LMT CQB MRP or Daniel Defense M4? [Archive]

Devildawg2531

08-12-11, 21:26

GeorgiaBoy

08-12-11, 22:47

The MRP is a piston rig, which most here (including me) find to be a unncessary and unneeded ad-on to the platform. While LMT makes great rifles, I wouldn't get a piston gun.

You are right about Daniel Defense - they make some great products. If I were you, I would go with one of the M4 models they offer.

My 2c.

Wiggity

08-12-11, 22:50

I like my Daniel defense, that is what I would go with.

el_chingoton13

08-12-11, 22:54

The MRP can be had with a piston but most of the barrels you can get for it are DI. If you can deal with the increased weight of it I'd go with the MRP for the modularity.

FChen17213

08-12-11, 23:25

The LMT MRP is NOT always a piston design. LMT offers both DI and piston platforms. That being said, I would opt for the DI if I went the LMT route. I don't think most people deem the piston design all that necessary for regular use unless you are in the military. The only piston design that has constantly been in harms way and established a good track record that I know of is the HK 416. I don't think any other piston platform has been widely deployed in actual combat.

That being said, I would recommend the DDM4. I don't think I've heard of anything negative said about the DD rifles. I don't have all that much personal experience but I do own 2 DD rifles with over 10k rounds through them. No problems whatsoever. Daniel Defense is a great company that will take good care of you even if you do have any issues which I seriously doubt you would. Good luck.

trojan_fred27

08-12-11, 23:56

I recently bought a DDM4 and shots like a champ!

Youtube Daniel Defense torture test...its pretty awesome.

sevin8nin

08-13-11, 00:32

I own a direct gas MRP, actually I own two. That being said, if it was between a midlength DD vs a DI MRP, the deciding factor for me would be the weight of the two vs the interchangeable barrel system of the mrp.

buckjay

08-13-11, 01:53

A big one for me was the feel of the rail in my hand as well as the weight.

The DD rail is quite a bit taller/larger and didn't feel great in my hands whereas the LMT MRP rail felt much more manageable.

I also love the ease of removing the barrel with the LMT. Even if you're not going to run multiple barrels or calibers just the convenience of being able to take out the barrel for cleaning, etc is great. I live in Hawaii and its crazy where the salt air can creep.

Either way, I'm sure you can't go wrong with either.

Devildawg2531

08-13-11, 07:34

If I go with the LMT MRP it will definetely be in the DI version instead of piston. I put 1000's of rounds through the M16A2 and don't recall ever having stoppage. A friend of mine has the POF 308 Piston and the LMT Piston 5.56 and when I told him I was looking for a top rate AR he said be sure you get the piston version unless you like cleaning all the time. To me the piston in the AR is a solution looking for a problem unless you have a can on it - besides I've already got my piston rifle in my M1A:cool:.

I do like the barrel change ease on the MRP and had pretty well locked in on LMT but kept hearing great things about the DD on this site. Also watched the DD torture test with LAV on their M4 and was amazed (maybe just great marketing - but I was impressed).
If my priorities are reliability, quality, price, decent accuracy as I will use in some matches and best fit for an HD platform. Is there an edge with either?

Thanks

scoutfsu99

08-13-11, 08:38

Both are good choices. If price is your determining factor, you'll probably end up w/ the DD. People have already said, and will continue to say, that both are good rifles. The MRP is heavier but that's the trade off for the monolithic/QC barrel platform.

I have both but the MRP is my favorite due to it's barrel change ability. It's also been said that it's not only a piston rifle. Typically you'll see it in DI. But if you ever get a suppressor or the piston urge, all you do is change the barrel and BCG. Personally, I'd drop the M1A and reallocate that money to one of these or something NFA;)

spectre04

08-13-11, 10:06

After owning both a DD M4V5 and a CQB MRP, I'd point you in the direction of the MRP. I'm 6'3"/260lbs so I may not be bothered by the added weight, but the benefits of the MRP barrel system "outweigh" the advantages of the DD (which are few). IMHO, the DD had a better finish: my MRP develops rub marks as often as I change socks. Nothing going to bare metal, but character lines instead. The DD rail (mine had the Omega X rail) is a thin little booger! I had tk add a ton of XTM panels to fatten it up. It's a fantastic design, but it honestly does not get any better than the MRP system. The MRP upper may be heavier, but DAY-UM is it strong! That, coupled with the ability to swap barrels and/or operating systems on the fly deliver the knockout punch.

If you want a great (I mean it, too) overall DI gun with a traditional barrel nut design, the DD is my choice. If, however, you want the toughest/strongest rail and most modular barrel design out there, go LMT.

Failure2Stop

08-13-11, 11:01

I like both companies. They are both excellent offerings, but there is a reason that the MRP is a more expensive proposition.

Personally, I think that a monolithic upper is the way to go. Smaller diameter HG than most, simplification of parts and installation, simplification of optics mounting, and more. I really like the 16" barrel in the rifle MRP chassis.

The DD is a superb offering of an established system, but it really doesn't offer more than other similar offerings from other respectable companies. The LMT is a step up in the evolution of the platform, much like KAC and their operating system work. Speaking of which, I would be very interested in a KAC/LMT collaboration.

scoutfsu99

08-13-11, 11:11

I'd love to see a MRP with a URX3 like front end. If not for the CQB, then the rifle version.

ALCOAR

08-13-11, 11:17

......

Failure2Stop

08-13-11, 11:20

http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC00552-1.jpg

Just so you know, I have always thought those were effing beautiful.

ALCOAR

08-13-11, 12:27

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strambo

08-13-11, 12:47

You can't go wrong with either. I have an MRP upper and another rifle with a DD upper with 12 FSPM rail. I like both of them for different reasons. I love the modularity of the MRP and have 10.5" and 16" barrels. I don't like the weight (and cost).

I love the light weight and lower cost of the DD upper, but of course can't quick change barrels on it.

If you aren't going to use the quick change barrel feature, the MRP will be more $ and weight for little gain other than a high quality monlithic upper.

GlockWRX

08-13-11, 13:59

I like where F2S's head is at.

A KAC IWS lower mated to an MRP upper with a KAC E3 enhanced barrel and bolt would be the bees knees.

ALCOAR

08-13-11, 14:25

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Devildawg2531

08-13-11, 14:44

Appreciate the great feedback; going to get the LMT MRP CQB maybe later turn my M1A into into the LMT MWS 7.62:cool:.
Anyone know of any deals on the LMT MRP going on now. The best one I'm seeing in $1519 on GunBroker. I'm in GA and don't mind driving to get one or can transfer through my dealer.

Thanks

Failure2Stop

08-13-11, 17:28

Appreciate the great feedback; going to get the LMT MRP CQB maybe later turn my M1A into into the LMT MWS 7.62:cool:.

I personally like the rifle length MRP over the "CQB" unless going with a less than 12" barrel.

Devildawg2531

08-13-11, 21:02

I personally like the rifle length MRP over the "CQB" unless going with a less than 12" barrel.

Can you clarify this? This is the model from the LMT website below it is the MRP CQB

CQB MRP™ Defender Model 16 5.56 Estimated 5 week delivery
CQB16

Availability: In stock

$1,858.74

.

Quick Overview

CQB16

Double click on above image to view full picture

More Views

. .
.

Details

(CALIFORNIA LEGAL PRICE $1888.74) The CQB MRP™ Defender Model 16 features a CQB MRP™ upper receiver with 16" chrome lined 1:7" twist 5.56 barrel, standard semi auto bolt carrier group, tactical charging handle assembly, Defender lower with SOPMOD buttstock and standard trigger group. Ships with a sling, operators manual, tactical adjustable rear sight, tactical front sight, (1) thirty round magazine, (2) heavy duty push button swivels(included as of 2011 orders), torque wrench / driver and (3) rail panels.

You must have a current Federal Firearms License on file to purchase complete weapons or serialized parts.
Direct Gas Impingement
Overall length with SOPMOD collapsed: 33"
Overall length with SOPMOD extended: 36"
A2 Birdcage compensator
1/2 X 28 thread pitch
Low profile gas black
Cryogenically treated barrel to increase accuracy, barrel life and easier cleaning
5 QD Sling Swivel attachment points
Electronically tested and recorded trigger pull Estimated 5 week delivery

Duffy

08-13-11, 23:36

My pair for Trident's :D

http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i314/Duffypoo/IMG_0008.jpg

The only gripes from me about the MRP, which can be addressed, are weight (can get it fluted or reprofiled), and barrel options (can send any barrel to be modified to work on the MRP).

I never use the quick barrel change feature, I just like the flexibility to mount my NOD on the back of a day scope if I want, though these days I don't do that either, as the monocular is mounted on the helmet now.

I was an early adopter for Daniel Defense, back in 2002 when few paid them much heed, and I am a big fan of them. The working relationship between Battle Arms and DD notwithstanding, they are one of the companies I admire a great deal.

I have an M4 12.0 FSP, Omega X 7.0, and a Mk18 RIS II, if I am buying building another upper, it will have a DD handguard on it :)

ALCOAR

08-13-11, 23:56

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variablebinary

08-14-11, 00:47

I'd go MRP

http://i1098.photobucket.com/albums/g377/VariableB/mrp1.jpg

newyork

08-14-11, 01:24

Why go MRP if you aren't changing bbls? They are heavier and more money aren't they? What does it do that a DD can't if bbl Exchange is not a concern?

Devildawg2531

08-14-11, 08:27

OP...F2S again brought up a great thought, unless your going w. a SBR build...I would STRONGLY look at the Rifle length or as I call them Stretch chassis as opposed to the CQB chassis. It's rail is equivalent to almost 14" long and that provides the end user w. a perfect rail to really extend that lead grip forward and imho generate the ideal grip. It also provides a fantastic rail for mounting a bipod(very important for myself) and ever other AR attachable under the sun, as well as protecting almost the complete length of the barrel from hard use..bumps, drops, etc. It never hurts that it's absolutely stunning in real life in terms of machining and overall feel and finish. That last part just cannot be stressed enough, again these rifle lengths start out as 7 1/2lbs solid continuous chucks of aluminum and are CNC machined for hrs to produce the final product.

Does LMT offer the MRP rifle length upper as part of a complete rifle or only as just an upper? On their website it doesn't show the tifle lenth upper as part of the complete rifle.

ALCOAR

08-14-11, 10:33

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Devildawg2531

08-14-11, 11:31

[QUOTE=TRIDENT82;1075225]You sure can pal, you might just have to specifically ask for it.

If you would like, I will PM the contact info for the Rockstar that I deal w. mainly from LMT.

That way you can talk directly to the source and avoid any confusion and make sure you get exactly what you want.[/QUOTE

That would be great or if you can PM your LMT contact I will.

Is the difference between the CQBMRP and the Rifle MRP just the rail length ot are there other differences / in function?

Thanks

Duffy

08-14-11, 12:26

Other than weight, I don't think there is any functional difference.

The longer rail allows you to put the front sight further forward. If you have a PEQ-15 or other IR laser/illuminator, you have more flexibility on its placement.

On a CQB length handguard, a PEQ-2A takes up most of the length of the handguard, so if you put it on top, there's room for a front sight and it leaves 5 or 6 rails available, not enough for some optics options. You can see this illustrated in the pic I posted on this page :)

ALCOAR

08-14-11, 12:53

.....

Duffy

08-14-11, 13:10

I agree that the weight saving from losing 7" or so is negligible, the perceived weight difference will add up if you put flashlight, bipods, or an IR laser/illuminator in front of the rifle length handguard, all this weight just feels heavier when they're away from the center of balance.

LMTRocks

08-14-11, 15:44

Barrel options:
DBMG MRP Conversion (https://dbmg-llc.3dcartstores.com/MRP-barrel-conversion_p_25.html)

If you don't like a 10 twist 6.8 find a Wilson Combat, Noveske, Bison, ARP or other barrel you want. 9mm and 22cal barrels available at Spikes. You could put a 6.8 in there and zero an ACOG to it with a Larue mount, and put an 11.5" 6.8 and a T1 on it and go.

Cazwell

08-14-11, 18:16

I personally like the rifle length MRP over the "CQB" unless going with a less than 12" barrel.

Are we talking length of gas systems or rails? I'm trying to get a better understanding of LMT MRP product / options etc.

scoutfsu99

08-14-11, 18:25

Cazwell

08-14-11, 18:31

Length of rails.

Barrels:
10.5/carbine length gas system
14.5/carbine length gs
16/midlength gs
18/midlength/gs

There's also a slew of other barrels and lengths. DSGArms has a bunch listed: http://dsgarms.com/Category/132_0/MRP_-_Monolithic_Rail_Platform.aspx

Thanks for the info. Is it fairly recent that LMT offers a midlength gas system? Seems I remember reading a year or so ago that the company strictly offered carbine length systems.

scoutfsu99

08-14-11, 18:37

Honestly I don't know. Trident will probably be able to answer your question.

kwilkin

08-14-11, 20:00

Why go MRP if you aren't changing bbls? They are heavier and more money aren't they? What does it do that a DD can't if bbl Exchange is not a concern?

This was my thinking when I (sorry, TRIDENT, it wasn't easy) sold my MRP upper recently.

I wanted the MRP for quick-barrel changes. I'm not really into accurized ARs (ie, not shooting for groups). And they simply don't offer enough caliber choices in Rock barrels to make it worth my while.

To me, it really shines if you have a SBR where you can enjoy the flexibility of different barrel lengths and calibers. Since I'm a ways out from having a SBR (moving in a year and not sure where I will be), it made sense for me to get into something different rather than sit on it (I used the funds from selling it to build a 6.8 build with Noveske barrel that I can use today).

When I finally go SBR, I will be looking first to a MRP CQB. I hope by then LMT will have brought to market more Rock barrels (I know conversions can be done, but I would rather have factory MRP barrels) in a variety of options.

Duffy

08-14-11, 20:54

I know the 18" barrel uses mid-length gas system, while 10.5" and 14.5" both use carbine length, not sure about 16" barrel though :confused:

In any case, it's been like this since 2004 when it first came out.

scoutfsu99

08-14-11, 21:06

16" for sure. I have two - one was chopped/dimpled by Marvin to 14.5. AFAIK, it's always been midlength.

underwoodbitsandspurs

08-14-11, 23:02

I am interested in my 1st AR and had planned on going with the LMT but I keep reading great thing on the forum about the DD products. I plan on setting up the AR for primarily HD / SHTF with an Aimpoint and white light. I have lots of time with the A2 while in the USMC but very little with the M4. What would be the primary differences / advantage of either of these platforms. Appreciate the input.

I have a CQB MRP and they are excellent rifles, but for a HD/SHTF rifle I would go with a DD/BCM/Colt with a lightweight barrel. I wish I would of got the rifle length MRP with a SS barrel now, I think the MRP platform is better for precision shooting. For a general purpose carbine I would look for one with a lightweight barrel. And if you want a rail, you can get one that does not weigh that much like a DD or Centurion. And I think the customer service of DD and BCM is a lot better then LMT too.