CMI Beretta Mags...

[Straight Shooter]

Have they fixed all the previous problems with these mags?
Are they now GTG?
Opinions from current users welcomed.
Are they worth the current $12 -$18 asking prices?

[LHS]

Considering CDNN runs periodic specials with Beretta factory mags for $15, why take the risk?

[Straight Shooter]

Please...limit posts to answers to my questions only, thanks.

[556A2]

The issues were related to parkerization on the inside of the magazine body. All Checkmates made after 02-2004 have the current phosphate finish which resolved the issue. Even so, pre 02-2004 Checkmates are pretty good as long as you aren't in desert combat.

That said, they are still sub-par to factory magazines. As LHS said, you can easily get MDS (factory Beretta) for $15 on sale or $17 not on sale at CDNN. I would not pay more than $10 for a Checkmate or Airtronics magazine. You can "fix" them by using a new Wolff magazine spring, but the added expense usually costs more than buying factory magazines in the first place.

Spend the extra $3-$5 for a factory magazine.

[ShipWreck]

Factory 15 rounders are like $17 right now at CDNN. Yea, why bother with anything else.

[JonInWA]

I've used Check-Mate's dry-film magazines for the Beretta 92/M9 since 2007. At the time, Jackie Vieweg (now Jackie Santoro), Check-Mate's Business Development Manager, seeking to experientially educate the Beretta shooting community (and ameliorate the reputation the previous internally-and-externally phosphate finished Check-Mate magazines had accrued when they ran into the talc-like desert sands of Iraq and Afghanistan) offered samples of their magazines to some Beretta forum participants, among others.

Taking part in this, I became very favorably impressed with the magazines, and I concurrently possessed both Beretta and MDS magazines, all of which are used in my Beretta 92D (which, while of 1996 manufacture, I actually purchased brand-new-in-box in 2006).

I have a total of 8 of the magazines, as I'm currently one of Check-Mate's sponsored shooters. Four range from 2005 to 2008 in production date, and 4 are 2010 production. 6 of the magazines also have the dry-film finished follower, and the remaining 2 have the current DoD production non-finished polymer followers.

I've only encountered one problem with the magazines; one of the 2010 production magazine tubes was very slightly oversize at the tube buttom; operationally the magazine performed well, but would not drop free upon ejection. Check-Mate re-sized it, and it's been fine (I actually was impressed that they took the time to examine and repair the magazine, as opposed to simply throwing it away and sending me a new one).

In my association with Check-Mate, we've assisted them with field-testing and critiquing both these magazines and their 1911 magazines.

I personally prefer their Beretta magazines to current Beretta/MDS offerings for several reasons (and not just because I get them at no cost):

-Their baseplates are hardened steel, and as such are impervious to breaking as are some polymer-based magazines;

-The metal baseplates provide a slightly lower profile than the wedge profile inherent to most Beretta/MDS magazine baseplates, providing a slight (admittedly very slight) advantage when carrying concealed, due to their diminished size;

-Operationally, the dry-film magazines have been excellent. This year alone I've used them in 4 IDPA matches, regardless of weather conditions, and they've been well exposed to water and mud in their use. I've never had an operational issue with the magazines (other than the one previously mentioned's failure to drop-free upon ejection until re-sized). I plan on using my Beretta 92D in our upcoming August Washington State IDPA Championship match, exclusively with the Check-Mate magazines.

The dry-film finish seems to wear quite well over time, providing lubricosity and protection. None of my magazines have any rust.

Arguably, Beretta's PVD-finished magazine with an internal strake to displace sand granules may be slightly superior, but they're far more expensive and in operational use the Check-Mate dry film finish seems to accomplish the same levels of operational multi-climate efficiency at a lower cost.

One of my magazines has an experimental stainless steel spring, which Check-Mate considered at one point. I've had zero springing issues with any of my magazines, two of which are kept loaded with 14 rounds apiece for months at a time.

I have no hesitation in recommending Check-Mate dry-film magazines to Beretta 92 users. In my use, they've been consistantly excellent.

Best, Jon

[Straight Shooter]

Now THATS an answer!!!!
THANK YOU Sir, for that very informative post. I get so damn tired of asking a simple question, and then having people tell me "why do I want that, when I can get this" and be better off, instead of just answering my damn question in the first place.
I will now buy a couple of the NIW USGI mags I see for sale, and try them out.
Again Jon...thanks.

[556A2]

You want someone to tell you that your choice is good despite there being better choices for next to nothing?

I'm not calling JonInWA a liar (and I respectfully say this), but being SPONSORED by Checkmate brings his credibility down a little bit. Like I said, I totally do not mean any disrespect, but I have yet to see a Checkmate or Airtronics magazine have the same quality as PB/MDS magazines especially with magazine springs. I will say its mostly been with Airtronics, but I refuse to buy Checkmate's are on par with Beretta magazines (and so does every other Beretta 92 shooter).

I'm not biased either because I bought 5 Checkmate magazines today. However, I paid $8 a piece for them NIW, they are post 02/2004, & they will be range magazines.

If you don't believe Shipwreck, LHS, or myself...... take Larry Vicker's word on the matter of M9 magazines:

"3. Magazines: One of the rules of thumb with any autoloader is that the original manufacturer offers the most reliable magazines. Unfortunately the U.S. Military puts very little importance on small arms, so most of the M9 magazines in inventory are made by an aftermarket vendor whose quality is dramatically lower than the OEM magazine.
The most critical component for feeding any autoloader is the magazine, and a substandard magazine dooms it to failure no matter how well designed the gun itself may be. Original Beretta magazines are rare - aftermarket magazines are the norm in the field.

If I were forced to get by with aftermarket mags - after disassembling the magazine, use a bronze brush on a section of cleaning rod soaked in oil to smooth the inside of the magazine tube. This is necessary as this particular vendor is known to apply a very coarse finish on the mag tube.
Wipe dry and replace the springs with original factory spec M9 magazine springs, preferably from Wolff. If you cannot get Wolff springs, load only 10 rounds per mag. Make sure you keep the magazines dry (do not lube the inside of the magazine) and disassemble and clean the mags during your down time between missions.
If at all possible have extra mags and rotate them on a regular basis. Of course, THE BEST ANSWER WOULD BE TO GET BERETTA-MADE MAGS but in the green machine, that is easier said than done. As I understand it, Beretta had made some special M9 magazines to address the reliability issues that have been raised in the sandbox, but I have no personal experience with them."

Its your money, but unless you are picking them up for about 1/2 the price of a factory magazine, you should be going with PB/MDS.






Now THATS an answer!!!!
THANK YOU Sir, for that very informative post. I get so damn tired of asking a simple question, and then having people tell me "why do I want that, when I can get this" and be better off, instead of just answering my damn question in the first place.
I will now buy a couple of the NIW USGI mags I see for sale, and try them out.
Again Jon...thanks.

[JonInWA]

I'm not worried about my credibility; my affiliation with Check-Mate came out of a long-term relationship where I genuinely respected both the product and the company before the sponsorship came about. Check-Mate has been extremely open to suggestions and improvements about product improvements, to the point where virtually every suggestion that we made regarding their 1911 magazines made was made into a production line improvement, within 6 weeks-that's quite nimble for a manufacturer.

Larry Vickers' quoted comments pertain to the initial production of DoD contract Check-Mate magazines, which, in conformance to DoD specifications (and as such could not be deviated from), had the interior and exterior crackle-type phosphate finish on both the magazine tube interiors and exteriors-which was a disaster when the magazines were exposed to the fine, talc-like sand and dust prevalent in Iraq and Afghanistan. Once Check-Mate became aware of the problems in-theater, the dry-film finish was quickly developed and fielded. Unfortunately, DoD did not purge the problematic magazines from theatre arms-rooms, instead intermixing the dry-film magazines with the older ones, so Check-Mate continues to be disparaged. Check-Mate has subsequently offered to strip the earlier finish from the older magazines and apply the dry-film finish to them, at a cost of .40 per magazine, which DoD decided not to do. To the best of my knowledge, the sand-resistant Beretta magazines that Larry Vickers mentioned are available in 2 finishes, blued and PVD; the PVD finished magazines are provided with the M9A1 guns, both for the USMC contract and for the commercial guns. I'm unaware of any .mil acquisition/distribution of them beyond that, but my knowledge is limited regarding other than what I've just mentioned. Other than their finish, these sand-resistant magazines feature a vertical strake on both sides of the tube, providing some "stand-off" distance between the cartridges and the tube sides, precluding sand granules in the magazine body from stopping cartridge movement.

Mr. Vickers has subsequently been provided with examples of the current production dry-film magazines, which he has been running for some time, and the last time we had a brief conversation on his results with them, they were running fine and without problems. I'm sure if he sees this thread and feels like commenting, he'll do so.

There have been several variations to the basic Beretta/MDS magazines. Fuctionally, I've consistantly found them to be excellent, and recently (within the past year or so) the basic magazines have frequently been discounted at BUSA's webstore, and by others. However, as I previously stated, I still prefer the Check-Mate dry-film magazines, due to both their hardened steel baseplates and the dry-film finish. Check-Mate magazines also come with a lifetime warranty, something that I'm not aware of any other magazine manufacturer providing.

Best, Jon

[Straight Shooter]

I originally asked the question about these mags strickly as a technical question, to increase my own knowledge of these mags. I only wanted to know if the problems had been solved.
I currently own 8 Beretta mags for my M9..I know exactly how good they are and what they cost and where to get them.
I ONLY wanted my simple question answered.
Jon and 556A2 both provided answers, thank you.
Jon, you gave the info I was looking for, and Ill be getting a few of the USGI mags to play with soon.
If you know of a good source..please PM me, thanks!!!

[JonInWA]

I originally asked the question about these mags strickly as a technical question, to increase my own knowledge of these mags. I only wanted to know if the problems had been solved.
I currently own 8 Beretta mags for my M9..I know exactly how good they are and what they cost and where to get them.
I ONLY wanted my simple question answered.
Jon and 556A2 both provided answers, thank you.
Jon, you gave the info I was looking for, and Ill be getting a few of the USGI mags to play with soon.
If you know of a good source..please PM me, thanks!!!

You've got mail.

Best, Jon

[556A2]

I totally respect your opinion on Checkmate, and I don't have an axe to grind against them. In fact, I have defended them in the past since the heavy parkerization that lead to the problems where specified by the DoD, not Checkmate.

I just refuse to believe their magazine springs are up to par to PB/MDS or Wolff. That is the one weak point I've seen both Checkmate & Airtronics. Like I said, I've seen it much more in Airtronics than Checkmates. Every time it has been corrected by a new Wolff spring.

I have nothing against Checkmate, I just don't think they are better than PB/MDS, nor do I think they offer a advantage over OEM unless you like the flat base plate. I think if Checkmate could come up with something innovative with their 92 magazines that set them apart, along with improved springs it could benefit them.

[LHS]

Now THATS an answer!!!!
THANK YOU Sir, for that very informative post. I get so damn tired of asking a simple question, and then having people tell me "why do I want that, when I can get this" and be better off, instead of just answering my damn question in the first place.
I will now buy a couple of the NIW USGI mags I see for sale, and try them out.
Again Jon...thanks.

You asked if they were worth the cost. In my experience, the Beretta/MDS mags are superior in terms of springs and (at least until CheckMate stopped using the DoD-specified internal parkerizing) finish. Since they both cost roughly the same, it's my opinion that the CM mags aren't worth what they cost.

[556A2]

FWIW, I did receive my NIW Checkmates today. These are 2005 production magazines, so they do have the dry-film finish.

In fairness, I compared them to the following magazines:
* American made factory M9 Magazine with blued finish
* Italian made factory 92 Magazines with blued finish
* Airtronics M9 Magazines with gray parkerized finish

The Checkmates have a dull bronze finish compared to them all. Definitely different than most Checkmates I've seen. They also would eject the easiest out of my M9 & 92FS. Didn't get to shoot them today but the finish is nice.

It is not as good as Beretta's PVD coated magazines, but they are very expensive. I paid roughly $8 for these Checkmates so I could have some range magazines.

Will update on them with use.

[Straight Shooter]

I look forward to your review 556A2, thanks!

[ken p.]

I was given 10 of the Checkmate 9mm Beretta's 15 round mags and none of them worked correctly. I used a little graphite when I loaded then and they work great now, works as good as the PB mags from Italy.

[Clay]

I've recently purchased 4 Check-Mate mags from Midway for $15.99 each and they function perfectly. All of them are July 2010 production.

[JonInWA]

I was given 10 of the Checkmate 9mm Beretta's 15 round mags and none of them worked correctly. I used a little graphite when I loaded then and they work great now, works as good as the PB mags from Italy.

The protocol that I use for pretty much all of my magazines is to disassemble them, remove any residual cutting/preservative fluids, and them treat the interiors, springs, followers and inner baseplates with a film of Dri-Slide, a moly disulfide dry film lubricant carried in suspension in a liquid solution, which evaporates after application, leaving a dry film of lubricant/anti-corrosive. Tube exteriors and baseplate bottoms are wiped down with either Weapon Shield, or Sentry Solutions' Tuff Cote.

Yeah, it's probably overkill...but it's inexpensive (and easily performed) preventave maintenance in my book.

Best, Jon

[samuse]

Some people have good luck with Checkmate mags.

I've dealt with a lot of Checkmate M9 and 1911 mags and I'm of the opinion that they're junk. Everyone I've talked to at CMI is very nice and helpful, they fix and replace mags, they do a good job at customer service.

But they make shit mags.

[JonInWA]

Some people have good luck with Checkmate mags.

I've dealt with a lot of Checkmate M9 and 1911 mags and I'm of the opinion that they're junk. Everyone I've talked to at CMI is very nice and helpful, they fix and replace mags, they do a good job at customer service.

But they make shit mags.

Umm, ok. Care to be a bit more specific for our collective enlightenment-such as what specific issues, and with what magazines, and when was the timeframe that the problem(s) occurred? Were they with magazines that you'd personally had from the get-go, or were they used/arms room issue? I'm not trying to disparage you, or whatever your experiences were, but it's a bit hard to get a handle on your displeasure (or credibility) with the magazines without your providing us with a bit more information.

Best, Jon

[19852]

I fully respect anyone who has and uses successfully checkmate mags. If they work for you then great. I have inspected them in person and rejected them based on that inspection. The cost benefits to me don't justify the risk they won't work. When I can get Mec Gar mags at $20-25 then a risky $15 doesn't make sense to me.

[Fordtough25]

I had a few CMI and Airtronics with the last M9 I had, they functioned 100% at the range but that's the only place I used them. I had several factory Beretta mags I used for carrying it. For range fun they're hard to beat but that's about it IMO.

[Kain]

Have five CMI mags that I picked up at an Army Surplus store for $5 a piece a few years back. Went through the bin to find ones that were not hanging up when the follower were depressed, and not too beat to hell. For $5 bucks I can't bitch. haven't had an issue with them , though like Fordtough I have only used them for range use. Looking back I should have bought the entire damn bin since I see a lot of people selling them locally for $20+ a piece. Forget you can buy new for $15 from places like Midway.