View Full Version : Appendix IWB? Yes/No and holster recommendations?
Nephrology
09-20-11, 06:58
Howdy,
So I often find myself in relatively unpermissive environments for carry (very few of the legally off limits, mostly socially) I have tried to find a decent alternative. I almost went the .38 pocket snubbie route, decided that was out, though it may happen in the future. I instead went with a Glock 26, which I am convinced is the bees knees and certainly helped me carry during the summertime when my clothing options were limited.
I have now started thinking about the utility of AIWB. It would eliminate the bending/flexing at the hip issues which is swell, and also might make carrying while in a vehicle a little more comfortable too. Specifically, I frequent a hospital as part of my academic responsibilities and while I would be totally unable to carry inside the hospital (not only would my ass get canned but I also can't think of a way to carry in scrubs...) I would still like to be able to carry it to and from the hospital while in my car, as the hospital in question is in a very unfriendly neighborhood...
Do any of you carry AIWB? Do you think it might address some of these concerns? What holster would you recommend for AIWB carry?
I used an *cringe* uncle mikes for a few months to try aiwb carry. It worked great but always made me nervous. Having a loaded and ready weapon in a neoprene sock pointed at my man parts and major arteries was unnerving. I switched to a custom made iwb holster that is kydex on the inside and leather on the outside (facing away from me) with tuckable belt clips. It makes appendix carry much safer feeling and prints a little less. The kydex can get a little uncomfortable at the bottom after long car rides but not bad at all. Putting a little leather or fabric on the edges might help. I can carry a g27 and g23 like that all day.
As for carrying in scrubs I've never done it but a physical therapist buddy wears scrubs all day. Thankfully his work is carry friendly unlike a hospital. He either goes with a belly band + khar pm40 or a belt+ holster+ kimber 1911 under the scrubs depending on what his work for the day will be.
Nephrology
09-20-11, 07:47
As for carrying in scrubs I've never done it but a physical therapist buddy wears scrubs all day. Thankfully his work is carry friendly unlike a hospital. He either goes with a belly band + khar pm40 or a belt+ holster+ kimber 1911 under the scrubs depending on what his work for the day will be.
yeah, regrettably carrying inside the hospital is simply going to be a no-go no matter what sort of belt/holster combo I have.....
AIWB carry is becoming much more popular as of late. There is no question that it has its benefits but also has its drawbacks if thats how you choose to label them.
I have two good buddies that run AIWB and are very good shooters and very fast with that method of carry. One of them carries that way for the deep concealment that it offers.
I'm pretty sure that the Shaggy is the best holster on the market for AIWB carry but I will confirm that. They played around with a few before settling on that holster but I think thats where they ended up. I know Raven is coming out with one and I'm sure it will be another great option just like the rest of their offerings.
So yes, AIWB is a good carry option but you will need to train extensively to do it safely especially re-holstering...
So yes, AIWB is a good carry option but you will need to train extensively to do it safely especially re-holstering...
Ahh I remember the first few weeks of aiwb.... nothing like checking for string, sticks, random items being within 100 yards of the trigger 16 times before sliding my g27 into the holster pointed at my junk.
yeah, regrettably carrying inside the hospital is simply going to be a no-go no matter what sort of belt/holster combo I have.....
When I was working in a nogo environment, I ran a G27 in an ankle holster. Appendix absolutely never came close working for me at all.
Ahh I remember the first few weeks of aiwb.... nothing like checking for string, sticks, random items being within 100 yards of the trigger 16 times before sliding my g27 into the holster pointed at my junk.
Yes, your junk is a pretty important thing to keep in one piece. :cool:
Remember, its not only a holster pointed at it, its a 124gr HP staring down the barrel of your gun at your junk.
Raven Concealment Systems (http://www.ravenconcealmentsystems.com/) hands down the best!
For the past year or so, a G17 carried AIWB has been my daily carry. I really like the Archangel holster made by Dale Fricke: secure, discreet and comfortable. I tried a G19 in shorter Archangel for a while, but the platform was not as stable. If you go the AIWB route with a G26, I would still recommend a G17-sized holster.
As for the barrel of the pistol pointing at Big Jim and the Twins, just watch what you are doing when you re-holster and you will be fine.
Littlelebowski
09-20-11, 09:08
Nephrology, AIWB will address your issues if you respect the form of carry. That means work on your draw and reholster, use a good belt, and don't cheap out on a holster.
I've carried this way for over two years. The concealment is unparallelled. The comfort with the CCC Shaggy (http://shop.customcarryconcepts.com/Shaggy-AIWB-SHG.htm?productId=12) is outfreakingstanding. Mechanically, this makes for a smooth, efficient (therefore fast) draw as your weak hand has a job to do; to yank that cover garment up as your strong hand grabs the weapon and draws. Since your hands or usually near your front pockets, the speed is enhanced that way as well. I'm not saying that folks should go chasing speedy draws but once you try AIWB, it's hard to go back to the less comfortable and inefficient forms of carry.
Get the Shaggy.
Raven Concealment Systems (http://www.ravenconcealmentsystems.com/) hands down the best!
Raven doesn't have a bigger believer in their products than me but...
Can you detail the other holsters that you ran AIWB and document the variances you found between them and RCS? By documenting what YOU found, it will help others looking for an option for a good AIWB holster.
The more pics, vids etc of the various holsters in use would be great. Include what training you did, how long you have run the setup, your times etc from each holster, comfort and any other variances that you think would help this become a technical discussion, rather than guys just throwing out their favorite holster company.
The WHY is the most important part of this discussion. I like X and they are the best doesn't cut it on this board.
If you're interested in appendix carry there is a 35 page thread on this site that full of some great information and covers exactly what you're asking.
I run a Walther P99 in a CCC Looper and have been pleased with it, but I got a long time ago and I hear CCC's shaggy is the heat though for appendix.
I use a Remora holster AIWB, with a Glock 23.
I also use a High Noon Public Secret with a 1911.
For me, it is the best compromise of concealment and accessibility. It works especially well while driving.
Spurholder
09-20-11, 09:51
I've recently ventured into the AIWB world. OP, all I can say is that you might as well try it out and see if it's for you. Jury's still out for me, but I certainly see the positives concerning this form of carry.
If you're wearing scrubs, however, you might be better off with something that doesn't require a gun belt...like a Renegade Cozy Partner ankle rig. A friend of mine has been carrying his G27 in one of these for years. Another friend has had lots of success with Alessi's ankle rig for his G23.
I bought an Archangel from Dale Fricke for my Glock 19. As an aside, I had a do some light modifications to the holster as I'm using the TD/Vickers slide stop. Since the kydex on this holster's a LOT thicker than what RCS uses, it doesn't have the flex to allow the slide release to "pop" out during the draw stroke (if that makes sense). Consequently, I asked a friend of mine to dremel out a nice, wide channel for the slide stop. It answered the mail.
montanadave
09-20-11, 09:53
I have a couple of Custom Carry Concepts "Shaggy" AIWB holsters for a Ruger LCR and SP101. I've found them to be both secure and comfortable.
I have been carrying AIWB for about eight months with a HK P7M8 or Walther P99c using a Tucker "Cover Up" IWB. Although not a true appendix carry rig, it has an adjustable cant, very secure clip and I hardly even know I'm carrying. The M8 is a bit heavy but extremely safe given the squeeze cock operation which makes me feel a bit more comfortable but the P99c is my normal go to due to the lighter weight. Takes a while to get used to this method but I swear by it now! Fast, natural draw, complete concealment, comfortable; whats not to like?
Nephrology
09-20-11, 10:19
I've recently ventured into the AIWB world. OP, all I can say is that you might as well try it out and see if it's for you. Jury's still out for me, but I certainly see the positives concerning this form of carry.
If you're wearing scrubs, however, you might be better off with something that doesn't require a gun belt...like a Renegade Cozy Partner ankle rig. A friend of mine has been carrying his G27 in one of these for years. Another friend has had lots of success with Alessi's ankle rig for his G23.
I bought an Archangel from Dale Fricke for my Glock 19. As an aside, I had a do some light modifications to the holster as I'm using the TD/Vickers slide stop. Since the kydex on this holster's a LOT thicker than what RCS uses, it doesn't have the flex to allow the slide release to "pop" out during the draw stroke (if that makes sense). Consequently, I asked a friend of mine to dremel out a nice, wide channel for the slide stop. It answered the mail.
I scrub in at "work" (more of an academic obligation than a real job at this point) - this would be for going to/from work and for times when being made would be socially unacceptable. Like I said, however, I will almost certainly not be carrying while in scrubs. Simply non-negotiable - being made would be the death knell to my career. The parking lot that I park in is about as secure as one can expect (paid only and there is a security guard at the gate), it is more the drive to and from this particular hospital that I am worried about.
Thanks for the info guys. As for the supporting gear, don't worry about that - I have an Ares Ranger belt incoming and already currently carry with a Comp-Tac double layer bullhide belt.
anatolian B
09-20-11, 10:22
It is how I carry the majority of the time. With a snub-nose and my LCP it is very comfortable. When I started to carry my M&P9 AIWB it took a little time to find just the right spot, between 1&2 o'clock for me. With the longer barrel it has to fit just right so it is not jamming my junk or hitting my leg when I sit.
Howdy,
So I often find myself in relatively unpermissive environments for carry (very few of the legally off limits, mostly socially) I have tried to find a decent alternative. I almost went the .38 pocket snubbie route, decided that was out, though it may happen in the future. I instead went with a Glock 26, which I am convinced is the bees knees and certainly helped me carry during the summertime when my clothing options were limited.
I have now started thinking about the utility of AIWB. It would eliminate the bending/flexing at the hip issues which is swell, and also might make carrying while in a vehicle a little more comfortable too. Specifically, I frequent a hospital as part of my academic responsibilities and while I would be totally unable to carry inside the hospital (not only would my ass get canned but I also can't think of a way to carry in scrubs...) I would still like to be able to carry it to and from the hospital while in my car, as the hospital in question is in a very unfriendly neighborhood...
Do any of you carry AIWB? Do you think it might address some of these concerns? What holster would you recommend for AIWB carry?
Before we start, it should be realized that AIWB has been around a VERY long time.
For me, I would never carry a gun without an external safety or hammer in this position. The chances of something bad happening during your draw stroke or re-holstering and you putting one in your artery or blowing your manhood off is very high!
Since I do not like CCW guns with external safeties or hammers, this carry position is a no go.
YMMV
C4
What are people's thoughts on a cross-draw of sorts with aiwb? Holster at like 11 oclock, canted away so the barrel points away and the frame towards your strong hand (assuming left handed)
I for one, can not handle having a loaded gun pointed at my package, but I also hate "dressing around the gun."
Spurholder
09-20-11, 11:15
Sorry - reading comprehension fail on my behalf.
I scrub in at "work" (more of an academic obligation than a real job at this point) - this would be for going to/from work and for times when being made would be socially unacceptable. Like I said, however, I will almost certainly not be carrying while in scrubs. Simply non-negotiable - being made would be the death knell to my career. The parking lot that I park in is about as secure as one can expect (paid only and there is a security guard at the gate), it is more the drive to and from this particular hospital that I am worried about.
Thanks for the info guys. As for the supporting gear, don't worry about that - I have an Ares Ranger belt incoming and already currently carry with a Comp-Tac double layer bullhide belt.
For AIWB I've used the Archangel Dale Fricke and have a couple CCC Shaggy holsters for Glock/M&P pistols. I'm a regular dude and no expert but find the Shaggy the best for me. There is a lot of good threads around on different forums including this one on AIWB.
Archangel was really comfortable even after longer rides on the motorcycle, fast delivery and a tiny bit faster on the draw with a shot timer. The issues I had on the Archangel was it didn't tuck the butt of the gun in enough for me (results may vary here), expensive compared to shaggy, leather loops seemed thin/cheap(snaps were good thou) and it had a gap by the trigger area from the top of the holster. Also on the Archangel I had to mold it slightly so it would fit the thumb safety on M&P.
On the shaggy CCC has great customer service, will modify holster for you at no extra charge (M&P thumb safety) and worked out of the box on my Glock/M&P. I've tried the belt loops and don't mind them but prefer the kydex loop. My Shaggy for my Glocks has released the magazine once when I was on stomach with my Gen 3 with a vickers magazine release but that's been my only real issue. Your probably going to have to wait a little bit for the Shaggy but it's worth it.
Shaggy, Shaggy, Archangel
http://img828.imageshack.us/img828/5689/dsc00133ui.jpg
Archangel, Shaggy, Shaggy
http://img809.imageshack.us/img809/3562/dsc00132gv.jpg
http://img853.imageshack.us/img853/2245/dsc00131f.jpg
I carry off duty AIWB in an Archangel, it takes some getting used to. I'd like to try a Shaggy, but they are always out of stock....
titsonritz
09-20-11, 13:22
My preferred holster for my Glock 19 is the Dale Fricke Archangel. I ordered it custom without the standard sweat shield.
Appendix Carry
(https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=17903)
I have owned and used the Shaggy, its a great holster and works well.
I now run (and have used over this past year) a www.garritysgunleather.com In-victus. Leather is hands down the more comfortable option and the Garrity has features the Shaggy does not that increase how deep it conceals, although I found that fast release from kydex and the less pressed in grip make the Shaggy faster on the draw for me the Garrity is more invisable and more comfortable.
AIWB is a definite yes for me,especially in the summer months.
I sure as heck didn't invent the concept,but I started doing it with an off duty J frame 40 years ago,and modified existing leather holsters to work.
My reasoning was that the gun was always "right there" in any position,even backed against a wall. I gave the local shoe shop sewing machines a lot of business back then.
I like the Archangel today,but there are a lot of other good ones out there. The Shaggy has my interest too.
Hard to recommend an AIWB holster to someone else,because body type plays more of a role in the ability to carry this way than with any other form of carry.
Just took a look at the In-victus in the link that Shawn posted and I like what I see.
Raven Concealment Systems (http://www.ravenconcealmentsystems.com/) hands down the best!
The drive-by, stand-alone, status-update configuration of the above is appropriate for sites like this (http://twitter.com/), but is of tits-on-boar worth in this or any M4C subforum.
Putting aside that there's no way you understand the difference between AIWB and IWB for the statement to be factual (unless the wearer is Wilson Fisk or Jabbah the Hutt), we like our members to make at least a token attempt to stretch the critical thought process and their ability to articulate it beyond the text-message "teh bestest lulz 11!!1" level of discussion.
Nephrology
09-20-11, 18:00
Thanks for the tip guys... and yes JSantoro I did pretty explicitly ask for a longer answer as if I wanted cheerleaders I could probably find some that are a lot hotter than most of the posters here at the university I attend....
I've used the Smart Carry system (http://www.smartcarry.com/) for the past year. I wear scrubs to work every day and carry a G26 or M&P9c. My only complaint is weapon retention while removing the holster, but things seem to stay put while I'm wearing it.
I started out using AIWB carry nearly 25 years ago when faced with the need to carry a service pistol (at various times in my military career a 1911, M9, or Sig P226/228) while wearing the Navy Service Dress Blue uniform--since the jacket is a double breasted type that could not be left unbuttoned, AIWB was the only option to allow easy access to the pistol. It also worked well with BDU/DCU uniforms when not wanting to appear armed, for example on MEDCAP's.
http://www.tridentconcepts.org/alumni/Portals/0/NTForums_Attach/1127431110871.jpg
Lou Alessi made us some holsters (APX-IWB), as shown in the photo, with a slight reverse FBI cant that worked very well for this option--the only potential downside of the Alessi holster was the plastic "Talon" clip that secured it to the belt--although to be honest none ever broke or caused any problems for us.
http://www.tridentconcepts.org/alumni/Portals/0/NTForums_Attach/1127431121854.jpg
Likewise I have used AIWB for over a decade in the LE and civilian world, to carry 1911's, G19's, and most recently M&P45's w/ambi-safeties. During last year's Independence Day celebration, a couple of friends from the PD were teasing me about my uncharacteristically running around unarmed in just a hippie-cam T-shirt and shorts, as shown in the photo below--not realizing I was carrying a 5" 1911 AIWB in an Alessi holster, along with a couple of extra mags...
http://www.tridentconcepts.org/alumni/Portals/0/NTForums_Attach/1127431134258.JPG
I currently use the superb Fricke Seraphim and CCC Looper holsters to carry an M&P45 or G19 AIWB/IWB each day strong side in the 1-3 o'clock range. The CCC Shaggy absolutely did NOT work for me AIWB--I look like I have a colostomy bag in place; for my body type, the CCC Looper or Fricke Seraphim/Archangel work much better than the Shaggy. On the other hand, the guys I gave my G19 and M&P Shaggy's love them; it is all how the pistol/holster integrates with your specific anatomy. For whatever body type/ergonomic reasons, AIWB at 1 o'clock does not work for as well for me in vehicles--I do much better when I slide the holster back to about 3 o'clock and find I can access the pistol better from that location.
When carrying AIWB, a LONGER barrel helps keep the pistol tucked in and secure. However, if you go with too long a barrel for your physique, then important anatomic structures can get poked. It turns out that AIWB can be less comfortable when bike riding and on horseback, especially with a 5" 1911... At 6 feet, 195 lbs, I find the G26 has far too short a barrel for stable carry and too short a grip for effective shooting. The G19 is the smallest I want to go with for AIWB--it works well if you are going to bike ride, otherwise pistols the size of a G17 are more than acceptable for daily carry AIWB with the proper holster and attire selection. Depending how your holster rides, the location of the holster on the belt, and your clothing, the shorter grip on the G19 can be an advantage over the G17 for some folks with AIWB.
Note that the pistols I have most frequently carried AIWB--1911's, G19/17's, and M&P's are either striker fired or cocked and locked. There will be NO problems if appropriate care and prudence is exercised while slowly re-holstering along with simultaneously tilting the holster AWAY from all critical anatomic areas that could be perforated or damage if the pistol inadvertently discharges. Much like other endeavors requiring error free performance such as flying, deep scuba diving, rock climbing, and performing surgery--DON'T MAKE A MISTAKE when doing this!
Nephrology
09-20-11, 22:09
Thanks for the post, Doc. I am going to probably get the holster sized for my G19, then. I am a little shorter than you - 5'10" - and am pretty lanky (150lb) , so I will have to do some playing around to see what will work.
Currently I have a Comp-Tac MTAC whose adjustable clips I might start messing with to see if I can get a good feel for what might work for me.
I messaged the CCC guys and they aren't even taking orders til mid-october. Fortunately winter is right around the corner but that still doesn't solve my hospital dilemma... I was also hoping the position of the AIWB would help resolve some of the issues associated with disarming inside a car, as I dont want to futz with a loaded gun if I can avoid it....
This fellow knows a thing or two about AIWB:
http://pistol-training.com/archives/2998
It won't go bang unless you put your finger on the trigger and pull...
Nephrology
09-20-11, 22:29
This fellow knows a thing or two about AIWB:
http://pistol-training.com/archives/2998
Believe me, I would want a LOT of "dry" practice around the house carrying AIWB before I even thought about stoking it with anything besides a snap cap...
titsonritz
09-20-11, 23:35
My preferred holster for my Glock 19 is the Dale Fricke Archangel. I ordered it custom without the standard sweat shield.
Appendix Carry
(https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=17903)
BTW: I have worn this rig for 62 hours staight without issue, that includes 2 nights sleeping with it on. I can not speak highly enough about it.
Nephrology
09-21-11, 07:08
What do you guys think of the blade tech? do they produce an AIWB holster worth looking at?
I think I saw a review of their "nano" recently on this very forum. Is that GTG for AIWB? I ask because as a student it would be much cheaper than the Archangel and much more available than the shaggy....
As with all things I am more than willing to pay th price and wait it out to buy something worth keeping if need be.
Bulldog7972
09-21-11, 08:15
BTW: I have worn this rig for 62 hours staight without issue, that includes 2 nights sleeping with it on. I can not speak highly enough about it.
Now this just proves the old adage"different strokes for different folks" is true. I recently purchased an Archangel after reading rave reviews about it on another site. After receiving it and trying it out I can tell you that I ABSOLUTELY HATE IT! Imho, the CCW Shaggy is a far superior AIWB holster.For the life of me I can't understand what all the fuss about the AA is. I do know that I will NEVER buy another AA but will buy at least one or two more Shaggy's. To each his own I guess.
One thing that I really like about the Remora is its versatility.
It doesn't have a clip, so it can be easily moved around until you find that sweet spot that works for you.
Another plus is ease of removal. Quite often I have to be in NPE, so it's real easy to remove the holster in the car. The pistol stays in the holster, and I can stow it in a COM safe.
After using the Remora for a while, it helped me decide which holster to buy when I wanted to spring for a good one.
I bought it for my SP101, but was pleasantly surprised when it also fit my G23 just as well.
For the price it's a good investment to make, while embarking on your holster quest.
Littlelebowski
09-21-11, 09:12
Now this just proves the old adage"different strokes for different folks" is true. I recently purchased an Archangel after reading rave reviews about it on another site. After receiving it and trying it out I can tell you that I ABSOLUTELY HATE IT! Imho, the CCW Shaggy is a far superior AIWB holster.For the life of me I can't understand what all the fuss about the AA is. I do know that I will NEVER buy another AA but will buy at least one or two more Shaggy's. To each his own I guess.
Not the first time I've heard those words about the Fricke AIWB stuff.
Nephrology, take a look at the Cane and Derby Pardus AIWB holster (http://www.caneandderby.com/concealed-carry-kydex-holsters/pardus-kydex-holsters/pardus-appendix-carry-kydex-holster.html). I've heard good things about them from people that would know.
Howdy,
So I often find myself in relatively unpermissive environments for carry (very few of the legally off limits, mostly socially) I have tried to find a decent alternative. I almost went the .38 pocket snubbie route, decided that was out, though it may happen in the future. I instead went with a Glock 26, which I am convinced is the bees knees and certainly helped me carry during the summertime when my clothing options were limited.
I have now started thinking about the utility of AIWB. It would eliminate the bending/flexing at the hip issues which is swell, and also might make carrying while in a vehicle a little more comfortable too. Specifically, I frequent a hospital as part of my academic responsibilities and while I would be totally unable to carry inside the hospital (not only would my ass get canned but I also can't think of a way to carry in scrubs...) I would still like to be able to carry it to and from the hospital while in my car, as the hospital in question is in a very unfriendly neighborhood...
Do any of you carry AIWB? Do you think it might address some of these concerns? What holster would you recommend for AIWB carry?
I've been carrying IWB exclusively for a few years now.
Prior, I carried strong side behind the hip.
I can't say it'll work for you of course, but it has for me addressed all the situations you list (except carrying in scrubs).
A lot of holsters popular with the AIWB crowd have already been mentioned. I personally use a modified Comp Tac CTAC and it has served me so well all these years that I have yet to order a dedicated AIWB holster.
Some thoughts on the subject based on my personal experience:
Although there are a lot of variables to consider like how deep the gun is tucked into your pants or where between 12-3 o'clock to position your weapon, I find the most critical is getting the butt to stay flat against your body.
This is the failing of many universal straight drop holsters for me. They allow the butt to pivot away from the body and print. The dedicated AIWB rigs have different methods to tuck the butt close to your body. Holster clips/loops offset closer to the trigger guard area rather than the slide area tend to push the butt closer to your body. Raven's ACR takes this concept to the extreme.
This is the first time I've seen the Shaggy close up, and you can see the wedge that the loops are mounted on that will cause your belt to push the gun butt against your body. Looks to be a very good design and I can see why a lot of people are so keen on it. I think I'll be trying one out if ever they start taking orders again.
titsonritz
09-21-11, 14:26
Nephrology, take a look at the Cane and Derby Pardus AIWB holster (http://www.caneandderby.com/concealed-carry-kydex-holsters/pardus-kydex-holsters/pardus-appendix-carry-kydex-holster.html). I've heard good things about them from people that would know.
Interesting rig, looks very well constructed, but I wonder with that second belt loop positioned above the slide if it would tend to pull inward and force the pistol butt outward?
On the subject of belt attachment (this is strictly theory not experience talking here with regard to AIWB) I tend to lean toward the more narrow double type like on the AA over the single broader type on the In-Victus and standard Shaggy (yes I know CCC offers multiple options) because the dual loop has more flexibility in positioning options. I like the single wider loop for their stability but have found they limit were the holster can be placed on certain pants due to varying belt loop positions. I wear multiple pant types/brands and prefer the flexibility two loops offer, primarily with AIWB (less of an issue with standard IWB IMO) where I find position and angle very critical to comfort and concealment. This single issue has kept me from ordering an In-Victus which I do like from what I’ve seen. I’d be interested in hearing the thoughts and experience of others as mine is limited on AIWB.
Now this just proves the old adage"different strokes for different folks" is true. I recently purchased an Archangel after reading rave reviews about it on another site. After receiving it and trying it out I can tell you that I ABSOLUTELY HATE IT! Imho, the CCW Shaggy is a far superior AIWB holster.For the life of me I can't understand what all the fuss about the AA is. I do know that I will NEVER buy another AA but will buy at least one or two more Shaggy's. To each his own I guess.
Bulldog, I am curious how much you wore your AA because honestly I hated it at first too. In fact it nearly turned me off of AIWB altogether. On a recommendation from a knowledgeable guy I hang with I went back to it and tried different positions and angles until I found my “sweet spot” and working angle. I can see a tendency of giving up on a holster too soon especially when processing other options that work better rather than pushing through the learning stage.
Tits,
Long story short, no, no issues with the belt loop positioning.
Highnoon Hideaway (horsehide, steel clip).
Kahr K9 (I also use one for my H&K P2000 Sk).
I'm not usually a fan of "clip on" type holsters, but the Highnoon steel clip is a whole other animal. It goes on fairly easily, but you have to remove your belt to get it back off. I use a 1.5" dbl. thick sharkskin belt.
The clip is also sized so that it does not slide around on my belt.
The horsehide resists sweat really well, is thin, holds it's shape even after 12 hot hours sweating on it and is comfortable against the skin.
The Hideaway rides low so the grip blends in with the belt line, but the grip is still high enough to get a hand on easily, there's no sweat guard either, so that means less bulk and fewer things to interfere with the draw.
http://i126.photobucket.com/albums/p82/JodyHuggins/hnoon.jpg
I tried a number of leather/kydex holsters before finding a comfortable & affordable option that works for my S&W M&P9c w/thumb safety (YMMV):
http://www.highnoonholsters.com/Product_Line/_Mr_Softy/_mr_softy.html
Tomac
I have a Dale Fricke appendix holster for my G19 which I love. One of the tabs broke. I need to send it to him. It is my favorite mode of concealed carry.
Bulldog7972
09-22-11, 08:30
Interesting rig, looks very well constructed, but I wonder with that second belt loop positioned above the slide if it would tend to pull inward and force the pistol butt outward?
On the subject of belt attachment (this is strictly theory not experience talking here with regard to AIWB) I tend to lean toward the more narrow double type like on the AA over the single broader type on the In-Victus and standard Shaggy (yes I know CCC offers multiple options) because the dual loop has more flexibility in positioning options. I like the single wider loop for their stability but have found they limit were the holster can be placed on certain pants due to varying belt loop positions. I wear multiple pant types/brands and prefer the flexibility two loops offer, primarily with AIWB (less of an issue with standard IWB IMO) where I find position and angle very critical to comfort and concealment. This single issue has kept me from ordering an In-Victus which I do like from what I’ve seen. I’d be interested in hearing the thoughts and experience of others as mine is limited on AIWB.
Bulldog, I am curious how much you wore your AA because honestly I hated it at first too. In fact it nearly turned me off of AIWB altogether. On a recommendation from a knowledgeable guy I hang with I went back to it and tried different positions and angles until I found my “sweet spot” and working angle. I can see a tendency of giving up on a holster too soon especially when processing other options that work better rather than pushing through the learning stage.
Based upon your above statement, I'll give it another try. But I seriously doubt that I will ever like it as much as my Shaggy. I think that what the AA needs to make it work for me are a better mounting system such as the one used on the Shaggy and then placing it a little higher up. On my Shaggy, if you look at the rear of the holster you will see that the entire pistol is covered by the holster with the exception of course of the grip. Even the magazine release button is covered. I still get a good grip on the pistol but it rides lower in my trousers than the AA. On the AA however, more of the pistol is exposed including the magazine release button. It rides higher in the trousers which means it has a tendency to want to pop out of the trousers, much more than the Shaggy. All this means that the Shaggy,IMHO, is more comfortable to wear while still giving me a good combat grip. But I will give the AA another try.
(first post, apologies if I'm supposed to post an intro somewhere...I looked and didn't see a thread on that topic).
I've been carrying A-IWB with a G19 or 17 almost exclusively for a few years now and have tried a few different holsters.
The first was the Comp-tac "2 o'clock" which I didn't like at all. Very uncomfortable for me, and did not provide very good concealment as it didn't pull the butt of the pistol into my body very well.
Next was the "Cover Up" from Tucker Gunleather. Very comfortable and thin, worked really well. The weak point was the kydex clip. It was a little fragile, and I always had concerns that it wouldn't stay put. The only time I had an issue with it was when the holster came out of the pants with the gun during one of SouthNarc's ECQC classes. Never had any other problems in training or EDC, but that incident bugged me.
The next one I tried was the Fricke Archangel, I still have and really like this holster. It's fast and, for me, very comfortable. It also sits up high enough to allow a full grip on the gun. The only problem is, as others have mentioned, it doesn't seem to pull the butt of the gun in quite as tight (probably because it sits just a little higher). Not a problem in cooler weather when wearing heavier clothing, but a little bit of a pain in the summer when wearing a t-shirt or hawaiian shirt.
The best one I've tried so far is the "IWB #4" from DesBiens Gunleather. http://www.desbiensgunleather.com/iwb-holsters/
Very comfortable and secure, and the rotating PTD loop allows some "give" so it shifts a little when seated or riding the motorcycle, etc. It rides high enough to allow a good grip on the gun, but not so high that it presents concealment issues. YMMV...
Pics:
Archangel and Cover-up
http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h67/kenpotex/Fricke%20Archangel/0032.jpg
Archangel:
http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h67/kenpotex/Fricke%20Archangel/002.jpg
http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h67/kenpotex/Fricke%20Archangel/005.jpg
Nephrology
09-22-11, 11:52
Great replies guys, thanks so much for the input. I am scoping out the holsters as we speak. Fall is around the corner so I am not in a huge rush but I will definitely be grabbing one of these by the end of the spring. I wish there was an easier way to find out which one was for me without having to buy them, as it seems like everyone is a little different with their AIWB preferences, but I guess there is only one way to find out...
What do you guys think of the blade tech? do they produce an AIWB holster worth looking at?
I think I saw a review of their "nano" recently on this very forum. Is that GTG for AIWB? I ask because as a student it would be much cheaper than the Archangel and much more available than the shaggy....
As with all things I am more than willing to pay th price and wait it out to buy something worth keeping if need be.
I have experimented with the Blade-Tech Nano for AIWB with an M&P compact. I think it has potential, but did not work for me. It is thin, light and can be adjusted for a vertical cant. However, I found it rode too high and wanted to roll out. I think this could be solved with a longer barrel, or a smaller gut. Either way, it's a good quality versatile holster.
Littlelebowski
09-22-11, 12:08
Great replies guys, thanks so much for the input. I am scoping out the holsters as we speak. Fall is around the corner so I am not in a huge rush but I will definitely be grabbing one of these by the end of the spring. I wish there was an easier way to find out which one was for me without having to buy them, as it seems like everyone is a little different with their AIWB preferences, but I guess there is only one way to find out...
Might as well order a Shaggy now.
A lot of good choices here. IMHO the FIST Inc #1K with body protection is the perfect AIWB holster for a Glock 26.
I don't have a pick of the G26 model but here are a few showing my G19 with a FIST #1K with body protection. Basically the same. Notice how slim this is. The spring clip is very stout and strong.
http://i215.photobucket.com/albums/cc109/Kalash47/IMG_0803.jpg
http://i215.photobucket.com/albums/cc109/Kalash47/IMG_0804.jpg
http://i215.photobucket.com/albums/cc109/Kalash47/IMG_0801.jpg
nobody knows
09-22-11, 20:51
I have also been thinking about aiwb for a bug on the left side. But with my primary g19 at the 4:30 position iwb. I think I'm going to give it a shot wen I find a good holster.
Nephrology
09-22-11, 20:57
Might as well order a Shaggy now.
I would, if they were taking orders! :P
+1 for FIST ultra-thin kydex IWB holsters.
I strong-side carry a G19 in one 7 months of the year, when cool enough for some kind of jacket.
I appendix carry a J-frame in one the other 5 months of the year, when too hot for anything but a t-shirt.
Both of mine differ from that pictured above though. They have the wrap-around front edge, and use a split-J-hook belt loop.
After many years trying just about everything, I have used these two rigs exclusively for the past several years. They are the best overall solution for me, and at this point are as much a part of me as my wallet and keys.
Nephrology
09-23-11, 09:30
+1 for FIST ultra-thin kydex IWB holsters.
I strong-side carry a G19 in one 7 months of the year, when cool enough for some kind of jacket.
I appendix carry a J-frame in one the other 5 months of the year, when too hot for anything but a t-shirt.
Both of mine differ from that pictured above though. They have the wrap-around front edge, and use a split-J-hook belt loop.
After many years trying just about everything, I have used these two rigs exclusively for the past several years. They are the best overall solution for me, and at this point are as much a part of me as my wallet and keys.
What model FIST do you use for AIWB?
The Shaggy is still the best option out there.
I don't like the full wrap around on that DF holster, which does little more than prevent you from using the holster for other hand reloads and such. Price point and design is lacking, IMO, too.
I don't always carry AIWB anymore, I have a IWB that I wear at 3 o'clock that I'm pretty happy with. Depending on my dress though, sometimes AIWB is more fitting...it's just not a carry mode to take lightly, or rush into.
I don't always carry AIWB anymore, I have a IWB that I wear at 3 o'clock that I'm pretty happy with. Depending on my dress though, sometimes AIWB is more fitting...it's just not a carry mode to take lightly, or rush into.
Jim.
Well said.
You're spot on. I see way too many people "new" to firearms rushing into shoving a gun in their crotch region simply because it seems like a good idea. When i ask them what the first rule of firearm safety is and they cant answer that i calmly ask them to please never put a gun in that location again. :)
Nephrology
09-23-11, 11:07
The Shaggy is still the best option out there.
I don't like the full wrap around on that DF holster, which does little more than prevent you from using the holster for other hand reloads and such. Price point and design is lacking, IMO, too.
I don't always carry AIWB anymore, I have a IWB that I wear at 3 o'clock that I'm pretty happy with. Depending on my dress though, sometimes AIWB is more fitting...it's just not a carry mode to take lightly, or rush into.
Yeah, fear not, I am far from rushing into it. My gun money is better spent on ammo/IDPA at this point anyway. Probably some spare parts, too... but especially as next summer rolls around, I will be more interested.
Littlelebowski
09-23-11, 11:40
Jim.
Well said.
You're spot on. I see way too many people "new" to firearms rushing into shoving a gun in their crotch region simply because it seems like a good idea. When i ask them what the first rule of firearm safety is and they cant answer that i calmly ask them to please never put a gun in that location again. :)
If they don't know the first rule, please tell them not to carry at all.
If they don't know the first rule, please tell them not to carry at all.
I cant go THAT far...
Idiots will do what idiots want to do no matter what i tell them but once i mention the prospect of blowing ones balls off, their eyes widen and they tend to listen.
Its...amazing...
What model FIST do you use for AIWB?
Same as for strong-side, but with the cant in the opposite direction. The j-hook belt-looped FIST comes in a cant-adjustable version.
I keep the AIWB J-frame S&W at about 5-degrees muzzle-forward cant, just slightly off from straight-drop. (The strong-side G19 is at a FBI-standard 15-degrees breech-forward cant.) Folks with different builds can adjust to whatever is most comfortable.
Sorry I don't have any pics handy of the AIWB J-frame, but here are a couple of the G19, just to get an idea of what the holster looks like. It is the most minimal bulk I have found that still provides adequate support/retention/security, etc., at least as an IWB (I would want something more substantial for OWB). In addition to adjustable cant, the split J-loop allows working around variable pants-loop positions.
Again, this has been part of the wallet-and-keys daily kit for the past...hmm...5 years now, so obviously works for me anyway.
(Disclaimer: I hold no financial interest in FIST :p )
http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n232/blackscot/fist_off.jpg http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n232/blackscot/fist_on.jpg
Littlelebowski
09-23-11, 12:32
I cant go THAT far...
Idiots will do what idiots want to do no matter what i tell them but once i mention the prospect of blowing ones balls off, their eyes widen and they tend to listen.
Its...amazing...
Absolutely disagree. If they don't know the first rule, they shouldn't be touching a firearm. Not know the first rule and carrying on the strong side hip makes them even more likely to shoot someone else.
Probably more on-topic for one of the "face-palm" threads, but I sometimes wonder if most people who own guns probably shouldn't. I am as pro 2nd Amendment as anyone, but I've also just seen too much idiocy.
Absolutely disagree. If they don't know the first rule, they shouldn't be touching a firearm. Not know the first rule and carrying on the strong side hip makes them even more likely to shoot someone else.
Lil,
Erm, i agree. What im saying is that i have no control over what these tards will do with their own firearms.
I CANT take their guns away from them no matter how much i would like to do so.
I just make the choice not to shoot with these jacktards.
Littlelebowski
09-23-11, 13:57
Lil,
Erm, i agree. What im saying is that i have no control over what these tards will do with their own firearms.
I CANT take their guns away from them no matter how much i would like to do so.
I just make the choice not to shoot with these jacktards.
Understood but please don't hesitate to tell some that carries conventionally and doesn't know the first rule not to carry either. Don't limit yourself to would AIWB carriers.
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