View Full Version : Multicam
Multicam, what does it work with? I don't see how it will work with the woods or desert backdrop ? Am i wrong?
Since I havent had any Military experience wearing acu in combat or using it in the field I can't really say but I have spoken to several guys who were in Irag and they swear by it. One guy told me it really does break up your out line and it makes it harder for range finding equipment to lock on to you because the beam needs solid objects to reflect off of to give accurate readings.
are you talkin bout crye multi or the new mil acu multicam ?
are you talkin bout crye multi or the new mil acu multicam ?
Good question; not to many guys are wearing Crye Multicam in Iraq, besides maybe a pouch or a holster here and there.
Failure2Stop
10-27-07, 07:30
Since I havent had any Military experience wearing acu in combat or using it in the field I can't really say but I have spoken to several guys who were in Irag and they swear by it. One guy told me it really does break up your out line and it makes it harder for range finding equipment to lock on to you because the beam needs solid objects to reflect off of to give accurate readings.
Bullshit. Just stop and think about this for a second. If three reasons why this is false do not immediately come to mind, IM me. ddemis- I am not insulting you, but rather your source. I assume that you are only passing on what you have heard, so no foul.
Crye MultiCam is the fo shizzle. Here is what I posted in another thread about color selection:
At first it was OD, then standard US camouflage, then khaki (long ago, before we had it in us to rename "brown") with occasional MarPat thrown in for good measure, then Coyote/FDE, then MultiCam, then complete despair that I had no two pieces of gear that I actually needed in the same color. So I sold a bunch of it to my firends (I think most of them are still my friends) to fund a consolidation.
Base items, such as Armor/helmets/belts/Packs- Coyote.
Additional items/pouches- MultiCam
That way I can always hit the gear with some paint until it absorbs the environment.
One of the funniest stories that convinced me to go heavy MultiCam was this Brit Commando unit in some hell-hole in A-stan in the spring. One day, out of nowhere, they noticed little shoots barely poking through the sand/dirt. Next morning-the whole valley was green. They were, distinctly, not.
If your base color blends with the environment (Shirt/Trousers) and your gear is multicam, you will blend even better. Those Crye guys are pretty damn smart.
The ACU is actually the exact opposite. The only place I have seen ACU properly blend is either on gravel or cement. It's a shame. They had the opportunity to go light-years past every other military force in the world, and they shafted our guys with Gravel-Flage.
heres a photo i grabbed of the net i don't have any real life ones i could take pics of my collection of gear aginst dif backgrounds
but i never got any of the new mil stuff to compare with It. The crye was just perfect year round for the geographical area im in. I even did a cammo to match on a rifle
http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o266/walkinman2/TRU_MultiCam_1.jpg
HighSpeedDreams
11-03-07, 08:30
Gents,
This should help.
http://www.multicampattern.com/IMAGES.htm
HSD
toddackerman
11-03-07, 09:34
Gents,
This should help.
http://www.multicampattern.com/IMAGES.htm
HSD
That is a very good post!
Tack
The ACU is actually the exact opposite. The only place I have seen ACU properly blend is either on gravel or cement. It's a shame. They had the opportunity to go light-years past every other military force in the world, and they shafted our guys with Gravel-Flage.
ACU actually works very well at night against night vision. How many of our current enemies are using NVG's? :rolleyes:
Anyway, it's not just the pattern that's screwed up, it's the whole design. Velcro everywhere. If you stack on a door shoulder-to-shoulder, you stick together and make a ripping sound when you start to move. If you try burning ropes off of it, they go up like a cannon fuse. I'd hate to see someone on fire in those.
Someone got some major strokage for that contract. Multicam is much better.
Joseywales
11-06-07, 18:35
Looks like I found my next buy. To bad 5.11 doesn't make clothes in this pattern:(
Erick Gelhaus
11-06-07, 23:40
Sgtimj-
Disagree with your comment re UCP and night vision. I cant access the actual photos right now, but I shot several through an AN/PVS14 for an article on IR reflective insignia. The photos included Woodland BDUs, an ACU in UCP and a Multi-Cam top from Crye. The photos were taken across my backyard on a pretty dark night both with & without the IR illuminator on.
The Crye M/C pretty much faded right out. The Woodland & UCP glowed both w & w/out the IR illum on.
I'm not as hostile as some to the UCP but I really don't like it. That said & as pointed out by many, including at least one E-9 (amazingly), a bigger problem than the pattern is all of the BLACK items carried / worn - weapons, slings, NVG mounts, etc. That said, when six gun trucks (M1114s) are parked in a circle next to you does it really matter?
(UCP = Universal Camouflage Pattern. ACU = Army Combat Uniform which is sewn from cloth with the UCP printed on it.)
SinnFéinM1911
11-07-07, 15:41
Looks like I found my next buy. To bad 5.11 doesn't make clothes in this pattern:(
Forget 5.11... BUY WOOLRICH !
Erick G, I would love to see your backyard camo photo's and see how the different camo look in the dark.
seems your all forgetting the guys that got desert camo right, the Marines.
But if I had to pick one to blend in any environment I do like the mulitcam. Much better than the ACU
uniform the Army uses, not sure who thought that one up. Doesn't quite blend anywhere.
militarymoron
11-08-07, 12:14
the colours for UCP came out of the urban track trials pattern, with black removed. the overall grey colour of UCP actually does blend in well in an urban environment like iraq and some arid/rocky regions. but 'universal' it really isn't.
Forget 5.11... BUY WOOLRICH !
+1 Much better!
I'm still trying to figure out why people are buying up all the Multicam they can get their hands on. Yes it works but:
1) you can't wear it in the military.
2) contractors cant wear it(or are not supposed to).
3) I don't see LE having the money or the reason to go from black/ranger green to Multicam.
4) Civilians usually don't spend too much in Woodland/Desert/Arctic combat zones and have no reason to be "IR Proofed".
The only practical reason I could think Civilian would wear it is to either look cool at the range or legitimate hunting.
I think Crye is a great company with great designs and great products.
Seriously, am I missing something here?
I'm still trying to figure out why people are buying up all the Multicam they can get their hands on. Yes it works but:
1) you can't wear it in the military.
2) contractors cant wear it(or are not supposed to).
3) I don't see LE having the money or the reason to go from black/ranger green to Multicam.
4) Civilians usually don't spend too much in Woodland/Desert/Arctic combat zones and have no reason to be "IR Proofed".
The only practical reason I could think Civilian would wear it is to either look cool at the range or legitimate hunting.
I think Crye is a great company with great designs and great products.
Seriously, am I missing something here?
For gear related items, black gets very hot in the sun, khaki and green colors are fine, but I'd rather have camo, and my choices are normally woodland, Multicam or UCP. Multicam seems to work better than the other camo colors in most of the areas I live/have lived in. Plus I have actually gone hunting with multicam.
It's just my favorite camo pattern for now.
toddackerman
11-08-07, 17:42
I'm still trying to figure out why people are buying up all the Multicam they can get their hands on. Yes it works but:
1) you can't wear it in the military.
2) contractors cant wear it(or are not supposed to).
3) I don't see LE having the money or the reason to go from black/ranger green to Multicam.
4) Civilians usually don't spend too much in Woodland/Desert/Arctic combat zones and have no reason to be "IR Proofed".
The only practical reason I could think Civilian would wear it is to either look cool at the range or legitimate hunting.
I think Crye is a great company with great designs and great products.
Seriously, am I missing something here?
I tend to agree, but then most of us civilians will never use a carbine to defend ourselves. At least that's what Pat Rogers has been quoted as saying.
I have a set of Viet Nam Tiger Stripe camo because it came from my era. It's ,ore of a "Hi stoical" thing. I also have a set of Woodland camo that I would use if I needed to hit the field and bug out. Both have been in storage for years, as I never like to look like a "Tacticool" guy drawing a lot of attention.
In the Fall, spring and winter months, I prefer to wear jeans and some type of Khaki colored shirt, much like an instructors shirt of the earlier Gunsite days (I don't know what they wear now) and a pair of Top Sider shoes or light pair of hiking boots. In the summer, I wear a lot of shorts, Hawaiian type beach shirts, and Flip Flops.
I hide pretty well with this type of "Urban Camo".
Failure2Stop
11-09-07, 02:43
I'm still trying to figure out why people are buying up all the Multicam they can get their hands on. Yes it works but:
1) you can't wear it in the military.
Apparently that memo didn't get out.;)
Not to bust balls, but the bulk of Crye Precision's business is military.
I can agree with the rest of your list though.
Apparently that memo didn't get out.;)
Not to bust balls, but the bulk of Crye Precision's business is military.
I can agree with the rest of your list though.
I know they have contracts. Can you answer as to if the contracts are for "Multicam" the color, or their uniform and Armor products.
I know guys who have been on a waiting list for a Crye vest for almost 2 years now...same reason I'm not putting my order in.
Iraq Ninja
11-09-07, 11:00
I know they have contracts. Can you answer as to if the contracts are for "Multicam" the color, or their uniform and Armor products.
I know guys who have been on a waiting list for a Crye vest for almost 2 years now...same reason I'm not putting my order in.
Yes, most are for multicam sets which include the uniform, armor, and other goodies to include a new helmet.
Yes, most are for multicam sets which include the uniform, armor, and other goodies to include a new helmet.
Really, who is getting them? - I thought wearing Multicam would go against the Geneva Convention. Wearing a Nationally accepted uniform is one of the aspects that protects your "rights" under the GC.
The US Army UCP Universial Camoflage Pattern aka ACU Army Conbat Uniform is a pathetic example of "camoflage" but stands out so well it should help as an anti-fratricide matter.
The USMC desert & woodland MarPat uniforms are much more effective, perhaps the USMC is less worried about shooting there own & takes seriously being spotted by the enemy. USMC also has universal "Coyote" gear which can be used with both desert & woodland patterns.
MultiCam is very effective & if some individual has been in line to get some, be assured others are presently putting it to good use & are ahead of you in line.....
And, what does the Geneva convention have to do with anywhere our troops are deployed now? If your commentary isn't based on factual circumstance, specific knowledge or education, please limit conjecture, ancedotes, urban myths and other muddy water nonsense on this forum.
PM Sent
I am only trying to figure out the "Mulitcam" craze, NOT bash it. I hope Mulitcam isn't becoming one of those sacred M4C topics that people get ripped a new ass for asking the wrong questions:p
Erick Gelhaus
11-09-07, 14:00
Really, who is getting them? - I thought wearing Multicam would go against the Geneva Convention. Wearing a Nationally accepted uniform is one of the aspects that protects your "rights" under the GC.
Can you please supply us with a copy of the legal opinion from a competent source that determined this.
There seems to be one hell of a lot of mis-information on what is & is not permissible under the two Conventions. Sadly, this misinformation is very wide spread even within the military.
Can you please supply us with a copy of the legal opinion from a competent source that determined this.
There seems to be one hell of a lot of mis-information on what is & is not permissible under the two Conventions. Sadly, this misinformation is very wide spread even within the military.
From what I remember about my last GC brief, the SJA related this clause "(b) that of having a fixed distinctive sign recognizable at a distance; (c) that of carrying arms openly;" to wearing the appropriate recognizable uniform.
The "distinctive sign" being the uniform. I realize it doesn't amount to much when you are over there but we(US) still claim we follow the GC even when facing an "insurgency".
We did a wonderful job of hijacking the thread from the OP...PM me anyone still has a problem.
RogerinTPA
11-11-07, 11:16
Really, who is getting them? - I thought wearing Multicam would go against the Geneva Convention. Wearing a Nationally accepted uniform is one of the aspects that protects your "rights" under the GC.
Dude you need to get a clue. The Geneva Convention only covered standing, uniformed national armies and those that were signatories to the document. Guerrillas/insurgents/radical Muslims, weren't signatories, probably can't read and most importantly, don't recognize it, ala torturing, beheading and killing of foreign and US captives. I wish the liberals would lay off the torturing of enemy combatants thing. The enemy doesn't give a rats ass. When you are captured by extremist, YOU HAVE NO RIGHTS. Did you know Al Queda gives a phamplet out to those fighting to quote the Geneva convention and to claim that they are soldiers to gain humane treatment despite what they do to us when we are captured? Funny they're trying to use a document they are not entitled to. We are at war and should treat our enemies just as harshly as if we were captured and in there hands.
LukeMacGillie
11-11-07, 22:31
Multicam is being worn, as an issued uniform by US forces and others, IIRC some Italian Special Ops unit is wearing it. There are also Contractors wearing it. Its not being worn by WPPS contractors since the type of underwear they can wear is layed out in the contract, but there is a whole lot of contracting that is not WPPS, like say 99% of contracting is not WPPS, nor PSD type work.
Now how exactly is Multicam a US mil only pattern? How many armies of the world wear woodland?
MacGillie is Multicam in the olde Scots language;)
Joseywales
11-12-07, 21:37
I'm still trying to figure out why people are buying up all the Multicam they can get their hands on. Yes it works but:
1) you can't wear it in the military.
2) contractors cant wear it(or are not supposed to).
3) I don't see LE having the money or the reason to go from black/ranger green to Multicam.
4) Civilians usually don't spend too much in Woodland/Desert/Arctic combat zones and have no reason to be "IR Proofed".
The only practical reason I could think Civilian would wear it is to either look cool at the range or legitimate hunting.
I think Crye is a great company with great designs and great products.
Seriously, am I missing something here?
I wear it BECAUSE I CAN. No reason is needed. But I will have to disagree with comment #4. I spend lots of time in the woodland, the desert, and woodland that does get snow (some people call that place the mid-west).
Iraq Ninja
11-14-07, 00:53
Multicam is being worn, as an issued uniform by US forces and others, IIRC some Italian Special Ops unit is wearing it. There are also Contractors wearing it. Its not being worn by WPPS contractors since the type of underwear they can wear is layed out in the contract, but there is a whole lot of contracting that is not WPPS, like say 99% of contracting is not WPPS, nor PSD type work.
I bet WPPS still are not allowed to carry glock 17 mags for their 19s...
Are there still Italians here? They left Tallil last year. Good soldiers, but their politicians back home had them by the balls. We had to explain to their post commander the concept of what a QRF was.
Nomex jump suits are more practical than multicam for PSD these days, until Crye comes out with a nomex or carbon x clothing line.
Joseywales
11-14-07, 20:15
Forget 5.11... BUY WOOLRICH !
Why do you think Woolrich is better than 5.11?
I bought 2 pairs of the 5-11 shorts and I really like them. They hold mags well, have nice deep pockets. Front pocket is good for a pocket holster for S&W Airweight. The only flaw is that they can use more belt loops. But I can get those sewn on.
I just wish I could get ahold of the damn stuff...I called Crye and asked to buy or borrow anything they had for catalog photo shoots (for 5 or 6 different manufacturers), and I was told, "No. Call back in late December."
Erick Gelhaus
11-15-07, 01:44
Why do you think Woolrich is better than 5.11?
Josey-
Better quality construction & material; consistent sizing; willingness to actually listen to end users.
Really, who is getting them? - I thought wearing Multicam would go against the Geneva Convention. Wearing a Nationally accepted uniform is one of the aspects that protects your "rights" under the GC.
US Soldiers have US Flag patches and other identifying markings. Multicam with appropriate patches/markings is clearly a uniformed person, contrasted with someone dressed as a civilian hiding in the civilian population (which is what the GC was after).
IANALAIDPOOTV
Chad
Really, who is getting them? - I thought wearing Multicam would go against the Geneva Convention. Wearing a Nationally accepted uniform is one of the aspects that protects your "rights" under the GC.
The type of guys who dont want to be on every news photo..
militarymoron
11-15-07, 09:03
well, we've all seen photos like this of U.S. forces in afghanistan - they're not in uniform (except for the one on the far right), they have no visible U.S. flags or identifying markings, and they're not dressed to hide in the local civilian population.
http://www.gb4hr.net/Media/5thSOF.jpg
First, I think Crye makes an outstanding product. Their pattern is innovative and state of the art. I think the Army missed out on a tremendous opportunity by not picking it up. The pattern blends in well in almost any environment. I'm in the Army. While I can't say with certainty that Crye has military contracts. I don't work in their business office, I am almost certain that they do supply a certain type of military force with uniforms. Certainly your average line Army units are not fielding full uniforms of multicam pattern. I do believe Special Operations Forces are more than likely heavily using this. It is the best pattern, my opinion, and they usually have the latitude and funding to buy what they want. I do think you will see a lot of accessory kit, pouches and such in multicam pattern Army wide.
I always love that photo... the guy on the left.. his look is priceless..
"WTF you lookin at"
I like Multicam as well.. I wish the Army would have pulled there head out of there ass and snapped it up instead of that god awful pixalated pattern..
Heavy Metal
11-15-07, 17:45
Josey-
Better quality construction & material; consistent sizing; willingness to actually listen to end users.
Work issues 511 Tactical stuff to me. While I generally like it, the sizing is so inconsistant, I have some trousers in medium that practically fall off of me and others that practically pinch me in two. The best thing about them is they are free.
LukeMacGillie
11-16-07, 14:34
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v317/M4Guru/DSCF0034.jpg
Some of the best things in life, ATS, LaRue and Multicam!
how bout this link any idea who, and dose this look like multi cam to you ?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-4_afyQE4CY&feature=related
In the movie Trans Formers the Spec op unit is wearing multi cam . You can see multi cam in urban and dessert settings . Yeah it's Hollywierd but something that shows the pattern moving in and out of direct light and shade in differant environments.
I gotta ask why?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=160178763240&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=006
I gotta ask why?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=160178763240&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=006
Holy s---!
I can't believe someone paid that kind of money for camo trousers :rolleyes:
Gentlemen, the idea (and the translation of the word from the original French) is "To fool the eye."
ACU does fairly well here in Baghdad, especially in town (much better than I would have thought). Troops not wearing too much black shit (slings, leg rigs, black backpacks, etc.) don't stand out too badly. The ACU is a little more apparent than 3-color DCU, only for its greener shade. Soldiers with access to spray-paint for their weapons are better off than those without.
Everything old is new again. Multicam looks a LOT like US ERDL camouflage but with less green (the pattern used on GI jungle cammies from 1969 through 1983 before the BDU Woodland camouflage pattern was adopted). Multicam has more of the tans and khaki, but the smaller print pattern than the Woodland clown pattern.
Camouflage will not make you invisible. The priniciple is to break up shape, shine, silhouette, and shadow and to help you blend. If you can do that, your cammy is right. METT-T always dictates. Multicam is good for a far wider range than Woodland.
With individual camouflage gear lighter is always better than darker. It's always easier to darken equipment than to try to lighten it up.
The US GI Vietnam-era lightweight cotton OG-107 jungle fatigues were also a great universal uniform -- you could wear them anywhere and they did their job -- jungle, desert, and urban, the more you washed them and the lighter they got the better they worked.
Ranger Green reminds me of a well-weathered GI field jacket, shelter half, or Deuce-and-a-half tarp -- the more weathered it is the better it blends with most backgrounds.
Apparently that memo didn't get out.;)
Not to bust balls, but the bulk of Crye Precision's business is military.
I can agree with the rest of your list though.
I've been hearing that the Army will be switching to multicam..any truth to this? I think it is better than ACU IMHO
I've been hearing that the Army will be switching to multicam..any truth to this? I think it is better than ACU IMHO
I dont think they are even considering a full change after they just went to ACU and spen all of our tax $$$ on the change.
Don Robison
11-25-07, 21:29
Holy s---!
I can't believe someone paid that kind of money for camo trousers :rolleyes:
They better come with a squad of college cheerleaders to put them on me and "adjust" me to make sure they fit every time I put them on.
One complaint I have about Multicam gear is not the pattern at all; It's that you have to pay extra for it, and then they cover up 1/2 of it with tan webbing.;)
CarlosDJackal
02-01-08, 01:06
...One guy told me it really does break up your out line and it makes it harder for range finding equipment to lock on to you because the beam needs solid objects to reflect off of to give accurate readings.
WTF? :confused:
FWIW, I was convinced of the ACU's effectiveness a few years ago when I looked right past a JAG Officer who was no more than 3-feet from me. I was having trouble entering the correct code for a locked gate (into a secure area on Base) when he walked up on me. He stated that he has problems remembering all the different codes, I turned around to see who was talking, I could not see him until I managed to focus on his face. The camo was very effective at breaking up his outline.
On the other hand, an Airsofter I know stated that he can easily see ACUs in woodland (with the help of a particular piece of equipment).
A62Rambler
02-01-08, 09:16
Multicam looks good but I just can't see spending an extra $10 to $25 per piece for it as a civilian. I know it costs to develope camouflage but somehow I don't think there should be that much of a difference in price. :eek: I think Crye is making a healthy profit off of that pattern.
I would like to get ahold of the Desert Brush pattern that actually came out the best in the Army trials that produced the Arpat. I've read the powerpoint presentation and done some research and it is interesting to me that the ACU resulted from the pattern that scored 4th overall and multicam resulted from the pattern that scored 3rd overall. I'd like to try the Desert Brush which scored the best overall. ;)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_Camouflage_Pattern
http://www.dtic.mil/ndia/2004issc/wednesday/dugas.ppt
I've also read that the ACU has had problems with seams coming apart and there is actually a fix being done on the uniforms to the tune of several million dollars. Not only has it gotten poor reception for the color but the uniform design is not durable. I don't have the link for that but it can be found from the wikipedia links in the article.
Multicam looks good but I just can't see spending an extra $10 to $25 per piece for it as a civilian. I know it costs to develope camouflage but somehow I don't think there should be that much of a difference in price. :eek: I think Crye is making a healthy profit off of that pattern.
.
The price difference between Multicam in BDU or ACU cut and other colors/patterns is now pretty much negligible.
fabulous45s
02-06-08, 08:51
I'm still trying to figure out why in this age of joint service and interoperability all of our services went with totally different camo patterns. I've often wondered how much easier (and cost efficient) it would be to have the ability to purchase or be issued uniforms and gear at any US base.
ACU actually works very well at night against night vision. How many of our current enemies are using NVG's? :rolleyes:
You would be surprised. The fact is, there are plenty of russian and american built NVG systems out there. With that said, you have to assume your enemy will have NVG capability.
During my 16 month extenda-tour in Iraq I spent ten months patrolling in ACUs before we were issued tan nomex suits. During that time we set in the occasional hunter-killer team. Like some people have said, ACU works great at night. Sure, ACU pattern sucks in the desert at short range, but when you start getting out there (several hundred meters) it does do a great job of blending in with the horizon.
I'm still trying to figure out why in this age of joint service and interoperability all of our services went with totally different camo patterns. I've often wondered how much easier (and cost efficient) it would be to have the ability to purchase or be issued uniforms and gear at any US base.
...Because Marines don't want Soldiers to match them :D
fabulous45s
02-06-08, 13:23
...Because Marines don't want Soldiers to match them :D
:D
If it were only those two I'd be okay with it. The Air Force is starting to field their new ABU and the Navy NWU debuts this year, followed by a new woodland and desert pattern. And of all these new patterns, none of them look like multi-cam.
*Sigh* Thank God for the PCU.
Multicam looks good but I just can't see spending an extra $10 to $25 per piece for it as a civilian. I know it costs to develope camouflage but somehow I don't think there should be that much of a difference in price. :eek: I think Crye is making a healthy profit off of that pattern.
.
For the most part Multicam products are made with Crye material and that drives up the cost.
Army Chief
02-06-08, 15:04
I've also read that the ACU has had problems with seams coming apart and there is actually a fix being done on the uniforms to the tune of several million dollars. Not only has it gotten poor reception for the color but the uniform design is not durable.
Yes and no, but mostly yes. There were some initial problems with the manner in which the VELCRO tape pads were sewn on, resulting in a different stitch pattern specification, but this was early on. The latest problem (which is what you're referring to) deals more with crotch seams on a lot of the earlier lots that are blowing out and requiring a retroactive reinforcement.
I've never had much trouble with the ACU, but then again, I've worn NOMEX flight suits for most of the past two decades, so I was already accustomed to VELCRO durability issues and blown seams (the ultra-expensive Aviation BDU/ABDU was utterly abysmal in this regard). The ACU pattern itself is decent enough for most applications, but let's face it: just about anything is a compromise. Multi-Cam strikes me as a better compromise for places other than just Iraq, but that's really another issue.
What I find laughable is the Air Force's recent adoption of their bastardized tiger stripe scheme in ACU tones ... sure, it looks fine (tiger stripes always do, for some reason), but there aren't very many airmen (comparatively speaking) serving in places where camouflage is absolutely essential, and the costs associated with the development and fielding of this spiffy new outfit must have been phenomenal. Now, when they start handing out 416s to all of their rear echelon pogues, I think I'm really going to come unglued. LOL
Chief
I haven't seen people shoot and scoot at range or move at night in ACU's, so my view is based on limited info. BUUUT, I wasn't to impressed with it at short and medium distances in a desert environment.
I remember when Marpat deserts came out. Being a cheapskate, I did not buy any at first and wore my issued tricolor deserts in 2003. Seeing the patterns side by side, I thought the new stuff sucked - it was two dark and grey, kind of like the ACU's are. Later versions of desert marpat seem lighter than the first versions (other Marines can back me or shoot me down on this). I think the desert Marpats that we have now are awesome. I can't speak about anti-NVG effectiveness as when we went on patrol there was literally nothing for miles except the FOB and the odd haji house - just 12 green people kneeling and walking on a pool table:) .
+1 on the comments on enemy NVG's. Aside from whatever Saddam had, these are lost and stolen and one can only guess where they end up. I would assume the enemy has NVG capability these days. I won't go into detail, but there were some enemy TTP's that had to be NVG dependent.
LukeMacGillie
02-06-08, 16:14
+1 on the comments on enemy NVG's. Aside from whatever Saddam had, these are lost and stolen and one can only guess where they end up. I would assume the enemy has NVG capability these days. I won't go into detail, but there were some enemy TTP's that had to be NVG dependent.
Didnt Gall's get busted for selling NVG's to the Iranian Rev Guard recently?
The episode I remember is that the UK had sold iran some NVG's that the Israelis recovered when they invaded Lebanon in 2006(?), causing a bit of a flap - evidently Iran had funneled some of this stuff to Hizbollah (probably extreme elements in the military, ha ha). I don't know if this is what you're talking about, but that 's the one I remember. Bottom line is when you have hundreds of thousands of personnel with varying levels of accountability operating day on stay on for seven years you are going to lose stuff and the bad guys are going to get some of it. I can't think of any reason all the soviet stuff hasn't made its way down there yet. The worst of the worst are going to slowly catch up in terms of NVG capability, weapons, and armor:( .
CarlosDJackal
02-07-08, 13:27
I always love that photo... the guy on the left.. his look is priceless..
"WTF you lookin at"
I like Multicam as well.. I wish the Army would have pulled there head out of there ass and snapped it up instead of that god awful pixalated pattern..
Aren't those patterns years apart in availability?
Aren't those patterns years apart in availability?
Multicam has been out awhile.
http://http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v606/bshnt2015/th_IMG_2349.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v606/bshnt2015/?action=view¤t=474be346.pbw)
Every major vendor out there have some products in Multicam. Multicam is here to stay and is in use by various folks.;)
I had a chance to meet the inventor at their booth. (Propper, Tru-spec, Eagle, SKD, Tactical Tailor, and drop zone tactical are a few of the companies out there).
Does it work?, yes. Cost more?, yes. Are govt types using it? yes. Does it wear well and is it made in various material, ie 50/50, 65-35?, yes. Should you use it?, why not. Good luck.
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