View Full Version : Glock problems w/G17 back from Glock
I have a Gen 2 Glock 17 that I sent to Glock because it was ejecting cases in my face at times. This was after I tried having two knowledgeable Glock Armorers try to fix it.
I sent the Gun to Glock with a note detailing the issues. I got it back with a note saying: Inspected, Replaced Parts, Meets Factory Specs, Tested OK."
Well, it still bops me in the head with brass every so often, so my solution is to make sure to wear a peaked cap even when shooting indoors--should be common sense on my part, right?
But worst of all, it has a disturbing new problem that it never had before--occasional failures to extract where the rim of the case is barely sticking out of the chamber and the new round from the magazine and the new round from the magazine gets caught trying to feed because the empty case has not extracted. This ocurred with the same magazine with two different brands of ammunition--Winchester Ranger 124 grain +P JHP and some of the Winchester White box 9mm Nato 124 grain FMJ. I fired about 200 rounds throguh the gun and had the failures to extract twice with the above-mentioned ammo. I don't know if they put a new extractor in the gun--but I don't think so since it does not have the loaded chamber indicator.
Any thoughts on this?
thanks
Magic_Salad0892
07-11-11, 02:48
I have a Gen 2 Glock 17 that I sent to Glock because it was ejecting cases in my face at times. This was after I tried having two knowledgeable Glock Armorers try to fix it.
I sent the Gun to Glock with a note detailing the issues. I got it back with a note saying: Inspected, Replaced Parts, Meets Factory Specs, Tested OK."
Well, it still bops me in the head with brass every so often, so my solution is to make sure to wear a peaked cap even when shooting indoors--should be common sense on my part, right?
But worst of all, it has a disturbing new problem that it never had before--occasional failures to extract where the rim of the case is barely sticking out of the chamber and the new round from the magazine and the new round from the magazine gets caught trying to feed because the empty case has not extracted. This ocurred with the same magazine with two different brands of ammunition--Winchester Ranger 124 grain +P JHP and some of the Winchester White box 9mm Nato 124 grain FMJ. I fired about 200 rounds throguh the gun and had the failures to extract twice with the above-mentioned ammo. I don't know if they put a new extractor in the gun--but I don't think so since it does not have the loaded chamber indicator.
Any thoughts on this?
thanks
Replace extractor, replace extractor spring, look at the extractor depressor plunger.
Problems should be solved. If not, contact us back.
Limp wristing?
Are you holding on target....usually this isn't a problem with a 9mm. I have the same gun and the only time I've gotten hit is when I'll fire one handed and my arm will come back on recoil.
You might ask around on Glock Talk too.
I've got thousands of rounds through my G2 G17 and not one malfunction.......still grouping in a half dollar so....yea.
Nephrology
07-11-11, 13:18
Did they install a new recoil spring assembly?
The brass in the face is somewhat normal especially with the wimpier 9mm loads. A stout wrist will help.
As for the FTEs I cannot say for sure. It is possible the RSA is oversprung slightly and might need to be broken in a bit....?
I am a certified armorer for what its worth (who isnt these days? )
Wayne Dobbs
07-11-11, 13:54
Ed,
I would buy this and install it along with a new extractor (one of the new production Lone Wolf ones or wait for Randy Lee's new Glock extractor):
http://www.whitesounddefense.com/products/H.R.E.D.-9mm.html
It took care of the extraction/ejection problems on one of my G19s.
Limp wristing?
Are you holding on target....usually this isn't a problem with a 9mm. I have the same gun and the only time I've gotten hit is when I'll fire one handed and my arm will come back on recoil.
The gun never did this before sending it in, nor did the other Glock 17 that I was shooting the same day with the same ammo do it, nor have I experienced this with my Glock 19.
Ed,
I would buy this and install it along with a new extractor (one of the new production Lone Wolf ones or wait for Randy Lee's new Glock extractor):
http://www.whitesounddefense.com/products/H.R.E.D.-9mm.html
It took care of the extraction/ejection problems on one of my G19s.
Thanks for the support, Wayne. I will be following both of your suggestions.
It's a sad day when we need to outfit Glocks with aftermarket parts to achieve reliability, and when Glocks come back from the factory functioning worse than when they were sent there.
Ed:
After all these years of the glock koolaid drinkers badmouthing the 1911s, it's their turn.
Littlelebowski
07-11-11, 20:37
Ed:
After all these years of the glock koolaid drinkers badmouthing the 1911s, it's their turn.
I'd still rather have a Gen4 Glock than a 1911 and I'd rather have a Gen3 than either.
Nephrology
07-11-11, 21:04
Thanks for the support, Wayne. I will be following both of your suggestions.
It's a sad day when we need to outfit Glocks with aftermarket parts to achieve reliability, and when Glocks come back from the factory functioning worse than when they were sent there.
There is so much hysteria around Glocks these days.
The Gen 4 design was flawed, certainly. They shouldn't have released them without working the bugs out with the RSA.
But to freak out over some brass in the forehead is silly. It doesn't mean that the gun is defective.
The FTEs are a concern definitely but shoot it a little first. Try to figure out what parts they replaced if any.
EzGoingKev
07-11-11, 21:15
I have a generation 2 G17 and if I go out and shoot 200-300 rounds I will almost always have at least one or two rounds come strait back at me. The rest eject fine.
Magic_Salad0892
07-11-11, 21:23
There is so much hysteria around Glocks these days.
The Gen 4 design was flawed, certainly. They shouldn't have released them without working the bugs out with the RSA.
But to freak out over some brass in the forehead is silly. It doesn't mean that the gun is defective.
The FTEs are a concern definitely but shoot it a little first. Try to figure out what parts they replaced if any.
At least they designed the Gen4 with the intention of improving it, as opposed to just cutting corners and reducing cost.
Thankfully, I think the Gen4 is on the right track to being as reliable as the Gen3 guns.
Might not be there yet, but I think it'll make it, just give it a year. Mine have been perfect.
PA PATRIOT
07-11-11, 21:26
I have a 22yr old very early 2nd gen Glock Model-17 that every once in a while throws brass back hitting me in the top of the head when shooting 115gr FMJ's. Its something all my 9mm Glocks old and middle aged do but they all function 100% so I never messed with the pumping so to say. I would ask Glock to send a UPS call tag to pick up your gun since after their repair the pistol developed new unique problems.
But to freak out over some brass in the forehead is silly. It doesn't mean that the gun is defective.
I agree. I never have this problem with my 19 and did not notice it with this particular 17 until it developed a problem where sometimes an extracted case would not clear the ejection port and get in the way of the slide closing when feeding a new round--kinda like a stovepipe.
A Glock Armorer replaced the ejector and then the thing started sending ejected cases into my face and head. Gun went to armorer and he did whatever treatment is done to the ejector when this becomes and issue and it did not solve it, hence it went back to Glock and now I have a gun that is not reliable.
A simpler solution which I am now adopting is to always wear a peaked cap when shooting the Glock--even indoors, and I am buying one of these masks to protect my face while shooting:
http://www.catsandbeer.com/uploads/2007/06/lecter0103.jpg
I have a Gen 2 Glock 17 that I sent to Glock because it was ejecting cases in my face at times. This was after I tried having two knowledgeable Glock Armorers try to fix it.
I sent the Gun to Glock with a note detailing the issues. I got it back with a note saying: Inspected, Replaced Parts, Meets Factory Specs, Tested OK."
Well, it still bops me in the head with brass every so often, so my solution is to make sure to wear a peaked cap even when shooting indoors--should be common sense on my part, right?
But worst of all, it has a disturbing new problem that it never had before--occasional failures to extract where the rim of the case is barely sticking out of the chamber and the new round from the magazine and the new round from the magazine gets caught trying to feed because the empty case has not extracted. This ocurred with the same magazine with two different brands of ammunition--Winchester Ranger 124 grain +P JHP and some of the Winchester White box 9mm Nato 124 grain FMJ. I fired about 200 rounds throguh the gun and had the failures to extract twice with the above-mentioned ammo. I don't know if they put a new extractor in the gun--but I don't think so since it does not have the loaded chamber indicator.
Any thoughts on this?
thanks
What did Glock say when you reported the new issues and the repetitions of the old issue to them?
RagweedZulu
07-11-11, 22:31
A peaked cap! That's f-ing hilarious!!! Like the ones the girls wear at Hotdog-On-A-Stick? Or the Riccola yodelers? Goddam, I'd love to see the look on the burglar's face when he breaks into YOUR house and sees you wearing nothing but boxers, a G19 and your peaked cap!:lol:
But to freak out over some brass in the forehead is silly. It doesn't mean that the gun is defective.
shooting a friend's 09-ish date g19...
had a piece of brass come back at me, between the brim of my hat and my shooting classes. lodge itself between the glasses and my ****ing eye :eek: that hurt. i did manage to keep the gun pointed downrange with my finger off the trigger though :o
my LHY dated g19 only hucks brass at me with old shitty mags.
kinda wondering if the friend's gun has a bad extractor....
Doc Safari
07-12-11, 09:21
I have a generation 2 G17 and if I go out and shoot 200-300 rounds I will almost always have at least one or two rounds come strait back at me. The rest eject fine.
I have always experienced this too. My theory is that the plastic ejector block or the gun's frame flex differently on occasion.
I have been a Glock fan since the early 1990's, but I have to admit that even my confidence has been shaken.
My primary carry gun is a Gen 3 G17 with the Gen 4 extractor. On another thread we had discussed how a lot of late 2010 and early 2011 Gen 4 extractors have failed in 4 to 5,000 rounds. Even though my pistol was made a full year before the problem Gen 4 style extractors showed up, I am replacing my extractor with one from Lone Wolf as a preventive maintenance move. Who knows if even the early Gen 3 extractors don't fail within a few thousand rounds? Better safe than sorry.
EDITED TO CORRECT TYPO:
I should clarify my post. I just noticed an error.
I meant to say that I have doubts about even the early Gen 4 extractors installed into Gen 3 slides.
As far as I know, none of the true Gen 3 extractors have failed.
The pic below shows the difference. The top pic is the Gen4 extractor. The bottom is Gen3. Some late Gen3 guns came with Gen4 extractors, and of those people have reported failures in as few as 4,000 rounds on guns made in late 2010 and early 2011.
At times, I wonder if the cases are even solidly hitting the ejector. On my Gen2 Glocks, I could load the chamber, remove the magazine, and when fired, the extracted case would drop out through the magazine well. With a magazine in place and lighter loads, I've also seen extracted cases flung forward over the muzzle.
My 2 cents. Get the Ptooma and have you way with the gun.
Being able to have your way with the gun is one of the things that makes Glocks great.
Trigger housings are $8.25 on Lone Wolf, that's the part that holds the ejector.
Nephrology
07-12-11, 12:31
I agree. I never have this problem with my 19 and did not notice it with this particular 17 until it developed a problem where sometimes an extracted case would not clear the ejection port and get in the way of the slide closing when feeding a new round--kinda like a stovepipe.
A Glock Armorer replaced the ejector and then the thing started sending ejected cases into my face and head. Gun went to armorer and he did whatever treatment is done to the ejector when this becomes and issue and it did not solve it, hence it went back to Glock and now I have a gun that is not reliable.
A simpler solution which I am now adopting is to always wear a peaked cap when shooting the Glock--even indoors, and I am buying one of these masks to protect my face while shooting:
http://www.catsandbeer.com/uploads/2007/06/lecter0103.jpg
You might want to talk to your armorer and ask what he did to the ejector. At my armorer's class we were told specifically not to monkey with the ejector. The only thing I would do if you told me you were having issues with ejection would be to swap out the extractor, extractor depressor plunger, firing pin safety + firing pin safety spring, and the trigger housing with ejector. Those are all of the parts responsible for extraction and ejection in a glock.
If he monkied around with your ejector - say, by filing off a corner or something - he probably did more harm than good. You might want to ask him honestly what he did to repair your gun. Glock may have not noticed that he filed off .001" of steel on the ejector face but that .001" could be critical.
Beat Trash
07-12-11, 13:46
I have been a Glock fan since the early 1990's, but I have to admit that even my confidence has been shaken.
Who knows if even the early Gen 3 extractors don't fail within a few thousand rounds? Better safe than sorry.
I own the following Glocks:
A Glock 26 I bought in 1997. Has about 4,000 rds through it.
A Glock 19 I bought in 1999. Has about 8,000 rounds through it.
Two Glock 19's (with consecutive serial numbers) I bought in 2000. Unfired and set aside for my kids.
A Glock 17 I bought in 2004 (To celebrate the end of the AWB). Has about 5,000 rounds through it.
I have never been hit in the head with a casing from one of my Glock's. I have not seen any sign of an extractor issue with my guns.
These guns perform in the manner that built Glocks reputation. If you use ammunition that is within spec, the gun will go bang! Period.
I am highly disappointed with what Glock has done to their guns lately. Because of this, I have no intention of ever parting with my Glocks, even though I've carried an issued M&P9 since 2006, and have started carrying an M&P9c off duty. But things would have to change before I were to buy another Glock.
Doc Safari
07-12-11, 14:23
I should clarify my post. I just noticed an error.
I meant to say that I have doubts about even the early Gen 4 extractors installed into Gen 3 slides.
As far as I know, none of the true Gen 3 extractors have failed.
The pic below shows the difference. The top pic is the Gen4 extractor. The bottom is Gen3. Some late Gen3 guns came with Gen4 extractors, and of those people have reported failures in as few as 4,000 rounds on guns made in late 2010 and early 2011.
Nephrology
07-12-11, 17:34
I should clarify my post. I just noticed an error.
I meant to say that I have doubts about even the early Gen 4 extractors installed into Gen 3 slides.
As far as I know, none of the true Gen 3 extractors have failed.
The pic below shows the difference. The top pic is the Gen4 extractor. The bottom is Gen3. Some late Gen3 guns came with Gen4 extractors, and of those people have reported failures in as few as 4,000 rounds on guns made in late 2010 and early 2011.
I am still not convinced these extractors are a problem by themselves.
I have 2 glocks with the "gen 4" extractors - a 17RTF and a 26. The 26 is of ~2007 manf. and bought used, so I assume the previous owner had the pistol serviced and replaced the extractor sometime recently. 500 flawless rounds through it so far.
The 17 has been a problem child but the problem was recoil spring assembly related and not extractor related. It even performed admirably (~800 problem free rounds with an exception for 7 user induced FTEs) with the extractor depressor plunger assembly installed BACKWARDS.
I have read a lot of internet fearmongering about these new Glock parts and how they may or may not be MIM but nobody has come forward with pictures of something that looked catastrophically wrong to me.
I would buy this and install it along with a new extractor (one of the new production Lone Wolf ones or wait for Randy Lee's new Glock extractor):
http://www.whitesounddefense.com/products/H.R.E.D.-9mm.html
It took care of the extraction/ejection problems on one of my G19s.
Thank you, Wayne!
An update:
Got both the Lone Wolf Extractor & the White Sound H.R.E.D. & had a Glock Armorer install them. Have fired 300+ rounds of the same ammo that was giving it issues when it returned from the factory and it has since been problem free. I know this is not a lot of rounds, but previously I had 2 problems within a lot less rounds than that.
The ejection issues seem to have improved. I think I got bopped on the hat once or twice in the 300+ rounds.
It's a sad state of affairs when one must buy aftermarket parts for a Glock to make it run reliably.
I have a generation 2 G17 and if I go out and shoot 200-300 rounds I will almost always have at least one or two rounds come strait back at me. The rest eject fine.
This is a very common experience, particularly with the G26 & G19 9mm pistols. In my opinion it's the combination of lower powered ammo, and limp wristing the pistol. Limp wristing is far more common than most would care to admit to, particularly as we become fatigued and start to anticipate the pistols recoil....Oh, and BTW, the G36 & G30 .45 auto's are also well known to spit brass back into the shooters face, trust me spent .45 brass right between the eyes will teach you quickly about limp wristing.....:smile:
Limp wristing?
LOL! Classic. All the sudden he decided to start limp wristing.
Got both the Lone Wolf Extractor & the White Sound H.R.E.D. & had a Glock Armorer install them. Have fired 300+ rounds of the same ammo that was giving it issues when it returned from the factory and it has since been problem free. I know this is not a lot of rounds, but previously I had 2 problems within a lot less rounds than that.
Once you established that it is back to it's old self could you work backwards and see if the H.R.E.D. is necessary? Curious if both parts are giving the desired result in combo or if one or the other is capable on it's own.
and limp wristing the pistol. Limp wristing is far more common than most would care to admit to, particularly as we become fatigued and start to anticipate the pistols recoil.
I shoot with Ed often enough that I can tell you he is NOT limp wristing.
This is a very common experience, particularly with the G26 & G19 9mm pistols. In my opinion it's the combination of lower powered ammo, and limp wristing the pistol.
A few facts:
1. The ammo in question was Winchester NATO 124 grain which is +P rated as well as Winchester Ranger 124 grain+P JHP. These are hardly lower powered ammo.
2. I have another Glock 17 that I was shooting the same day that no issues using the same ammo the same ammo. Both are Gen2 Glock 17s with no difference between them except one has Trijicon sights & the other has a 10-8 rear & white outline Tritium front sight. The later is th e one that was having the issues.
3. These problems never occurred before I sent the Glock in question off to Glock and occurred immediately once I got the Glock back,
4. These issues never occurred before in the 6k+ rounds that I fired with with any of my 3 Glocks--the two Glock 17s & 0ne Glock 19.
My (Gen 3) Glock 17 bounces one off my forehead here and there..keeps me awake! :smile: Cest la vie. I'd take the odd empty case in the forehead any day over a stovepipe...I'm also kind of immune to brass showers after 12 years army service.
Pleased you got the other issue sorted...that is very unusual. I should say replacement with stock parts would have sorted it for you also.....having been around Glocks a lot I do think there is some variance in individual ejectors/extractors etc that may change ejection angle, however not usually enough to cause real serious feed problems. The only feed issues I have ever had with my G17 in about 20,000 rounds have been when using the 33 rnd extended mags....I can't remember having any when using regular mags.
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