To use or not use a Leupold Tactical Illuminated Prismatic Sight

[hedp]

As I've stated earlier some of us on my dept. are going thru a patrol rifle class and will be allowed to buy our own personal AR15's, although any accessories/mods are the ones stated and cannot be replaced with anything else. The sight that was chosen for us is the Leupold Tactical Prismatic Illuminated 1X14.


I know there are other options out there and our SWAT guys use whatever they want, most choose Aimpoints, Eotech's or ACOGS, (mostly Aimpoints) but we are limited to the Leupold. I was talking to one of the guys in our group is who going to the class. He was a Marine also, but about 20 years ago (the last time he fired an M16/AR15 type rifle). He said he purchased the Leupold sight but after talking to some other guys was doubtful about putting it on and just sticking with his iron sights. I told him I'd put the scope on and sight both in, and after shooting the course if he didn't like it, he could take it off, leaving his iron sights which would have been sighted in already.


http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f191/usmarine0352/LeupoldPrismatic.jpg



Where we work is a downtown area which is almost all business's, and few skysrapers, although there are a lot of apartments and hotels in the area and we work at night.



So a few questions about the Leupold Prismatic sight.



1.) I'm assuming that since it is 1X14mm there is no actual magnification?



2.) Knowing where I work would you leave the Leupold sight off or on?



3.) Some have said one of the benefits is that the Leupold sight sets everything on the same focal plane, what does that mean and why is it a benefit?



4.) If the reticle is the not illuminated will the etched sight be enough to see in darklit areas (streetlights).



5.) Can you shoot this sight with both eyes open?



6.) Some have said that you cannot co-witness with the FSB with this scope, is that correct?



7.) Any in-sights you have into this situation?

[ICANHITHIMMAN]

I can awnser a few questions.

1x14 power means it is magnified to the power of one so yes it is magnified optic. 14 is equal to 14 feet which is the field of view and thats pretty narrow.

I personaly would not leave the sight on.

I would not count on being able to see the dot in low light very well

Leupold makes good products but I would have never even considered this sight for your application.

What type of rifles are you guys getting?

[hedp]

I can awnser a few questions.

1x14 power means it is magnified to the power of one so yes it is magnified optic. 14 is equal to 14 feet which is the field of view and thats pretty narrow.

I personaly would not leave the sight on.

I would not count on being able to see the dot in low light very well

Leupold makes good products but I would have never even considered this sight for your application.

What type of rifles are you guys getting?



SW MP15X.



Thanks for the help.

[Surf]

Same info I gave you elsewhere in a different thread but very similar thread that you posted. I will reply here only and forgo posting it at the other sites that you posed this question.


The biggest complaints about the prismatic are the battery life and the lack of an unlimited eye relief. Even with an etched reticle, the battery life (at highest setting) is 15 hours. Considering that most shooting or use in LE is generally during hours of darkness this can be a huge deal breaker for many people.


.....snip......

My biggest hang up is with the Prismatic. Disadvantages of being a rifle scope with a definite eye relief and parallax, without the advantage of magnification. With 15 hours on battery life, be sure to change batteries at regular intervals. Nothing would suck more than having the batteries die at darkness hours when you really need it. For a patrol optic I cannot fathom its selection for duty use with such limited battery life. Not sure why your dept would opt for a non magnified basically 1X heads up optic where you have these clear disadvantages?

I think it is great that your department is heading in the direction of allowing Officers to purchase and use their own patrol rifles. Huge advantage there. I am more curious as to their reasoning for the S&W and the Leupold Prismatic as the ONLY options. Good to see a department thinking progressively, but they are taking a good advantage away from the program by limiting choices to good to very good and not allowing excellent.


.....snip.....

Now for the rear back up sight you may have an issue due to the Prismatic requiring an eye relief just like any other magnified optic. I would think that a fold down rear sight like the Troy sight that comes on the 15X will be fine. But if you cannot get the correct eye relief, there is a possibility for the need to remove the rear back up iron sight, which would be unacceptable on a working rifle.

Here is another kicker to the rear sight issue. Ideally you should be running a co-witness with your irons and the Prismatic so you can use either / or instantly, but I don't see that happening since the Prismatic requires an eye relief. If you can keep the Troy rear fold down sight mounted and cannot get a co-witness you will need to be able to quickly detach the Prismatic to even use the iron sights. Some might say it is no big deal as the Prismatic has an etched reticle or you can just use the tube to aim the weapon, I personally disagree with this line of thinking. Isn't Murphy proof enough. So make sure that if you cannot co-witness with the Prismatic, make sure you get a mount for it that is a quick detach mount.

If for some reason you really feel that you need to get rid of your front sight post, it can be removed, but I would stick with a pinned gas block. Nothing really beats the stock pinned block and you could shave the front sight post but that is a permanent modification. The below video shows what I do on some of the weapons that I build with shaving the front sight post. If you went with a fold down sight, I would prefer a longer rail to mount a fold down sight but that is up to you. Again I do not prefer a clamp on gas block / front sight post. It should be pinned on a working rifle.

[Surf]

BTW, I thought it didn't matter as that is the only option that was allowed by your agency and you already purchased the rifle package?

[ICANHITHIMMAN]

A HA... thanks Surf

[hedp]

BTW, I thought it didn't matter as that is the only option that was allowed by your agency and you already purchased the rifle package?



One of the questions brought up was whether or not leave it off.

[Failure2Stop]

One reason I have become such a huge supporter, user, and advocate for optics on fighting guns is that it allows the shooter to focus on the target while he is trying to shoot/kill it. It permits more precise fire, better detection of target, and is in accord with our natural tendency to focus on the thing trying to kill us, or what we want to see in better detail.

I believe in back-up "iron" sights far more than I do precision point-shooting, but if it's that bad and close, you might as well pull blade and get that commendation.

[jmart]

I can awnser a few questions.

1x14 power means it is magnified to the power of one so yes it is magnified optic. 14 is equal to 14 feet which is the field of view and thats pretty narrow.

I personaly would not leave the sight on.

I would not count on being able to see the dot in low light very well
Leupold makes good products but I would have never even considered this sight for your application.

What type of rifles are you guys getting?

Since it's a power of one, it's unmagnified, just like your naked eyesight.

14 is the diameter in mm of the objective lens, not 14 feet. The FOV (at 100 yards which is the specified distance most FOV specs are listed at) is much greater then 14 feet, more like 80 - 90 ft IIRC.

The unit has a illumination module which can be used for low light scenarios. Using it, you will have no problem seeing the dot. If not using the module, you could have problems, depending upon the light level. The dot subtends 6 MOA so it's bigger than an Aimpoint or EoTech for comparison.

The reticule is etched, so there's nothing to break. The unit is stout.

Battery life is poor, something like 15 hours at max intensity. You would never use max intensity for low light scenarios, so battery life would be much better, but it's still orders of magnitude less than Aimpoint. I would not leave the battery on all the time, rather I'd turn it on when needed. This is one more attribute against it compared to an Aimpoint where you can leave an Aimpoint on all the time -- it's always ready. Just swap out the battery every year.

Unlike an Aimpoint or Eotech, this is essentially a 1X scope. Crystal clear, but you have to contend with eye relief issues (get a good consistent cheekweld and line up right behind the unit) and it doesn't cowitness with irons. I suppose it might cowitness well enough at shortish ranges, but I have no idea at what range accuracy would suffer to the point that you'd say cowitnessing is no longer possible. For this reason, if running a BUIS, then I'd recommend a LaRue quick release lever mount so you can ditch it in a hurry, if needed.

[Tomac]

Battery life is 250hrs at the lowest setting.
Tomac

[kartoffel]

I can awnser a few questions.

1x14 power means it is magnified to the power of one so yes it is magnified optic. 14 is equal to 14 feet which is the field of view and thats pretty narrow.

Sorry, no.

1x14 means it's a 1x magnification with a 14mm objective lens.

But do concur that the Leupold Prismatic is probably not a good choice for most people. Unlike most 1x optics, it lacks unlimited eye relief. It has a narrow eyebox just like a magifnied scope, thereby negating one of the greatest benefits of a 1x Eotech or Aimpoint.

The battery life is god-awful, too. If you leave it turned on you will be replacing batteries DAILY. Tell your dept to pull their heads out of their asses and authorize you to purchase proper combat-worthy 1x optics.