View Full Version : Vickers Tactical AK Class - South Hill, Virginia
Jay Cunningham
04-29-07, 15:55
We are discussing it for a possible class this fall. We are still deciding whether to hold a standard 3-day pistol carbine or Battle Rifle class in the Sept-Nov, 2007. time frame. Larry just has not made up his mind yet. I will be posting it up when we get it figured out.
Either way these are now standard Vickers Tactical classes and they will be held every year at various locations. All of them will be available in South Hill if enough guys are interested.
- 3-day pistol/carbine
- 2-day pistol/carbine
- AK class
- 1911 Handgun class
- Battle Rifle (.308)
- Low Light
- Pistol I (2-day) - Introductory Level
- Pistol II (2-day) - Intermediate Level
- Pistol III (2-day) - Advanced Level
- Carbine I (2-day) – Introductory Level
- Carbine II (2-day) - Intermediate Level
- Carbine III (2-day) - Advanced Level
Really great news and a nice curriculum - thanks for the info, Dinger.
Business_Casual
04-29-07, 16:46
FYI- Class #3 (Aug 4-5, 2007) is about 2/3 full.
This will be the last Vickers Tactical AK class for 2007.
If your interested in attending please contact me.
- Class #2 (May 10-11, 2007) is full.
Those dates concern me - I thought it was May 5/6?
M_P
Those dates concern me - I thought it was May 5/6?
M_P
My mistake.
Class #2: May 5 & 6 , 2007
I will be in CONUS for the Vickers August class. Please IM me the info so I can enroll.
I will be in CONUS for the Vickers August class. Please IM me the info so I can enroll.
PM sent
Business_Casual
04-30-07, 10:13
I would be very interested in a battle rifle class. Perhaps a separate thread on that should be started.
M_P
I would be very interested in a battle rifle class. Perhaps a separate thread on that should be started.
M_P
That's a good idea.
Let me get some more info from Larry then we can start the Fall class thread.
I think I have a pass for August 4th & 5th so put me down for the third class.
Hell, my SLR-105 has attended both of the classes so far and I haven't even been there. I figured I better go and shoot it next so it doesn't run away from home.
I think I have a pass for August 4th & 5th so put me down for the third class.
Hell, my SLR-105 has attended both of the classes so far and I haven't even been there. I figured I better go and shoot it next so it doesn't run away from home.
10-4, consider it done.
FYI - I have just six open seats for the third AK class (Aug 4-5, 2007). This will be the last Vickers Tactical AK Class for 2007.
Please contact me if interested.
Bulldog1967
05-11-07, 13:10
I think I already had my name in for the Aug class, but just wanted to check....
I think I already had my name in for the Aug class, but just wanted to check....
Hello my friend.
Your on my roster.
See you in August.
FYI - This class has six seats still available.
Please contact me if interested.
FYI - As of today VT AK Class #3 is full.
I'm still going to be taking names for a stand-by list so please still contact me if your interested in attending. This will be the last South Hill, Virginia VT AK class for 2007. Chances are we will have 1-2 drop outs so the stand-by list will most likely get used.
- Everybody on my roster for class #3 should have received the deposit & payment email last night. If you signed up and did not receive it, please contact me.
FYI - Stand by list guys be ready. I should have the updated payment list shortly. We might have an opening or two for AK class #3.
FYI - I've got three open seats for AK Class #3.
Vickers Tactical AK Class #3 - August 4-5, 2007
This will be the last VT AK Class for 2007.
Please contact me if your interested.
Bulldog1967
07-17-07, 17:08
Which hotel is everyone staying in?
Which hotel is everyone staying in?
I've made reservations at the Hampton Inn.
FYI - this class still has a few open seats.
M4arc is getting ready for the August AK class and I've already got his gear picked out. I just need to find him a pair of hand made sandles w/ truck tire tread. Luckily his B-day is right around the corner. :D
- M4arc has always been very interested in the history of the Vietnam war.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v74/va_dinger/Pith201.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v74/va_dinger/longblack.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v74/va_dinger/chinese.jpg
- I've got a few open seats for this class if anybody is interested.
I've got a Chinese 4 cell chest rig I can donate to the cause......:D
Last call:
I've got a few open seats for the Vickers Tactical AK class starting next weekend in South Hill, Virginia. I've still got plenty of time to get guys signed up.
Just let me know.
Jay Cunningham
07-25-07, 16:24
This class is highly recommended - if you think you "hate" the AK compared to your AR, this class may make your eyes bug out.
Larry Vickers
07-25-07, 16:54
I will reinforce what is being said here ref the class- everyone to a man has been surprised how well they have shot with an AK and all came away from the class with a different perspective on the weapon
Not saying they would choose it over an AR but most everyone felt they could be very effective with one - within the realm that an AK is useful (200 yds and in)
This only proves that it is the singer not the song that matters - and there is not substitute for some qaulity range time to master a given weapon system
Cheers
Larry Vickers
www.vickerstactical.com
It is nice to see the AK platforms getting more formal training,
The three Valmet Rk 62 assault rifles I was issued did not fail me once during my service, whether the sun shined or the snow poured in, and neither did I see any major problems with other users as well.
The majority of my experience before using the Valmets were AR type rifles, obviously the handling and manipulations are different, but it is up to the user how he can adapt to various weapon types.
Although I would say that the sights and accuracy of the Finnish AK type rifles are better than on the average AK type rifle available, the basic design is obviously the same.
The Vickers Tactical AK class that I attended certainly changed my opinion of the AK. Before the class I just considered them “Reliable” and “Good enough”. All of that changed during the class. I became a true believer in the AK design. With some training it can be run VERY effectively.
If you own an AK or are even considering buying one attend this class. It will change your entire outlook about them.
It’s not too late to sign up & this class has no perquisites. It can be your very 1st organized training experience.
I guarantee it will be one of the best weekends you will ever have.
- I've still got a few seats available. Just let me know if you would like to attend.
Class will start on Saturday, August 4 at 1200 (Noon). Class will let out at 2000 (8PM). Sunday, August 5 will run from 0830-1500 or completion.
Please DO NOT arrive at the range prior to 1200 (Noon) on Saturday. We have a scheduling conflict with the local 4-H club and want to prevent any issues regard range use. We will be shooting by 1230. This will also allow the Virginia guys to save themselves a night in a hotel room.
Eat lunch BEFORE you show up at the range on Saturday because we will not break for a meal until 1700 (5PM).
Bulldog1967
07-30-07, 14:38
Need directions to the range.
thx
Need directions to the range.
thx
10-4, I will get them sent out today.
I'm also going to be emailing this to everybody:
Class will start on Saturday, August 4 at 1200 (Noon). Class will let out at 2000 (8PM). Sunday, August 5 will run from 0830-1500 or completion.
Please DO NOT arrive at the range prior to 1200 (Noon) on Saturday. We have a scheduling conflict with the local 4-H club and want to prevent any issues regard range use. We will be shooting by 1230. This will also allow the Virginia guys to save themselves a night in a hotel room.
Eat lunch BEFORE you show up at the range on Saturday because we will not break for a meal until 1700 (5PM).
Need directions to the range.
thx
You drive down the first road and take a left. You go aways and then you take a right. You'll be right there!:D
Are there any plans yet for classes at the South Hill location during 2008? I didn't see anything on Larry's web site.
I've heard so much good about this training, but just couldn't swing it this year. Too bad too because I'm close by in Richmond.
Larry Vickers
07-31-07, 23:18
We will definately be doing an AK class in 2008- probably a couple
Stay tuned
Also for those coming to #3 I will of course have the Sturmgewehr (highlight of the course) as well as my newly built Iraqi Tabuk 7.62 x 39mm 'designated marksmans rifle' clone - it is a honey
See ya there
Larry Vickers
www.vickerstactical.com
We will definately be doing an AK class in 2008- probably a couple......
Great!
I would be equally interested in any AR courses at South Hill. Probably would depend on which one I could get to first.
Shall check back on the web site frequently.
(ETA: Looks like the Carbine I course would fit my skill level best.)
Is everybody ready?
VT AK Class #3 starts tomorrow at noon.
Jay Cunningham
08-03-07, 20:25
If anybody is interested in some (unsolicited) last minute tips and advice...
load your magazines tonight, both pistol and rifle
wear gloves - AK's are sharp and get hot in weird places
bring sunblock, gator-aide and high-carbohydrate snacks
clean and lube your rifle and pistol
put new batteries in your optic
relax and open your mind up
get used to Cracker Barrell
HolyRoller
08-03-07, 20:55
Check!
plus, I even test-fired my AK and pistol today. More mags still to be jammed after a last meal:)
I found out at the last minute I could make this class and the first thing to do for an AK class was, well, get an AK. I am SOOOOO glad I brought along a leftover mag from my old Chinese AK (traded for M1 Garand and $100--got the better of that one, I think) because I was going to get a rock-bottom Romanian AKM but I guess what they said about the formerly single-stack mag wells not being in spec was correct! I couldn't get that sucker in for NOTHIN. So, went a couple notches up to a Yugo underfolder. When you see me, laugh all you want at my sling, then help me fix it!
Wolf 762x39 was only 22 cents/round. Couldn't get hold of a 5.45 on short notice.
Bulldog1967
08-03-07, 21:02
Bringing my Arsenal Sa-m7s, with my wecsog AMD-65 for "backup".
http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w305/mcgeedigital/rifles/AMD-65.jpg
HR, we'll get your sling taken care of, no worries. If you have a military sling for your Yugo, check this thread out.
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=880
I bought a whole bunch of water and I'll throw ice on it in the cooler on the way down tomorrow morning, you guys are welcome to it.
See you guys tomorrow! :cool:
Jay Cunningham
08-05-07, 19:16
Looking forward to the AAR's! Should start rolling in...
:p
HolyRoller
08-06-07, 12:10
AAR, comin' right up--will be updated as I remember more stuff--early onset Alzheimer's, you know--
Window-licking short-bus moments:
Pasted targets, walked back to the line, picked up my white towel that had obviously just fallen out of my cargo pocket, mopped face, retracted bolt with the safety on and magazine in to clear the chamber (you can do this with an on-safe AK because the bolt will go only far enough to extract and eject the chambered round without picking up the next one), and was about to remove the mag when Larry said something like "dude, you did NOT do that." I said "it's on safe" but began to think it's not a good policy to clear a weapon with the mag still in, when he clarified, "you did NOT just bogart my towel!" aieeee. "YOUR towel, I thought it was MINE." Nope, mine was still in my pocket, and much smaller, although it was also white. I'm sure Larry still doesn't believe me.
THINKing that I had topped off ALL my mags before running the 24-shot box drill, plus one in the chamber, except I must have put only one 20-round box of Wolf and not the other 10 rounds in that mag, and got the big click at shot 22. Transition to pistol, hurried the last three, and put them well below the circle, which if you have not been to a Vickers class, is not kosher. So I must work on trigger control without wasting time.
Flinching every time on the three-second ball-and-dummy drill. See previous item.
Missing twice at the 50-yard line on the walkback drill the first day--yer outta here!
Missing twice at the 50-yard line on the walkback drill the second day--oh for petesakes.
Better moments:
Hitting the same target at 200 yards, on the first try, offhand! Maximum cool points, but don't mistake good luck for good marksmanship.
Finding out that Larry will be on more TV shows in the near future, Weaponology in particular, explaining and demonstrating small arms. If you're as annoyed as I am at the nincompoops that producers stick in front of cameras to pontificate on systems they haven't even fired, it will be a HUGE relief to hear from somebody who knows what he's doing.
Short bursts with the Sturmgewehr.
Hearing sincere compliments from instructors re good trigger control, when not under time pressure at least.
At the awards ceremony, after the really sharp guys walked the prize table, Larry said, "you've been shooting pretty good the whole weekend" and said I could pick something out. Hence the new TangoDown VFG in the gear bag.
The certificate from LAV and our low-profile AI assuring the rest of the world that I have demonstrated a basic knowledge of the tactical employment of the AK/AKM series of weapons.
Take-aways:
It's not the gun, it's the shooter.
If you're shooting in your comfort zone, you're wasting your time.
If you're aiming here [point at heart] and hit here [point at pectoral near armpit], that's not acceptable.
Inside 25 when your rifle does not fire, transition immediately to pistol. Between 25 and 50, it depends on the situation whether to unstop/reload the rifle or transition.
AKs can get it done if you do them right.
Reloading an AK is a finesse thing and will take a certain amount of time. However, since you've already fired 30 rounds that have had some effect, the time required will hopefully not matter.
AK factory iron sights may suck like a Hoover vacuum cleaner, and under stress you are likely sooner or later to mistake one of the protective ears for the front sight post, but some other choices are even worse. In particular, take your EOTech off your AK and put it on your AR or something.
Under stress, rounds WILL tend to go low, since humans are center-mass creatures.
Handgun trigger control is the foundation of all marksmanship.
Go to all of these classes you can, even if you have to budget for a new rifle.
More to come later.
John_Wayne777
08-06-07, 15:50
Missing twice at the 50-yard line on the walkback drill the first day--yer outta here!
Missing twice at the 50-yard line on the walkback drill the second day--oh for petesakes.
:D
Ya...them walkbacks were humbling.
I managed to keep myself from being eliminated in the first round on 3 of them (I think) and managed to go fairly far in one of the drills, but it was mostly luck. Finding that AK's front sight was a pain in the neck.
At the awards ceremony, after the really sharp guys walked the prize table, Larry said, "you've been shooting pretty good the whole weekend" and said I could pick something out. Hence the new TangoDown VFG in the gear bag.
I ended up with a nice pair of Hatch gloves thanks to the ruggedness of my beard.
The prizes for drills in our class were mostly just ammo for the STMG, and Vinh pretty much ate all our lunches the whole course anyway, so Larry had to come up with alternate prize categories. :D
AK factory iron sights may suck like a Hoover vacuum cleaner, and under stress you are likely sooner or later to mistake one of the protective ears for the front sight post, but some other choices are even worse. In particular, take your EOTech off your AK and put it on your AR or something.
That's surprising. In our class it was the guys with red dots who were pretty much beating the snot out of the poor bastards using irons. (Templar was the exception...he seemed to be capable of death-ray like accuracy with the AK irons. He managed to win one of the walkbacks with iron sights...a walkback that had us walking back a very long way...)
NCPatrolAR
08-07-07, 12:49
That's surprising. In our class it was the guys with red dots who were pretty much beating the snot out of the poor bastards using irons. (Templar was the exception...he seemed to be capable of death-ray like accuracy with the AK irons. He managed to win one of the walkbacks with iron sights...a walkback that had us walking back a very long way...)
Believe he is talking about EoTechs specifically. The high bore sight relationship created by the use of the Eo seemed to cause a few problems. I initially looked at that set up myself, but went with the the Aimpoint due to how much lower it sat on the gun.
Bulldog1967
08-07-07, 13:00
I was the guy with the Eotech, and yes it consistently made me shoot low because of the "chin weld" necessary to use it. I'll either be switching to the aimpoint and a low mount or just staying with irons, (which is what LAV suggested).
John_Wayne777
08-07-07, 15:37
Believe he is talking about EoTechs specifically. The high bore sight relationship created by the use of the Eo seemed to cause a few problems. I initially looked at that set up myself, but went with the the Aimpoint due to how much lower it sat on the gun.
Good to know...
Slinger646
08-07-07, 17:32
I was the guy with the Eotech, and yes it consistently made me shoot low because of the "chin weld" necessary to use it. I'll either be switching to the aimpoint and a low mount or just staying with irons, (which is what LAV suggested).
My EOTeched AK went TU 5 rounds in with a bad FCG. I too will be switching back to Irons.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.