. It is aluminum, and not steel, which probably knocks about 10 oz off the weight. It would be far heavier if itw as steel.
However, any polymer gun will always be heavier than a polymer gun. But, the heavier weight also lessens the recoil.
I'd suggest to look at the PX4 Storm. It is polymer, but has the DA/SA system with a decocker. Also, it already has the equivalent of the "D" spring in it, so the DA pull doesn't feel that bad.
I prev owned one in 40 and now have one in 9mm. I shot it again on Saturday. VERY accurate gun. People always worry about lubrication and the rotating barrel system, but there have been a lot of tests done on the gun, and the gun always does very well. Beretta made a version in 45 for the military trials a few years ago - where there were plans to pick a new military handgun. The trials were called off, but from what I understand... Of the testing that was done, the 45 cal PX4 did amazingly well.
Anyway - they make it in 9mm and 40. And, the PX4 is the softest shooting 40 I've ever shot. Even a tiny bit less than a Beretta 96 with a Brigadier slide I once shot. The rotating barrel seems to do more for the 40 recoil than it does for the 9mm. But even in 9mm, it has less recoil than a lot of other 9mms...
Just another option for ya.
I personally carry a fullsize Beretta 92 IWB every day, concealed. The weight doesn't bother me. But, everyone is different
The PX4 made my finalist list so that I can't argue with. Extremely comfortable in my hand. For reference, I'm about 6'3" and most handguns feel too small for me.
azairman86
07-07-11, 09:49
I can never find an HK that fits my hand all that well. Same as the glock wich is kinda why I stay away from those
azairman86
07-07-11, 10:04
Does anyone have any recent experiance with the M&P pistol? Ever since I read the initial reviews on them and their major flaw I kinda forgot about them but that was a few years ago and wondered if S&W fixed those issues
Does anyone have any recent experiance with the M&P pistol? Ever since I read the initial reviews on them and their major flaw I kinda forgot about them but that was a few years ago and wondered if S&W fixed those issues
There are a ton of M&P fans here from what I can tell. So, some will undoubtedly jump in...
I have rented the M&P 9mm and the M&P in 45 before. I wanted to like the guns, and they were accurate. However, I HATED the trigger. There are tons of aftermarket parts and modifications that can be done to the gun, just like the Glock and a Glock trigger. However, unlesss I shot someone else's that had already been modified, and I knew I could replicate it by getting the same parts that they did - I won't buy a pistol and HOPE I can get the trigger changed to work how I would like it.
Plus, at this point in my life, I have come to prefer DA/SA guns... I know that puts me in the minority. But after a near robbery a few years ago, I decided that I like the added safety of a slightly heavier 1st shot, as things are completely different when you get an adrenaline dump.
Plus, since I now carry IWB instead of OWB, I occasionally get my shirt caught in the holster when reholstering. With the heavier and longer DA first pull of my Beretta 92 I carry - I needn't worry about the gun going off accidentally and shooting me in the leg. An M&P, Glock or XD would greatly increase the risk of this happening to me. Just MY opinion. I'm not claiming any of these guns are less safe, as I know that sets people off. But for me, that is my personal preference...
I can never find an HK that fits my hand all that well. Same as the glock wich is kinda why I stay away from those
Have you tried the P30 specifically?
azairman86
07-07-11, 15:19
I've held the p30 a while ago and I didnt like the way it sat in my hand. Yeah and I've come to prefer the DA/SA as well
Is the Beretta 90Two destined to go the way of the dinosaurs or will it be around for a while?
azairman86
07-07-11, 15:52
I heard it was supposed to be discontinued but I'm not sure of the final verdict
Last word is that it will be a "limited" release model with ,maybe a run 1x a year or so.
If ya really want one, better get it now. With the way Beretta discontinues models, the next "run" may never occur. However, its not officially discontinued yet
Well, its around 33 oz unloaded.
It has a metal frame. It is aluminum, and not steel, which probably knocks about 10 oz off the weight. It would be far heavier if itw as steel.
However, any polymer gun will always be heavier than a polymer gun. But, the heavier weight also lessens the recoil.
I'd suggest to look at the PX4 Storm. It is polymer, but has the DA/SA system with a decocker. Also, it already has the equivalent of the "D" spring in it, so the DA pull doesn't feel that bad.
I prev owned one in 40 and now have one in 9mm. I shot it again on Saturday. VERY accurate gun. People always worry about lubrication and the rotating barrel system, but there have been a lot of tests done on the gun, and the gun always does very well. Beretta made a version in 45 for the military trials a few years ago - where there were plans to pick a new military handgun. The trials were called off, but from what I understand... Of the testing that was done, the 45 cal PX4 did amazingly well.
Anyway - they make it in 9mm and 40. And, the PX4 is the softest shooting 40 I've ever shot. Even a tiny bit less than a Beretta 96 with a Brigadier slide I once shot. The rotating barrel seems to do more for the 40 recoil than it does for the 9mm. But even in 9mm, it has less recoil than a lot of other 9mms...
Just another option for ya.
I personally carry a fullsize Beretta 92 IWB every day, concealed. The weight doesn't bother me. But, everyone is different
I have a full size PX4 Storm in .40. I read to many internet postings about how there is no pistol but a Glock or an M&P so I had to buy one of those as well... I keep thinking I'm going to sell off the PX4 and go with nothing but the M&P line, then I shoot it...
The PX4 fits my hand well and is a joy to shoot. I like the M&P as well, but understand you wanting the hammer / decock option. My PX4 is pretty darn accurate for my needs and I have close to 1,000 rounds down her with not a single malfuction of any sort... Now I'm eyeing a PX4 subcompact in 9mm.... : )
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beretta_Px4_Storm
azairman86
07-08-11, 13:52
Yeah I've shot a PX4 in 40 and it was pretty nice. The whole rotating barrel thing kinda worries me since it is basically a plastic piece that it rotates on.
Yeah I've shot a PX4 in 40 and it was pretty nice. The whole rotating barrel thing kinda worries me since it is basically a plastic piece that it rotates on.
Understand, but so far no problems at my end. If you gotta have the hammer and a de-cock option its at least worth getting your hands on one and sending some rounds downrange...
Freezerman1
07-12-11, 17:33
I vote FNX 40. Mine goes bang every time, accurate and easy to shoot.
azairman86
07-12-11, 17:49
Yeah, the FNX 40 is out for me. Sorry. And I kinda prefer the 92 series and am actually considering the HK USP vs the 96A1. From what I hear it's solid as a rock and will last forever so that kinda perks my interest. And for those who will say go with the P30, I'm not interested in it. I want something that's proven over the newest and greatest.
The Dumb Gun Collector
07-12-11, 18:30
A basic USP is an unstoppable gun. Just an overbuilt tank. If there was a clean way to mount an X300 I would say it was the perfect doomsday pistol.
Freezerman1
07-12-11, 18:41
Yeah, the FNX 40 is out for me. Sorry. And I kinda prefer the 92 series and am actually considering the HK USP vs the 96A1. From what I hear it's solid as a rock and will last forever so that kinda perks my interest. And for those who will say go with the P30, I'm not interested in it. I want something that's proven over the newest and greatest.
Excellent choice also, my carry gun right now is a 96D centurion. Not quite as smooth to shoot as the FNX40 but is a proven platform. All the guns you appear to be considering should serve you well.
I have owned 7 HKs over the years (HK USP 9mm, HK USPc 9mm, USP 45c, HK45, HK45c, P2000 and P30L).
The one I did not like was the fullsize 9mm USP..
It was accurate enough. grip a little too fat for my hands... But, the polymer mags were the killing point for me.
I had two rounds get stuck in the mag... Side by side. It held the follower down because of this, and all the rounds above it just jumbled around loose in the magazine.
I had to remove the baseplate, and take a cleaning rid and knock the hell out of those 2 rounds to get them loose. I reassembled the mag, and it seemed to work. But I had HK replace that 1 magazine.
After that, however, I never could trust the gun. The mags are not metal lined, if I remember right (its been a while). The mag bodies have too much flex in them that allowed this to happen. I have NEVER had this happen on another doublestack mag before or again. HK should make the fullsize 9mm USP mags to be metal, like the rest of their guns.
Anyway, I was always paranoid that this would happen again, so I just couldn't bring myself to keep the gun after that (for defensive purposes)
azairman86
07-13-11, 17:09
Yeah, at first i was a little hesitant with the completely polymer mags but other than your's haven't heard anything bad concerning them
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