View Full Version : First AR M&P15OR I am Impressed.
I was looking to buy my first AR-15, I was at a gun show a few week ago and found a used M&P15OR that a guy was selling and he said he had fired 200 rounds, the gun looked new.
Accessories are a hand rail, Vortex red dot, Mag-pul flip up front and rear sights, vertical foregrip, single position sling for $800.
I have shot it three times so far, today I shot off sandbags at 100yards with the red dot, it has a 2x eyepiece so that helps my over 50 eyes, I had forgot the magazines at home, so a slow single shot process. Well the group was as in the 2" bullseye, a 1 1/2" group, two of the bullets were almost toughing.
I was impressed, now I want to put a scope on it with detachable mount, I have a nice 3x9 to put on it.
I am really curious to see just how good this rifle will shoot, I reload and the group above was factory 55 grain HP from Remington, The barrel is a 1/9 twist so I am guessing that the 69 Grain Sierra Match BTHP will do even better.
Just saying, I am really surprised :D
Good Deal, They are nice rifles! I have the MOE. Shoot the crap out of it!
You may want to reconsider mounting that Magpul front sight on the gas block (I assume that's where it is). As for getting a deal, not really. You got a used (regardless of whether it was "claimed" to have 200 rouunds through it) and some mediocre accessories. What type of rail system did it have?
I was looking to buy my first AR-15, I was at a gun show a few week ago and found a used M&P15OR that a guy was selling and he said he had fired 200 rounds, the gun looked new.
Accessories are a hand rail, Vortex red dot, Mag-pul flip up front and rear sights, vertical foregrip, single position sling for $800.
I have shot it three times so far, today I shot off sandbags at 100yards with the red dot, it has a 2x eyepiece so that helps my over 50 eyes, I had forgot the magazines at home, so a slow single shot process. Well the group was as in the 2" bullseye, a 1 1/2" group, two of the bullets were almost toughing.
I was impressed, now I want to put a scope on it with detachable mount, I have a nice 3x9 to put on it.
I am really curious to see just how good this rifle will shoot, I reload and the group above was factory 55 grain HP from Remington, The barrel is a 1/9 twist so I am guessing that the 69 Grain Sierra Match BTHP will do even better.
Just saying, I am really surprised :D
UTG rail with the rail past the gas block, yes the flip up is on the gas block. The rail is $100, I added up all accessories and the best price around here where I live is the M&P15OR is $850, so all added up new to $1,450 so I feel I did alright.
This gets me into a AR at someones else's expense, so I can find out what I want longterm, I may even build one next.
I am sure I can sell the AR without the Vortex for what I paid for it.
I encourage you to do some more research on this site. That price is highly inflated and for 1450.00 you would be shocked to see what one could get.
1. UTG is crap.
2. The front and rear BUIS set isn't a necessity if you have something with an FSB.
3. The Vortex strike fire is also garbage. I assume that the VFG is also something along the lines of UTG or similar.
5. You could have bought a Colt 6920 and a good red dot sight for 1450.00.
For under 1000.00 you could have purchased a brand new Colt 6920 from Grant.
UTG rail with the rail past the gas block, yes the flip up is on the gas block. The rail is $100, I added up all accessories and the best price around here where I live is the M&P15OR is $850, so all added up new to $1,450 so I feel I did alright.
This gets me into a AR at someones else's expense, so I can find out what I want longterm, I may even build one next.
I am sure I can sell the AR without the Vortex for what I paid for it.
For $200 more than what you spent my buddy just bought a complete SOPMOD LMT lower, a complete COLT BCG, and a BCM CHF 16" middy upper with a Larue 9" rail from the equipment exchange here. I'm sorry, but in my opinion I wouldn't say you got a good deal on that AR15.
yeah...you could have always done better, but you also could have done a lot worse. The S&W is not a bad rifle, UTG sucks though, not familiar with the vortex. Just go out an put as much ammo down range as humanly possible and if something breaks, just replace it with a better part. Too easy!!
Congrats on your new AR!
The S&W AR's are way over gassed, so grab and H2 or H3 buffer to help with recoil a bit.
Enjoy!
C4
I encourage you to do some more research on this site. That price is highly inflated and for 1450.00 you would be shocked to see what one could get.
1. UTG is crap.
2. The front and rear BUIS set isn't a necessity if you have something with an FSB.
3. The Vortex strike fire is also garbage. I assume that the VFG is also something along the lines of UTG or similar.
5. You could have bought a Colt 6920 and a good red dot sight for 1450.00.
For under 1000.00 you could have purchased a brand new Colt 6920 from Grant.
This deal on a Colt 6920 from Grant is that the website or is this a person at a webstite I would like to check it out.
I would not have bought this rifle and all the accessories at new prices remember I bought it all for $800 no taxes no shipping no ffl etc.....
He would be the guy who posted just above your post.
This deal on a Colt 6920 from Grant is that the website or is this a person at a webstite I would like to check it out.
I would not have bought this rifle and all the accessories at new prices remember I bought it all for $800 no taxes no shipping no ffl etc.....
For $200 more than what you spent my buddy just bought a complete SOPMOD LMT lower, a complete COLT BCG, and a BCM CHF 16" middy upper with a Larue 9" rail from the equipment exchange here. I'm sorry, but in my opinion I wouldn't say you got a good deal on that AR15.
Your friend got all that for $200 more than the $800 I spent?
He would be the guy who posted just above your post.
Thanks for the website looks like with shipping and ffl around $1050 for a Colt 6920.
I am having a ball with the M&P right now, I knew when I purchased it the Vortex was a inexpensive red dot, however, I will move it to a 22lr latter on, then I may just scope my M&P for deer season.
The UTG rail you say is garbage, I really have no experience with the rail system, it is working right now, I do have the original hand grip if I want to put it back on. The VFG is coming off I really don't care for VFG's, I will put the rubber protectors that came with the UTG on it and shot it with those for now.
I am glad I purchased a used rifle for now, I can get some experience with it and learn, I did the same with a 1911 and that is working out quite well.
Thanks for the insight and the advise, I do appreciate the help.
trickytrix
09-05-11, 17:56
Great rifle - you'll find little love for S&W on this forum, but I think you did fine for the money you spent, and now you should shoot the hell outta it and enjoy :) Grant is absolutely right; you will enjoy that rifle more if you upgrade the buffer spring and buffer. As for the Vortex, they are a clone, albeit a decent clone, but still lacking in the quality department. I have one I received as a gift, mounted on an AR for a while, but it just couldn't hold zero. Moved it to a .22, and its been excellent ever since.
Failure2Stop
09-05-11, 18:06
I'm curious if you did any research here before you bought it or if you bought it and then popped in here.
The S&W MP line is what it is. It isn't the first choice for most members here for a few reasons, same with the accessories you now have. Then again, this is not the average gun board where extolling the virtues of a commercial quality will win many points. Most of our members are hard-use kind of gun owners and therefore have a different needs list than most recreational users, and are past the "look at my gat" stage. We tend to mostly be about, "what I bought, why I chose it, and how well is it performing at my intended task".
Welcome to M4, I hope you find what you are looking for, but that usually begins with the orange "Search" button. It saves a lot of time and argument.
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I don't think anyone here "hates" S&W AR's, it is just that you can get a lot more gun for a little more money...meaning that the S&W is expensive for what you don't get.
It seems to be an OK starter rifle IF you can get it cheap enough.
I'd take the UTG HG off and put a MOE on it and go shoot. Put the UTG junk back on it to sell it, some bubba will just love that tacticool quad-rail SWAT look.
Like others have said, "You cound have done a lot worse!"
What's good about guns is they don't spoil. Shoot it a while, learn what's good, save your money, then upgrade.
But maybe it's just me...
PS - Seriously, you seem to have a good attitude. That is good.
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Don't worry you could've done alot worse than S&W. Read some stickies and shoot it. UTG is not combat ready but it won't make your rifle blow up either so don't worry about that either for now.
Magpul sites are polymer and are a no go on the gas block due to heat issues. You're going to want something metal. And where are the pics :D
Mich, don't feel bad. I stumbled onto a 15OR at Gander right when Obama was going to pose the ban :rolleyes: and before I found this site. Got it for a little more than you, had a vortex too. Strike fire is probably one of the best aimpoint type clones in imho. I sold the strike fire for an Aimpoint Pro. I'm running an TRX Extreme 13" with Troy folding battle sights, Magpul CTR and MIAD. I Recently had Grant put on a Battle Comp 1.0. I may have put more into this rifle than most would but it runs without issues, for a range shooter and home defense I think it's sufficient. A hard lesson but if I were to do it again.. I'd be getting a Colt or BCM from Grant. He's really helped me along on this venture, I'm very lucky to live close to G&R. Seriously consider Grant for ANY future purchases, he won't steer you wrong.
wolf_walker
09-05-11, 18:26
OP, enjoy the thing. If you aren't a cop or going to war, you did fine.
No it isn't the best AR, but it's far from the worst. Shoot a lot, read here a lot, ask questions a lot and take answers even if you don't like them. The friction you might detect, subtle as it is ( ;) ), is that it's pretty common for someone to buy a setup like yours, come here and ask about it after the fact, not like the answers from experienced and decidedly short on sense of humor folks, and then proceed to defend there purchase till there last breath, even if it were to blow up and take there arm off. That's a bad way to go on a number of levels. I hope you have a good time with your AR, and can get some good info out of here. In no time you'll be at gun shows looking at AR stuff and saying "wow what a bunch of overpriced crap this is" just like the rest of us and ordering everything online.
Mod Edit: If you feel that something is worth of you donning the mantle of forum Jiminy Cricket, then it is worth you hitting the Report Post button and calling the attention of somebody with the actual mandate to DO something. It would have taken less time and netted better results that that horse-puckey I just got through replacing.
Congrats on your new AR!
The S&W AR's are way over gassed, so grab and H2 or H3 buffer to help with recoil a bit.
Enjoy!
C4
x2. Do this and enjoy.
Littlelebowski
09-05-11, 19:16
MichStev, I think that your next investment should be a good basic carbine class. There might even be a Michigan M4carbine.net practice group.
I cannot overstate the importance of training. I'd rather see you with a class or two under your belt than another weapon for your collection.
Your friend got all that for $200 more than the $800 I spent?
Don't fret about what that noodnik said. You have a decent 1st AR at a decent price.
Deals exist, and there's a strong contingent of fools that think that just because they can ferret out a screamin' deal = deals are obvious, and those that don't find the screamin' deal rate having the deal shoved in their face. Smacks of middle-child/beta-male insecurities, and the anonymity of the internet allows them to assume a tone they would not take if they were sitting across a table from you.
The comments about the rail and the placement of the front sight are valid. Read the stickied threads at the top of the AR GD and AR Technical subforums, and you'll see a LOT of stuff that tells you about the whys, wherefores, and howsits of an AR gun, and lend some insight as to why some folks feel a compulsive need to be dicks to a new AR owner even though they should know better.
Let's bring it back to the center of the channel, boys.
You didn't get totally ripped off. For a long while you could get a new one shipped at CDNN for about $720 shipped, and I think there was a rebate - BUT - MANY were priced WAY over that amount.
My son had one and sold it as an upper to a buddy (and gave him a smokin deal with a DD OMEGA rail).
I can say that that S&W OR shot VERY well, no hiccups, accurate with Wolf, yadyada. They are decent guns and and definitely a step up from the bottom tier. The front sight needs to be good metal. MI, Troy, etc.
Magpul sites are polymer and are a no go on the gas block due to heat issues. You're going to want something metal. And where are the pics :D[/QUOTE]
Thanks for explaining the magpul sites thing, I was not sure why not on the gas block. I will decide what to due with the sights, I am looking at a scope mount something quick detachable if you have any advice, I want to stay under $100.
I am not LEO or military, just a shooter and sometimes a hunter. I have shot a lot of 223 in a bolt gun so I plan on working up some loads for the M&P.
ac130usnsr
09-05-11, 21:27
Magpul sites are polymer and are a no go on the gas block due to heat issues. You're going to want something metal. And where are the pics :D
Thanks for explaining the magpul sites thing, I was not sure why not on the gas block. I will decide what to due with the sights, I am looking at a scope mount something quick detachable if you have any advice, I want to stay under $100.
I am not LEO or military, just a shooter and sometimes a hunter. I have shot a lot of 223 in a bolt gun so I plan on working up some loads for the M&P.
I would recommend spending that less than $100 on a front sight made to be mounted on a gas block.
For under $100 you would not even be able to buy a worthwhile quick detach scope mount, let alone optics that would be worth having.
Right now, about the best entry level QD mount/scope package you could get would be this scope; Bushnell Elite 3200 Tactical Rifle Scope 10x 40mm 1/10 Mil Adjustments Mil-Dot Reticle (http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?productNumber=950843) and this mount;American Defense Scout Quick-Release Extended Scope Mount Picatinny-Style with 1" Rings AR-15 Flattop Matte (http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?productNumber=148803); total of about $350.
That would get you something decent to start with, unless you can find better on the EE.
ETA - Sorry, misread your post and now see that you are only looking for a QD mount. For under $100, the best you're probably going to find new is a Burris PEPR QD, other than that, try finding a better quality mount (ADM, GG&G, Bobro, LaRue) on the EE.
norinco982lover
09-06-11, 00:48
That's a nice little first AR! I am glad you are having fun with it. I recently shot a S&W AR for the first time and I was also impressed at the accuracy.
"Your friend got all that for $200 more than the $800 I spent?"
Yes - he did, complete as one rifle from one seller.
Here is another example of a good deal and you don't have to be a ferret to find it... $1000: https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=87857
(Santoro bait - let's see what made up word he'll call me this time)
I'm not bashing your S&W - I have two. Change the rail, and get to shooting.
MichSteve-
If you want to see quality AR's and have a blast shooting, join us at ACTS. We shoot at Centerline Gun CLub in Bellevue near Battle Creek.
Check us out here, www.actshooters.com.
Let me know it you have any questions.
Jeff
E-man, amazing how you managed to adopt a non-snotty tone in THAT post, compared to the first one...
Hey, pal, if you want to bait me, you can do it in PMs.
However, since you even used the word we use to describe the infraction...
Littlelebowski
09-06-11, 08:30
MichSteve-
If you want to see quality AR's and have a blast shooting, join us at ACTS. We shoot at Centerline Gun CLub in Bellevue near Battle Creek.
Check us out here, www.actshooters.com.
Let me know it you have any questions.
Jeff
And that's what this site is all about....
MichSteve-
If you want to see quality AR's and have a blast shooting, join us at ACTS. We shoot at Centerline Gun CLub in Bellevue near Battle Creek.
Check us out here, www.actshooters.com.
Let me know it you have any questions.
Jeff
+1
Its a good time even if you just come and watch.
Congrats on your new AR!
The S&W AR's are way over gassed, so grab and H2 or H3 buffer to help with recoil a bit.
Enjoy!
C4
Yes they are...I've only put a few hundred rounds through one and it was pretty nice. Not the best I've ever shot, but not the worst either. Jumping from a mid length DD to the S&W though, one could tell quite a perceptible difference. This M&P came with a surefire VFG which I hated. Other than the melonite treatment, which I know little about and thus am scared of, the other deviations I noted from the 'standard' (ugrh...ok I'll say it, milspec) was a commercial diameter buffer tube and an AR15 BCG. Shot 100% for me though, but a sample group of 300 rounds isn't much of a test. In my opinion, S&W ARs could elevate themselves in the market with a few minor tweaks.
http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t294/myersma2/Guns/1117514a.jpg
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...Other than the melonite treatment, which I know little about and thus am scared of, ...
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Just curious...
I "thought" the melonite treated hardware was only on the new S&W Sport AR?
But maybe it's just me...
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scoutfsu99
09-06-11, 15:56
This M&P came with a surefire VFG which I hated.
Surefire what?
I say that you did just fine... S&W are good rifles, and that's not a bad price. it could have been worse. The accessories aren't the best, so I would probably sell all of them if possible, which would give you some extra funds to buy that scope that you want.
Welcome to the AR15
I think to most people an AR is an AR before they do research at the right place.
They may wind up stumbling over one as the original poster did, and buying it, and then getting interested afterwards. Then they come here and realize that they didn't get as good of a deal or as good of a gun as they thought.
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Just curious...
I "thought" the melonite treated hardware was only on the new S&W Sport AR?
But maybe it's just me...
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Like I said I know little about it :) so I'm not sure
Surefire what?
Surefire Vertical ForeGrip. Well it was a VFG and had a Surefire light in it so that's what I've been calling it. It's pictured in my previous post.
scoutfsu99
09-06-11, 18:38
When you said SF vfg I was looking for a 900/910 light. That's a Mako grip.
I am learning as I read the post that are made, I did a lot of research over the last 12 months or so, both on the forum and others. I am somewhat aware of the differences in the parts used in a battle ready AR.
I am not Law enforcement or Military, I am a shooter and I shoot rifle and handgun, my need for a AR is for recreational use. So to spend $800 now and see what my interest are still makes sense to me.
I may decide to get into the AR platform and build one or assemble one is more correct. I am still getting used to the feel and controls, so I am on track with my plan.
I was still surprised at the group I shot with the red dot see target below, the group measure 1 1/2". I am sure with some load testing and trying different bullets and weights I can shrink that group in half which should be 3/4" or so, this is much better than I expected.
I am not sure the red dot makes sense for me, so to get to try out a cheap one at a used price is a great way to give it a try without spending $600 for now just on optics.
I want to scope it next, a Burris detachable at $100 looks good I already have a Burris 4x12 and a Leupold 3x9 to mount on it.
SpaceWrangler
09-06-11, 19:05
Don't skimp on optics. Really.
When you said SF vfg I was looking for a 900/910 light. That's a Mako grip.
Sorry man, wasn't my rifle and I had no idea of the make.
Don't skimp on optics. Really.
This. Yea a new Aimpoint micro and mount might touch $600, but I picked up my last Aimpoint comp m2 (m68) for $315.
At what distance did you shoot the group in the photo you posted??
SW MP line of rifles is a good rifle...much better than most other "retailed" rifles.
Good thing with the MP line is that at least you have a good BCG (which is one of the most important things in a rifle)
I really like the factory trigger as well...its all around a good rifle...zero issues and it has never skipped a beat...only thing I wish is that it should have came with a H2 or H3 Buffer and its not as tight fitting as some others
I think I'm beating a dead horse but I agree so far with what most have said. S&w make a decent gun, much better in my opinion than a rock river, bushmaster, dpms, or stag. Smith was one of my first ar's and it served me well. I have since sold it and upgraded to an LMT as I have learned and shot more.
Good thing with the MP line is that at least you have a good BCG (which is one of the most important things in a rifle)
Yours has the M16 carrier?
OP, don't worrry about brands, especially for your first rifle, you're gonna end up with several mmore anyways.;)
My first rifle was a delton kit, and I got talked into buying a 20" A2 by a "gun guy" friend. I spent a couple years kicking myself for having such an unversatile first rifle.
I now own a DD carbine (in addition to a couple other rifles), and i'm sure i'lll own a whole lot more by the time I'm dead annyways.
turdbocharged
09-08-11, 14:25
Hey, its better than my first rifle... A DPMS sportical with a slickside reciever lol. What a joke. I should go back in time and kick my own ass for that, especially since it cost 750$!:blink::eek:
I agree with what the others have said ditch the utg and the other mall ninja crap and shoot the piss out of it. Eventually you may find yourself fancying an upgrade, you could purchase a BCM upper or a nice colt 6920 upper in the future.
My first AR was a M&P15MOE. The main reason I got it because it was readily available. I ordered it online from buds and I had it within 4 days for around $1k. Zero malfunction. It doesn't care what kind of ammo I use. It just goes bam everytime. I clean it once in awhile but I do keep it really wet. I just sold it recently to a buddy so I can use the fund for a KAC SR-15. We'll see if the KAC SR-15 is worth all the hype. I bought it without ever shooting one.
From ALL I have read on-line, there is ONE thing I can recall about S&W AR's: they are utterly reliable. Except for a thread I saw on a piston gun, everything says they go bang - always. That IS comforting DESPITE some of the chart/spec issues (bolt testing, 4140 steel barrels, etc.). This was true for my son's OR also. And... it was fairly accurate with Wolf - which is good and cheap.
Yours has the M16 carrier?
Yes sir, and correct me if I am wrong but those SW MP15 with the M16 carrier were supplied by LMT along with the BCG
My M&P had an "enhanced" carrier, but not an M16 one.
My M&P15 has a "mil-spec" receiver extension.
Yes sir, and correct me if I am wrong but those SW MP15 with the M16 carrier were supplied by LMT along with the BCG
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From what I remember, the early S&W AR's were supplied (at least in part) by Stag arms. Maybe Stag supplied an M16 BCG. The old "Chart" listed S&W as having M16 BCG's but the used ones I've seen all had semi-BCG's.
But maybe it's just me...
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MeanStreaker
09-08-11, 22:26
I've looked long and hard at s&w for a more budget minded gun to get the wife shooting at the same time with me. Not sure I want to drop the coin on another BCM right now. Thanks for the reports.
My first AR was a S&W MP15 OR. So far it has performed well as my training gun. I'm at around 3000-3500 rounds with it and half of that has been with steel cased ammo (Silver Bear/Golden Bear). There has been one malfunction to date, a double feed, and it happened during the night portion of a class with a aluminum mag. I run mostly PMAGs, but had a few aluminum ones in the bag.
I made some modifications to get it more up to speed. It ended up costing me more than a good complete gun would have now, but I bought during the spring of 2009 and at that time, ARs were in short supply.
One thing I did early on was to get rid of that huge, heavy gas block for something smaller and lighter, especially because I wanted to free float the barrel.
The original semi-auto BCG/carbine buffer was replaced with a BCM full-auto BCG/H2 buffer. The original BCG had weak staking. The BCM was properly staked.
The gun never had a hiccup with the semi-auto BCG (about 1500 rounds), but I made the changes to increase reliability. It still has the original MP marked bolt.
Yes sir, and correct me if I am wrong but those SW MP15 with the M16 carrier were supplied by LMT along with the BCG
I can't keep S&Ws variants straight...the one I shot definitely had a AR15 carrier, not sure from who.
I am very happy with my S&W...it has never let me down...and I run cheapo tulammo.
I too want to get a H2 or H3 buffer though
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