View Full Version : Lightest least expensive AR for petite wife?
Guys, I put together a $495 AR that weighs less than 6 pounds including an Aimpoint (already had the Aimpoint). But............I have been reading on here not so good things about the brand rifle I came up with. So, what would you suggest for a better quality similar weight and priced AR (if there is any such critter)? Bear in mind that she only shoots 100-200 rounds a year. I plan on trading this one off.
What I bought:
Lightweight DPMS Sportical upper, like new, with aftermarket quad-rail already installed, from pawn shop = $350
Plum Crazy ultra-lite lower = $145 from FFL dealer
Aimpoint = no cost, already had an extra.
Total price = $495
To date there have been about 250 rounds fired with zero malfunctions and good accuracy. Any ideas?
Guys, I put together a $495 AR that weighs less than 6 pounds including an Aimpoint (already had the Aimpoint). But............I have been reading on here not so good things about the brand rifle I came up with. So, what would you suggest for a better quality similar weight and priced AR (if there is any such critter)? Bear in mind that she only shoots 100-200 rounds a year.
What I bought:
Lightweight DPMS Sportical upper, like new, with aftermarket quad-rail already installed, from pawn shop = $350
Plum Crazy ultra-lite lower = $145 from FFL dealer
Aimpoint = no cost, already had an extra.
Total price = $495
To date there have been about 250 rounds fired with zero malfunctions and good accuracy. Any ideas?
There are probably going to be a lot of replies better than mine. But my suggestion is replace the plastic lower with a metal one. Palm state/aim surplus have some for around $80 or get a top shelf one like LMT for 150ish I think.
After that if it is just a weekend plinker not a life saving rifle I say shoot it til it fails you.
TonyTacoma
09-11-11, 12:08
Well, there is no quality rifle for 500$, it does not exist. If your rifle is functional and doing what you want then run it.
Dionysusigma
09-11-11, 12:31
Inexpensive
Lightweight
Trustworthy
Pick any two.;)
This thread may help you-
http://m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=39599
PA PATRIOT
09-11-11, 12:33
If it is only a 200rd a year recreation plinker for the wife and is running 100% why replace it? Sometimes cheap works just fine and if your wife enjoys the rifle who cares about brand.
This thread may help you-
http://m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=39599
Robb's thread inspired this (http://m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=57085) build for my wife.
Something I've observed after building several sub 6lb ARs is that my wife doesn't seem to be able to easily control muzzle rise/climb with really lightweight front ends. Effective brakes like the BattleComps have been great additions to these once we worked on her stance.
If what you have right now works then I wouldn't change anything. My wife has a DD rifle with a 14.5 LW pinned for her M41000. I think when I get back from this deployment she will switch to a MK18.
Wouldn't it be better to simply get her a good handgun?
anatolian B
09-11-11, 13:15
I would recommend a Colt 6920. At 5.95 pounds and under $1100 bucks your are arguably getting the best cost:value ration possible.
You might even save 6-8ozs swapping out the furniture to Magpul Moe. A quick search reveled a 6920 with Moe furniture for $1,120. Unfortunately the seller did not list the weight of the rifle Moe-equipped.
I would recommend a Colt 6920. At 5.95 pounds and under $1100 bucks your are arguably getting the best cost:value ration possible.
You might even save 6-8ozs swapping out the furniture to Magpul Moe. A quick search reveled a 6920 with Moe furniture for $1,120. Unfortunately the seller did not list the weight of the rifle Moe-equipped.
Seriously? You recommend a $1200 rifle to a guy looking for an affordable rifle for his wife to plink a couple hundred rounds a year with?
DeltaSierra
09-11-11, 13:45
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anatolian B
09-11-11, 13:54
As someone who has been down the DPMS road you either pay for it now or you pay for it later.
Per the OP he already owns a ceap, light plikner that is working. If he wants to go up in quality and stay light it's going to cost him.
Seriously? You recommend a $1200 rifle to a guy looking for an affordable rifle for his wife to plink a couple hundred rounds a year with?
polymorpheous
09-11-11, 14:16
At the very least get a new lower.
The upper, shoot it until you shoot the barrel out, or have the money to buy a good upper.
MeanStreaker
09-11-11, 14:16
Definitely a thread I'm interested in...
http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=6920
$990.00 for a 6920! If you live on the border "Location: Border Wars Territory"! Teach her to cover your back.... 6920 resale will have much better value too!
As someone who has been down the DPMS road you either pay for it now or you pay for it later.
Per the OP he already owns a ceap, light plikner that is working. If he wants to go up in quality and stay light it's going to cost him.
If you read the op's question, he is looking for better quality while maintaining similar weight and price (and for his wife). While that may not be a realistic expectation, there are surely options between $500 and $1200. His wife doesn't need a 6920, she fires 100-200 rounds a year. I agree with you about buying quality an buying once but my needs are different from this guy's wife.
Inexpensive
Lightweight
Trustworthy
Pick any two.;)
any two except innexpensive & trustworthy
My wife....I'd get her a 14.5 BCM light wt middie
PA PATRIOT
09-11-11, 15:08
I have to add if the wife is your only back-up for defending the homestead I would suggest she fires only your best defensive ammo while training so she knows how the rifle will print and recoil while you proof the rifle with the good stuff. I believe that you made a wise choice which accomplishes what you need it to do, a cheap, light weight little used plinker that runs 100%.
DeltaSierra
09-11-11, 15:16
Seriously? You recommend a $1200 rifle to a guy looking for an affordable rifle for his wife to plink a couple hundred rounds a year with?
It isn't $1200, and yes, I'd recommend one for his wife...
If his wife isn't worth the $1000 for a bare bones starting rifle, he needs to get his priorities straightened out.
There is NO SUCH thing as reliable and cheap.
If he wants a rifle for his wife, he should sell the one he has and put the money towards a SP6920...
Wouldn't it be better to simply get her a good handgun?
Or, listen to Iraqgunz...
If it is only a 200rd a year recreation plinker for the wife and is running 100% why replace it? Sometimes cheap works just fine and if your wife enjoys the rifle who cares about brand.
I have this same sentiment.
Wouldn't it be better to simply get her a good handgun?
She has a concealed handgun license.
Damn man, I don't get some of you with your wet dream of wifey blasting bad guys with her ar or backing you up. Maybe you even consider doing some structure clearing with her, 2 man cqb you know! The stated purpose is for her to have a reliable rifle to plink with from time to time. Shooting 100-200 rounds does not make her capable of the tactical ninja stuff you guys are picturing in your heads. If she wants a dedicate home defense rifle, fine, put down $2000 for a 6920, light, a good optic, and hopefully some training. That is not the stated purpose though.
I set up a simunition scenario with a buddy and my girlfriend. I won't go through the scenarios that we played out but suffice it to say without strong communication (coming in - come in when returning I bedroom door for example), I got painted by her plenty of times. And we weren't getting all crazy or anything. Most of the times, I was going to investigate a noise and she would go to her position in the bedroom with her g19 (g17t for scenario). Sometimes there was a gunfight and the bad guy made it to the bedroom and sometimes it was me that made it back. She only won once and I got shot by her twice. I don't feel like detailing our setups but we found many areas to improve and expand her training to improve our chances of survival against a (in this case highly trained) assailant without blue on blue.
What I am trying to say is that mall ninja crap is bad enough, stop trying to induct your wives/girlfriends into your ninja world when all she wants to do is shoot 100-200 rounds a year plinking.
Edit: the scenarios I am referring to were played out in anticipation of children in the near future. Otherwise, we have a plan to barricade ourselves with an escape route since I have no reason to leave the room as we have no other family members to protect in the home.
Samba-lee - You sound like a good man, hopefully some of the ar gurus here will be able to help you out. I'm sure there is a reasonable solution for you whether it's a different carbine or just upgrading the carbine in question with quality parts.
Damn man, I don't get some of you with your wet dream of wifey blasting bad guys with her ar or backing you up''...
I know you mean well, but my wife has won multiple combat pistol & rifle trophies. She's not a beginner, just getting older and weaker and out of practice and out of date like me. We now live on the border where home invasions are a common occurance, usually involving 3-9 armed Mexican bad guys. Dope busts here are measured in tons instead of ounces/keys. A bust a couple of weeks ago took 5 Sheriff Office PU's and a van to transport the dope back to HQ! It's a lot more dangerous down here on the Tex-Mex border than the national media lets on.
I wasn't talking to you man. I have no idea what made you think I was.
And my girlfriend is a great shooter too, I was talking about the people who were taking what you said the purpose for this rifle was to a combat level. Your stated purpose was plinking 100-200 rounds a year, not home defense. So if your op was incomplete and this rifle is for home/self defense, let me know and I'll throw in my endorsement for a 6920.
And for the record, I think lots of women shoot great. My girlfriend does. But throw in stress, chaos, and realism and marksmanship doesnt cut it. But the experience gave us areas to focus on to improve our home defense strategy. And you're absolutely right, there is no substitute for experience. I'm sure you and your wife have a great hone defense plan worked out. I wasn't talking about you.
Simba,
If you are planning on having this for a back up or a weapon for you wife to back you up, do you really want to cut corners?
I get it that she is getting older and needs something lighter. But, there are options that do not include buying shit like DPMS.
I'd also like to say that 100-200 rounds rounds per year isn't very much at all. If she can't get the practice time for whatever reason then ask yourself how effective will she be?
I'm not trying to get down on you. I'm just pointing out a few things. Most experienced shooters will tell you that shooting is a perishable skill. Even guys who shoot ALOT of rounds every year say this.
I know you mean well, but my wife has won multiple combat pistol & rifle trophies. She's not a beginner, just getting older and weaker like me. We (and two other men in our NRA affiliated club) even beat a police team of four cops (3 guys & 1 female) who had placed 3rd in the USA in police matches the year before (this was years ago). So, while not current experts like some here, we have indeed "been there" in the past. I've persobally been in multiple shooing situations (she hasn't) and I know what it takes to survive. That being the case, I wouldn't laugh at properly armed and trained women as back-ups.
sboza,
He actually didn't specify what the weapon was going to be used for- or at least I missed it.
In any case though you don't have many posts you should be keenly aware of what M4C is about. Check out our Mission Statement sometime. There are alot of us who take the AR and shooting in general seriously. If you choose not to, that's cool. But, down start shit with others who are trying to tell the OP not to waste his money.
I wasn't talking to you man. I have no idea what made you think I was.
And my girlfriend is a great shooter too, I was talking about the people who were taking what you said the purpose for this rifle was to a combat level. Your stated purpose was plinking 100-200 rounds a year, not home defense. So if your op was incomplete and this rifle is for home/self defense, let me know and I'll throw in my endorsement for a 6920.
And for the record, I think lots of women shoot great. My girlfriend does. But throw in stress, chaos, and realism and marksmanship doesnt cut it. But the experience gave us areas to focus on to improve our home defense strategy. And you're absolutely right, there is no substitute for experience. I'm sure you and your wife have a great hone defense plan worked out. I wasn't talking about you.
sboza,
He actually didn't specify what the weapon was going to be used for- or at least I missed it.
In any case though you don't have many posts you should be keenly aware of what M4C is about. Check out our Mission Statement sometime. There are alot of us who take the AR and shooting in general seriously. If you choose not to, that's cool. But, down start shit with others who are trying to tell the OP not to waste his money.
My bad brother, sometimes my Internet language doesn't come across as I intend. I didn't, for a moment, mean that the op should not upgrade or get a more suitable rifleif he so choses.
You are right, I based everything I wrote off an assumption: that at 100-200 rounds a year, the indented purpose was plinking.
With that, possible incorrect, assumption, I was upset at people telling hin that he needed to get rid of the dpms and buy a much more expensive rifle. So that is my bad. I did say in my last post that if the gun is for serious use, go for a reliable rifle (6920 for example).
I don't use crappy rifles and I would not advise anyone to do so. Given the immense ar knowledge and experience on this forum, and with my assumption of the shooters purpose, I thought the op may get some help on upgrading his rifle in a cost effective way (as cost seemed to be one of his concerns). I am a certified armorer for the ar/m4/m16 but only so I can be knowledgable in my weapon system. I don't work on rifles on a daily basis so I did t know how to directly assist the op. Probably should have kept my mouth shut.
I apologize for making an assumption which may well be incorrect. Please don't think that I ever meant to indicate that the op would waste his money by buying a quality rifle. I never said that and I have no problem with anyone spendig har earned money for hobby or profession.
And I don't post much bit that doesn't mean I haven't been around for a while. Some people just rubbed me wrong in this thread and I suppose they were just doing what I did, assume an unstated purpose and arguing from that point of view.
Thanks for the check, I deserved it. Damn assumptions.
Seriously? You recommend a $1200 rifle to a guy looking for an affordable rifle for his wife to plink a couple hundred rounds a year with?
If you have to pay $1200 for a Colt 6920, I hope your gun shop is at least lubing you up before they bend you over.
My 6920 was $1009 delivered to my FFL.
If you have to pay $1200 for a Colt 6920, I hope your gun shop is at least lubing you up before they bend you over.
My 6920 was $1009 delivered to my FFL.
Ha, my number may be a bit off. My last rifle, a le6920, was a gift from a cop buddy when he heard that I plan on le for the next step in my life. At the time, price were still a but jacked up. He paid 1200 and shipping and tax I assume. I just paid a $25 transfer fee. I'm glad prices are good right now. May have to buy another before the election madness.
PA PATRIOT
09-11-11, 17:24
I think I will build a light weight Plum Crazy for training only and see if the gun has any failures over the next year or two. So I will be ordering the following items,
Complete Plum Crazy ultra-lite lower with 6 position stock..... Cost $119.00 delivered.... $10.00 FFL fee
DD 14.5" 5.56mm Lightweight Mid-length CHF Barrel - Complete
or
DD 14.5" 5.56mm Lightweight Carbine CHF Barrel - Complete
Cost $355.00 delivered either type.
I will use a Colt upper and BCG that I have and a Polymer Quad Rail system.
I figure the cost should be $484.00 complete and the weight 5 pounds give or take a ounce or two.
Worst case is that l have to replace the lower receiver down the road if the Plum Crazy does not work out as all the other parts are reusable. Best case the rifle shoots like a champ and I have a feather weight truck/walking SHTF rifle.
I just have to decide if I want a carbine or mid-length system.
juliomorris
09-11-11, 18:58
To the op as a minimum I would get a quality lower, BCM bolt and the gas key restaked. Then let her shoot the crap out of it and have fun. It should still be prettylight
Seriously? You recommend a $1200 rifle to a guy looking for an affordable rifle for his wife to plink a couple hundred rounds a year with?
Lol, what are you, new? :lol:
At the very least get a new lower.
The upper, shoot it until you shoot the barrel out, or have the money to buy a good upper.
This. The Plum Crazy lower's quality is very suspect (to include FCG breakages and breakages near the rear extension/aka buffer tube). Forged lowers aren't much heavier and the majority of the weight that women struggle with is in the foreend/barrel. If time is not of the essence, you can even pick up a cheap forged lower for $50 right now and just build it at your leisure.
That aimpoint had better be part of the micro series or else you're adding major weight to the rifle.
ForTehNguyen
09-11-11, 19:16
youre not gonna save a lot of weight by just making the lower polymer. You can get bigger weight savings with something like a Cav Arms MkII lower and stock. It is a fixed stock but you will get more weight savings.
What's the proven problems with DPMS & Plum Crazy anyway? I haven't been able to find any facts, maybe because it's so time consuming & difficult to sort through all the posts to find substantive answers.
Hope these threads answer your questions.
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=11176
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=65729
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=81081
Lol, what are you, new? :lol:
I don't even know how to respond to your comment since it completely lacks any thoughtfullness. I made an assumption that I should not have but other that, the op wants his wife to have a rifle to shoot a hundred or two hundred rounds per year. He bought a piece of crap rifle which is serving that purpose but would like to improve quality while maintaining low weight without paying a lot more. I didn't see how recommending an expensive rifle suited what I perceived he wanted for his wife.
So maybe you could add some coherence to your sentence.
And other than the comment I am referring to, it is great to see people with great solutions for the op. That is what I love about this board, that there is so much knowledge amongst the members.
Thanks guys, after living for years where it was over 200 miles round trip to and from the nearest range we are out of practice and out of date. Way out of date!
My suggestion would have been be to build a quality lower, then toss a dedicated .22lr upper on it for plinking right now, since it sounds like that's going to be its primary role. Increase your round count so you're developing muscle memory, and .22 is the most affordable way to get better at shooting within 50m.
I would then spend the intervening time figuring out which upper configuration you like best - something like a 14.5" middy would be on the short list to look at.
If you do go with a DPMS, that lower half is certainly usable, but I've had poor luck with certain DPMS components used - that isn't the expensive part to get up to spec.
kaiservontexas
09-15-11, 07:14
I know inexpensive is part of the post, but an SBR is not done over night thanks to the paper work involved. Why not go that route? I wanted one when the ex-fiance was a concern of mine. Now it is not a priority, but that was my solution to the weight issue she had. Just a thought . . .
I don't even know how to respond to your comment since it completely lacks any thoughtfullness. I made an assumption that I should not have but other that, the op wants his wife to have a rifle to shoot a hundred or two hundred rounds per year. He bought a piece of crap rifle which is serving that purpose but would like to improve quality while maintaining low weight without paying a lot more. I didn't see how recommending an expensive rifle suited what I perceived he wanted for his wife.
So maybe you could add some coherence to your sentence.
Just a joke about the rifles that get reccomended here, no matter what you say the cheapest rifles that are blessed off by m4c are $1,000.
Wrong- the rifles that get recommended here are ones that closest meet the standards of reliablity and quality. It just so happens so many carbines price out in that category.
Myself and others have shown several times that one can build one for under 1000.00 if you exercise patience and use your brain.
Just a joke about the rifles that get reccomended here, no matter what you say the cheapest rifles that are blessed off by m4c are $1,000.
im jealous. I am shopping for a rifle for myself and you guys are already shopping for the wives. I need to hurry up and catch up with the masses here.
kaiservontexas
09-16-11, 18:01
im jealous. I am shopping for a rifle for myself and you guys are already shopping for the wives. I need to hurry up and catch up with the masses here.
Be careful what you wish or pray for . . . :help:
Naw, I am not that jaded. The current girlfriend is a blessing, but she is not in firearms. Thankfully she does not care if I own them. Eventually though I will be thinking SBR for her though . . . :happy:
Be careful what you wish or pray for . . . :help:
Naw, I am not that jaded. The current girlfriend is a blessing, but she is not in firearms. Thankfully she does not care if I own them. Eventually though I will be thinking SBR for her though . . . :happy:
For her? Excuses, excuses... Just kidding, but it's a reason, and I know I use everyone I can think of.
Tango-Alpha
09-16-11, 18:48
At the very least get a new lower.
The upper, shoot it until you shoot the barrel out, or have the money to buy a good upper.
I agree. Lots of nice lowers on the market that are very reasonably priced and I'd choose any of them over a Plum Crazy composite lower. Having said that, if you're just shooting the weapon for recreation and not placing heavy demands on it, like bump firing then you might consider just using what you have for the meantime and upgrade later.
Just a joke about the rifles that get reccomended here, no matter what you say the cheapest rifles that are blessed off by m4c are $1,000.
I never hear complaints that having to spend more than $1000 to get a reliable automobile, I guess we've been labeled as the quality nuts on the AR web simply because the members' mean round count in this board has imbued us with different information than the rest of the shooting community... and I'm dragging that average down probably.
My suggestion would have been be to build a quality lower, then toss a dedicated .22lr upper on it for plinking right now, since it sounds like that's going to be its primary role. Increase your round count so you're developing muscle memory, and .22 is the most affordable way to get better at shooting within 50m.
That there is genius at work.
Tango-Alpha
09-16-11, 19:47
I never hear complaints that having to spend more than $1000 to get a reliable automobile, I guess we've been labeled as the quality nuts on the AR web simply because the members' mean round count in this board has imbued us with different information than the rest of the shooting community... and I'm dragging that average down probably.
:confused: Huh? I didn't know you could buy an automobile for less than $1000, much less a reliable one.
kaiservontexas
09-16-11, 19:59
For her? Excuses, excuses... Just kidding, but it's a reason, and I know I use everyone I can think of.
Ok true it is an excuse ;)
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