9mm Silvertip

[tpd223]

I lucked into a significant quality of 9mm Silvertip for cheap.

Knowing that it is sub-par nowadays for use as duty ammo, does anyone have the actual numbers?

I have heard that Winchester improved the ST since the FBI/Miami fight occurred, but you know how "word on the street" can be.

I have also been told, and observation seems to validate, that the ST is basically a higher QC WWB load with a pretty/shiny bullet. Just out of curiosity, does anyone know of any formal testing of the WWB 115gr JHP load?

Anyway, I was shopping for blasting ammo and ended up with 1400 rounds of the ST.
Its reliable and accurate in my Glocks, so quite a bit will get burned up in IDPA and USPSA shooting for fun, however...

For awhile now I have used the cheap Remington or the WWB 115gr JHP for "carry" when I am out somewhere that I might plink or take pot shots at coyotes and such, don't want to burn the good stuff up, but still want something that will get me by in a defensive situation (in a very low threat environment) if need be.

This stash of ST would seem to fit the bill for this use rather well.

[DocGKR]

With the 115 gr Silver Tip, in bare gel pen is typically in the 10-11" range w/RD of about 0.60" and close to full weight retention. A bit deeper ave pen through 4 layer denim or heavy clothing, as they occasionally plug up. Through auto windshields they only go 8-9" of pen and loose about half their weight, along with relatively poor RD.

[tpd223]

Thanks Doc.

I was going off of memory, wanted to try and confirm that since we know what happens to the memory box as we get older.

[DocGKR]

I forget...

[DeltaKilo]

I forget...

I suffer a longtime case of CRS...

[tpd223]

While I'd prefer to run my fav-o-rite 124gr Gold Dot or Ranger-T loads 100% of the time, sadly I haven't won the lottery yet, so for this particular mission statement the ST is going to do nicely.

I know someone will ask "WTF did you buy ST for, is ya crazy?" since it's no longer seen as decent ammo.

Eight dollars a box is my reply. I can't find Russian ball for $8/50rounds

[KhanRad]

Crappy ammo. The question is though, would you use the STs over a common FMJ load?

[200RNL]

Crappy ammo. The question is though, would you use the STs over a common FMJ load?

FMJ would have worked better for the FBI in the Miami incident.

[KhanRad]

True, but the ST will have a higher level of quality control, and better primers. I've run into my share of FMJ ammo that has had dud primers and failed to fire. The bullet design may be crap, but the other components are usually superior to FMJ ammo.

[tpd223]

Crappy ammo. The question is though, would you use the STs over a common FMJ load?

For my needs, in this case, yes.

RNFMJ goes through varmints like they weren't even hit unless you get the brain or a big bone. I have seen rabbits hit from the side with 9mm and .38 RN bullets in the classic deer hunter double lung shot placement and hop away.
In my experience 9mm 115gr JHPs wreck these type of targets.

If I was fighting bad guys in a .mil setting I would actually go with FMJ over the ST, because ball ammo is far more likely to get through stuff that this type of threat is likely to wear; mag pouches, canteens, etc.


My preferred duty 9mm ammo, being CONUS and given no land warfare restrictions, is all on Doc's list.



Whether the FBI guys would have been better off with FMJ is conjecture at best. A FMJ could have clipped the heart and ended the fight quicker, or it could have slid through the chest cavity leaving minimal damage in it's wake.

At any rate, that fight was a failure on a prep, mindset, training, applying TTPs and armament level, that the ST bullet that hit Platt could have done a better job is only a small part of the issue.

[200RNL]

Whether the FBI guys would have been better off with FMJ is conjecture at best. A FMJ could have clipped the heart and ended the fight quicker, or it could have slid through the chest cavity leaving minimal damage in it's wake.


Conjecture perhaps, but at least one perp would have had two new openings in his heart and wound track through whatever was behind it. In this particular case, the "sliding" FMJ would have been more effective than the tissue crushing, fully expanded , under penetrating, 'state of the art' Silvertip.