View Full Version : US "KIA" Dog Tags Sold By Vietnamese On Ebay...
Can we resume Operation Rolling Thunder?
http://cgi.ebay.com/KIA-ORIGINAL-DOG-TAG-US-SOLDIER-VIETNAM-WAR-KI39-/200634126518?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2eb6b9d0b6
I wouldn't mind if it was just US military gear (helmets, belts, etc). but dog tags are an extremely personal item and this shows a huge amount of disrespect.
What the **** is wrong with those people???
VooDoo6Actual
08-02-11, 10:52
embrace the jacked up multi-cultural diversity that is trying to be shoved down our throats...
Kumbi****IN Ya....
I started to send the seller an angry message but restrained myself.
Its disgusting that some one can brazenly profit off of dead soldiers.
And they're claiming 10% will go to friggin charity! :mad:
Everyone with an ebay account needs to report the item. I did it under "grave related material". No way to get the tag back short of buying it. Perhaps it needs to be reported to DoD or Veterans Affairs???
I'm super pissed about this one! :mad:
if i had the readily disposable income, I would buy every tag and return it to their families.
I was thinking the same thing…
And they're claiming 10% will go to friggin charity! :mad:
Everyone with an ebay account needs to report the item. I did it under "grave related material". No way to get the tag back short of buying it. Perhaps it needs to be reported to DoD or Veterans Affairs???
I'm super pissed about this one! :mad:
I reported it as 'grave-related material' as well.
I reported it. If eBay doesn't allow "evil assault weapon" parts to be sold on their website, they DAMN SURE better not allow that junk to be.
Suwannee Tim
08-02-11, 15:14
You could buy some of his junk, coins or a hat or such, give negative feedback and dispute the charge. That might goof him up enough to deter him.
This is terrible.
I reported it as well.
LowSpeed_HighDrag
08-02-11, 16:14
Forgive me for playing devils advocate, but would anyone be against me selling ID tags from dead Germans in WW1 or II?
Forgive me for playing devils advocate, but would anyone be against me selling ID tags from dead Germans in WW1 or II?
Well Germany started their war.
To me this is as poor as if somebody in Germany was selling Jude stars. And I think most would find that objectionable.
Now IF the US started WWII and invaded Germany and it was now US territory that innocent Germans died trying to defend, then yes I would find it objectionable to sell those German dog tags.
The US didn't start the Vietnam war, the Viet Cong did. The US sacrificed American lives trying to defend South Vietnam from the communists. And now they are selling their dog tags to attempt to profit from their death.
Forgive me for playing devils advocate, but would anyone be against me selling ID tags from dead Germans in WW1 or II?
I might find it distasteful, but perhaps some of the deceased soldiers German relatives might find it downright offensive? :(
Can we resume Operation Rolling Thunder? I would support this.
Well Germany started their war.
They did not start WWI.
Forgive me for playing devils advocate, but would anyone be against me selling ID tags from dead Germans in WW1 or II?
I don't see how it's any less disgraceful...
Equally unacceptable, IMO.
LowSpeed_HighDrag
08-02-11, 16:52
As far as war memorabilia goes, I dont have a huge problem with this, although it doesnt sit well with me either. On a personal level it angers me, but Im sure it angers our former enemies when do the same things unabashedly.
Moose-Knuckle
08-02-11, 17:00
What the **** is wrong with those people???
They weren't killed.
They weren't killed.
well said
As far as war memorabilia goes, I dont have a huge problem with this, although it doesnt sit well with me either. On a personal level it angers me, but Im sure it angers our former enemies when do the same things unabashedly.
But we don't really do the same thing.
We don't invade countries, keep territory and then sell the dog tags of those who defended it.
What compounds this entire issue is the fact that it is Vietnamese doing it. Given the whole MIA thing and their atrocious treatment of US POWs this is insult to injury.
Allow me to be the devils' advocate. If you do a search eBay you will find lots of dog tags for sale. German and even U.S WWII ones.
Now another thing to be aware of. This item may not be real. Although they claim it is, if you do research you will find that in the past there were people who tried to cash in on the whole POW/MIA thing and they often approached families claiming to have senn "their loved ones" and even presented tags to prove it.
I doubt that eBay will remove it because otherwise they would have to remove all the auctions.
eternal24k
08-02-11, 18:31
while I don't think it's all that cool, I personally think they have their right.
As far as the thought of it being ok to sell German tags because they started the war.... Vietnam was in a civil war, we got involved for political reasons. It's not like Vietnam bombed or invaded American soil in an act of aggression. If the US was in a civil war where part was trying to break from a history of colonialism, and China intervened, I would have no problem selling Chinese dog tags in 40 years, they traveled across the world and stopped our battle for independence.
Just looking at it from a different point of view
Forgive me for playing devils advocate, but would anyone be against me selling ID tags from dead Germans in WW1 or II?
People in Russia actually did that for a while.
Occasionally you'll see a complete Erkennungsmarke (http://www.wiki.luftwaffedata.co.uk/wiki/index.php?title=Erkennungsmarke) for sale - that's one thing. But these ****ers didn't sell the entire disc - just the top half which was left with the soldier's body.
Pissed a bunch of people off - and it should - the dead should be left the hell alone.
Forgive me for playing devils advocate, but would anyone be against me selling ID tags from dead Germans in WW1 or II?
Equally wrong
while I don't think it's all that cool, I personally think they have their right.
As far as the thought of it being ok to sell German tags because they started the war.... Vietnam was in a civil war, we got involved for political reasons. It's not like Vietnam bombed or invaded American soil in an act of aggression. If the US was in a civil war where part was trying to break from a history of colonialism, and China intervened, I would have no problem selling Chinese dog tags in 40 years, they traveled across the world and stopped our battle for independence.
Just looking at it from a different point of view
I think the whole "colonialism" thing was solved when France got their asses handed to them. Our soldiers were there trying to protect the south from communism. Perhaps it was a "fools errand" because they (South Vietnam) didn't seem as dedicated to the cause, but men still fought and died on their behalf.
If we got invaded by Russia in 1984 and France sent troops to help us fight, I wouldn't be selling the tags of their dead.
I only wish I could take us back to 1950 and we could tell Vietnam we wish them the best and we will do the whole "lend-lease" thing but we won't be sending advisers or troops.
Seems to me that 50 years ago we wasted a lot of damn good men and have little to show for it but a huge surplus of hippies and communist sympathizers.
militarymoron
08-02-11, 19:24
well, looks like the auction has been pulled. damn - i was hoping to contact the seller and see if he was interested in buying my collection of viet cong ear necklaces.
just kidding.
LowSpeed_HighDrag
08-02-11, 19:26
well, looks like the auction has been pulled. damn - i was hoping to contact the seller and see if he was interested in buying my collection of viet cong ear necklaces.
just kidding.
I literally laughed out loud. Thank you.
i wish somebody would have contacted the person and tried to get his contact information...........
I have some mates in Thailand that owe me a favor!:angry:
I literally laughed out loud. Thank you.
I almost choked on my tea when I read that.
As far as war memorabilia goes, I dont have a huge problem with this...
I totally agree on items like bayonets, rifles, helmets, bandoliers, et cetera.
Surely they were used for or carried by someone maimed or killed in combat, but there's nothing personal about the item.
Dog tags, real or forgeries, of KIA soldiers is way too personal... Really disgusted that eBay lets stuff like this go unchecked.
In 50 or 100 years, I would not have a problem with it. Once the complete generation has died off and it has become more a piece of history and nothing personal, then it is just that, a piece of history.
Now, it still has meaning to living people and is more than history.
WW2 is right on the edge. There is only a small percentage of WW2 veterans left and their families are also moving along. In 20 or 30 years WW2 will be to the point where a dog tag from a soldier becomes a piece of history and is no longer personal. Right now I would put WW2 in there with where Vietnam is.
well, looks like the auction has been pulled. damn - i was hoping to contact the seller and see if he was interested in buying my collection of viet cong ear necklaces.
just kidding.
I had EXACTLY the same thought, except I don't of course have any ear necklaces.
But I'd be willing to trade for a Montagnard crossbow and a pair of Ho Chi Mihn sandals.
:D
In 50 or 100 years, I would not have a problem with it. Once the complete generation has died off and it has become more a piece of history and nothing personal, then it is just that, a piece of history.
Now, it still has meaning to living people and is more than history.
WW2 is right on the edge. There is only a small percentage of WW2 veterans left and their families are also moving along. In 20 or 30 years WW2 will be to the point where a dog tag from a soldier becomes a piece of history and is no longer personal. Right now I would put WW2 in there with where Vietnam is.
I tend to agree.
I just hate the thought of some kids Dads tags being for sale on ebay.
i wish somebody would have contacted the person and tried to get his contact information...........
I have some mates in Thailand that owe me a favor!:angry:
Here you go:
http://cgi.ebay.com/KIA-Original-Dog-Tag-US-Soldier-VietNam-War-KI82-/190561369555?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c5e57bdd3
http://myworld.ebay.com/le_vietnam/?_trksid=p4340.l2559
And plenty of tags still for sale.
http://stores.ebay.com/welcome2vietnam
I think selling any tags from any country is just straight up disrespectful.
variablebinary
08-03-11, 00:13
I wonder what my necklace of Vietcong ears is worth on ebay.
Think any Vietnamese would have a problem with that?
Very disrespectful I agree, but what do you expect from them?
I wonder what my necklace of Vietcong ears is worth on ebay.
Think any Vietnamese would have a problem with that?
Just the necklace? Not that much, but if it's the whole set including Vietcong Nose earrings, pinky finger tennis bracelet and scrottum change purse then you have a very valuable jewlery/accessory collection.
lol, sorry, had to join in...
FromMyColdDeadHand
08-04-11, 09:45
1. Ask the seller to forward you his account details so you can forward them onto Nigeria.
2. I think Denis Leary said it best:
We need to keep fighting. Make a couple of stops on our way home from the Persian Gulf. First stop! Vietnam! Surprise the **** out of those people, huh?" "You make a movie?" "Not this time, pal!"
Magic_Salad0892
08-05-11, 04:01
We should start a group buy, and send them back to the families of the dudes they belong to.
Don't know how we could do that though.
CarlosDJackal
08-05-11, 08:20
Maybe we should look into buying it from these scumbags just so we can send them to those Soldiers' families.
The problem might be whether or not these the actual dogtags or reproductions? What would keep them from making up names and claiming that they are real?
We should start a group buy, and send them back to the families of the dudes they belong to.
Don't know how we could do that though.
At $160 per tag that isn't very practical. And it is that impulse of the average American that they are banking on.
But we don't really do the same thing.
We don't invade countries, keep territory and then sell the dog tags of those who defended it.
What compounds this entire issue is the fact that it is Vietnamese doing it. Given the whole MIA thing and their atrocious treatment of US POWs this is insult to injury.
We're not exactly nice to our enemies, we'll kill 500 kids to get one bad guy from 22k feet if that's what it takes and call it unfortunate.
And we weren't sweetie pies when it came the the DRV we allowed the SVA to torture & kill captured soldiers and encouraged it, and it's nothing new as we do it today through proxies because we prefer clean hands, nothing wrong with that.
And we have US territories in just about every country on this planet in the form of military bases, what other type do you need to keep your tier one position in the world?
I'm all for this country, but it's not a sweet kind giant. It's an evil bastard, but it's the place I call home. Sweden would probably love to be the evil bastard of the world, and Russia & China are trying to rise to that position again. Nothing wrong with being the asshole when it's to benefit your people. Sucks for those who live under us but that's life. I won the birth lottery and just as easily could have been born a poor African in the savannah some where.
Most of the world doesn't hate us just because they need some one to hate, they have good cause. For the same reason I have good cause to be grateful for not being them.
ETA: As far as selling war memorabilia I find it distasteful in general even if it's of some dick head nazi. It glorifies something that shouldn't be glorified. War is a necessary evil and should remain that, it's not beanie babies and should be treated with a little more respect.
We're not exactly nice to our enemies, we'll kill 500 kids to get one bad guy from 22k feet if that's what it takes and call it unfortunate.
And we weren't sweetie pies when it came the the DRV we allowed the SVA to torture & kill captured soldiers and encouraged it, and it's nothing new as we do it today through proxies because we prefer clean hands, nothing wrong with that.
And we have US territories in just about every country on this planet in the form of military bases, what other type do you need to keep your tier one position in the world?
I'm all for this country, but it's not a sweet kind giant. It's an evil bastard, but it's the place I call home. Sweden would probably love to be the evil bastard of the world, and Russia & China are trying to rise to that position again. Nothing wrong with being the asshole when it's to benefit your people. Sucks for those who live under us but that's life. I won the birth lottery and just as easily could have been born a poor African in the savannah some where.
Most of the world doesn't hate us just because they need some one to hate, they have good cause. For the same reason I have good cause to be grateful for not being them.
ETA: As far as selling war memorabilia I find it distasteful in general even if it's of some dick head nazi. It glorifies something that shouldn't be glorified. War is a necessary evil and should remain that, it's not beanie babies and should be treated with a little more respect.
Where did you hear this? I understand you're trying to make a point, but air power is not employed anywhere close to what you just said. PM me if you need to.
We're not exactly nice to our enemies, we'll kill 500 kids to get one bad guy from 22k feet if that's what it takes and call it unfortunate.
And we weren't sweetie pies when it came the the DRV we allowed the SVA to torture & kill captured soldiers and encouraged it, and it's nothing new as we do it today through proxies because we prefer clean hands, nothing wrong with that.
And we have US territories in just about every country on this planet in the form of military bases, what other type do you need to keep your tier one position in the world?
I'm all for this country, but it's not a sweet kind giant. It's an evil bastard, but it's the place I call home. Sweden would probably love to be the evil bastard of the world, and Russia & China are trying to rise to that position again. Nothing wrong with being the asshole when it's to benefit your people. Sucks for those who live under us but that's life. I won the birth lottery and just as easily could have been born a poor African in the savannah some where.
Most of the world doesn't hate us just because they need some one to hate, they have good cause. For the same reason I have good cause to be grateful for not being them.
ETA: As far as selling war memorabilia I find it distasteful in general even if it's of some dick head nazi. It glorifies something that shouldn't be glorified. War is a necessary evil and should remain that, it's not beanie babies and should be treated with a little more respect.
Wow, just wow. Your ignorance of use of military power, foreign affairs, and diplomacy is simply stultifying.
Sure we have military bases all over the place. We still have a bunch in Europe (where most of our foreign deployed troops are in peacetime), but these countries don't have their internal politics dictated to them by us. Hell, in the case of Europe especially, but other nations as well, they've acted in ways directly detrimental to the U.S. both politically and economically. European nations have been doing it for decades. And since they can pretty much count on us to defend them from any potential military threat they've been able to cut their military expenditures and spend it all on peacenik happy-happy stuff.
We certainly aren't all good, but our "imperial power" hasn't been used to solely benefit Americans. Frequently our foreign adventures and money handouts have negative effects for us to the benefit of others. To compare us in the same vein as the Soviet/Russian Empire or the Chinese is, quite frankly, ****ing stupid.
Actually, I'd like to see one of two things happen. First choice would be to divest ourselves of our foreign entanglements and leave the Europeans and Japs to enter the adult world and begin to look after their own defense. Second choice would be for us to start acting like a real imperial power. We see something we want (say, oh, oil), we invade and take it. Anyone resists, we kill their entire people. Let's give "them" a reason to really hate us.
BTW, I've traveled extensively and not found many people who hate the U.S. or Americans. The few people I have found that hate us don't hate us for any specific reason. Their hate isn't justified by some laundry list of specific wrongdoing (like the Declaration of Independence for example). Usually it's just petty dick envy. Occasionally (usually from Europeans living in former imperialist nations, namely, limeys), the reasons listed are simply made up and are eerily similar to the lists of crimes their nations historically committed. The one dude I met (literally, one) who could articulate a specific reason for hating the United States and Americans hated us because we (get this) didn't invade his nation and stop an ethnic civil war.
Would be nice to buy them and then try and reunite them with their family. I would rather them stateside than in that shit hole.
Did anyone get the sellers info? I might embark on a mission and try and buy them all and see if I can get them back to the families. Chances are there are many family members alive who would appreciate their return.
If anyone has the info PM it to me.
The_War_Wagon
08-06-11, 07:22
JUST tried the link, and got this;
infoThis listing (200634126518) has been removed, or this item is not available.
Please check that you've entered the correct item number
Listings that have ended 90 or more days ago will not be available for viewing.
Hopefully, some vets banded together and beat some SENSE into the yo-yo's at E-Bay - they've only needed it for YEARS. :mad:
The_War_Wagon
08-06-11, 08:23
JUST tried the link, and got this;
infoThis listing (200634126518) has been removed, or this item is not available.
Please check that you've entered the correct item number
Listings that have ended 90 or more days ago will not be available for viewing.
Hopefully, some vets banded together and beat some SENSE into the yo-yo's at E-Bay - they've only needed it for YEARS. :mad:
Where did you hear this? I understand you're trying to make a point, but air power is not employed anywhere close to what you just said. PM me if you need to.
I am trying to make just a point, but just one example of numerous would be amiriyah in 91. Had it been some Russians doing it in 87 in Afghanistan we would have been in an uproar.
We justify collateral damage for our greater good. It's what society has done since the day we started tilling the lands. Not saying anything wrong with it. Just saying it is what it is and we're not some big teddy bear but seen by many as a bunch of assholes, assholes they would love to join up with, but assholes none the less. :D
ETA: I was talking mostly about the assassinations in Pakistan. And I'll agree since 08 we've cut down on civilian deaths considerably but prior we didn't have a problem killing a couple families to get to one guy sleeping on a carpet if the opportunity presented itself.
Wow, just wow. Your ignorance of use of military power, foreign affairs, and diplomacy is simply stultifying.
Sure we have military bases all over the place. We still have a bunch in Europe (where most of our foreign deployed troops are in peacetime), but these countries don't have their internal politics dictated to them by us. Hell, in the case of Europe especially, but other nations as well, they've acted in ways directly detrimental to the U.S. both politically and economically. European nations have been doing it for decades. And since they can pretty much count on us to defend them from any potential military threat they've been able to cut their military expenditures and spend it all on peacenik happy-happy stuff.
We certainly aren't all good, but our "imperial power" hasn't been used to solely benefit Americans. Frequently our foreign adventures and money handouts have negative effects for us to the benefit of others. To compare us in the same vein as the Soviet/Russian Empire or the Chinese is, quite frankly, ****ing stupid.
Actually, I'd like to see one of two things happen. First choice would be to divest ourselves of our foreign entanglements and leave the Europeans and Japs to enter the adult world and begin to look after their own defense. Second choice would be for us to start acting like a real imperial power. We see something we want (say, oh, oil), we invade and take it. Anyone resists, we kill their entire people. Let's give "them" a reason to really hate us.
BTW, I've traveled extensively and not found many people who hate the U.S. or Americans. The few people I have found that hate us don't hate us for any specific reason. Their hate isn't justified by some laundry list of specific wrongdoing (like the Declaration of Independence for example). Usually it's just petty dick envy. Occasionally (usually from Europeans living in former imperialist nations, namely, limeys), the reasons listed are simply made up and are eerily similar to the lists of crimes their nations historically committed. The one dude I met (literally, one) who could articulate a specific reason for hating the United States and Americans hated us because we (get this) didn't invade his nation and stop an ethnic civil war.
Really, my experiences differ. :happy: I know a number of people who dislike the influence our policies have in their country. Manly Europe and Japan. Don't know many Africans etc so not that sure about their personal views but I read a lot of foreign press and I get a feeling that we piss em off from time to time :D
And how many ethnic cleansing have we ever stopped? I'm curious because from my memory our track record is pretty bad, I'm pretty sure we've contributed to a number however because the guys doing the cleansing where anti-communists.
Not sure why people need to defend shit so blindly, you can support your country and accept it does bad shit to stay on top of the mountain. Kind of a required thing you won't find one major power in all of time that was kind and sweet.
I am trying to make just a point, but just one example of numerous would be amiriyah in 91. Had it been some Russians doing it in 87 in Afghanistan we would have been in an uproar.
We justify collateral damage for our greater good. It's what society has done since the day we started tilling the lands. Not saying anything wrong with it. Just saying it is what it is and we're not some big teddy bear but seen by many as a bunch of assholes, assholes they would love to join up with, but assholes none the less. :D
ETA: I was talking mostly about the assassinations in Pakistan. And I'll agree since 08 we've cut down on civilian deaths considerably but prior we didn't have a problem killing a couple families to get to one guy sleeping on a carpet if the opportunity presented itself.
So you're using a 20 year old example... copy. What exactly do you think bombs are used for in the AOR? Do you or have you worked with CAS aircraft? Have you read any of the joint pubs associated with the use of combat aircraft? Do you even know what document actually lays out the rules for tactical aircraft to employ weapons in the AOR? Don't worry about answering these questions because it's painfully obvious that you don't have a clue. Educate yourself and read the unclassified version of the tactical directive online.
Your example to make a point about getting to HVI/HVTs is misguided at best.
I apologize for the thread derail. I'll use PMs if this shit continues.
So you're using a 20 year old example... copy. What exactly do you think bombs are used for in the AOR? Do you or have you worked with CAS aircraft? Have you read any of the joint pubs associated with the use of combat aircraft? Do you even know what document actually lays out the rules for tactical aircraft to employ weapons in the AOR? Don't worry about answering these questions because it's painfully obvious that you don't have a clue. Educate yourself and read the unclassified version of the tactical directive online.
Your example to make a point about getting to HVI/HVTs is misguided at best.
I apologize for the thread derail. I'll use PMs if this shit continues.
As you requested taken to PM :)
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