View Full Version : FJ Cruiser Owners
Gutshot John
09-27-11, 16:13
My wife and I are in the market for a new car (the Saabaru is getting traded in) and I've had a yen for the FJ Cruiser which reminds me of the old 1960s Land Cruisers which may be the coolest 4wd ever made (IMO). She said I could get what I wanted this year, if we bought her a car next year that she wanted...I figured that's a fair deal.
Dealer inventory of these are pretty tight and since I'm a member of Costco, the only local participating dealer has a Trail Teams with the BF Goodrich All Terrain tires etc. The dealership is looking to make a deal before the end of the month. The chances of me going off-road with any regularity aren't much but there are a few times a year when it would probably happen (hunting season, camping etc.) and I would probably go off-road a lot more often if I could.
Has anyone owned one and regretted it? Are the All-Terrain tires going to piss me off on normal pavement? Should I wait until I get some better options in stock?
I don't own one of these, but do like them a lot. The local Toyota dealership has one that is a dark OD green with black rims. Pretty slick! I would buy one if they came in a 4dr.
C4
Gutshot John
09-27-11, 16:45
That's probably the trail teams which is the exact model I'm looking at. The 2011s are all green.
They're not 4 door per se but they do have swing out suicide doors.
My buddy just got a 08' with BF Goodrich Mud Terrain tires...My impressions from riding in it as a passenger in the front and in the back is the ride is very uncomfortable for me. I would assume that the mud tires and the fact that the vehicle itself is promoted as an off road vehicle may have something to do with it.
It looks cramped but sitting inside it feels very open and spacious (in the front), again my speculation is from the increased head room/roof. The V6 has very little acceleration/pick up and feels tremendously underpowered. It is definitely a two person car as the backseat has little room.
The FJ has the looks going for it though. These are my observations and opinions, this is coming from a Tundra driver so I may be a little biased :D
Has anyone owned one and regretted it? Are the All-Terrain tires going to piss me off on normal pavement? Should I wait until I get some better options in stock?
No regrets. The motor, trans and ride comfort have been terrific. FJ blind spots? No problem. I've driven stuff with no side visibility and you use the mirrors. So far no fences, trees or garbage cans have died at my hand.
I run BFG KM2's, which are basically knobbies for the street. They hum if I get on the expressway and drive me crazy in 2 hours. Under that they are completely tolerable. I will go to the BFG AT's next time and those should be sweet.
The TT is a sweet rig. If I had the cash I would have one. The TT's I've seen have the mono-color. Sa-weet!
MPG is a drag - if you put bigger tires on expect 16 mpg
My buddy has one with the 6 speed manual tranny and it will get up and go. Im 6'4 and bouncing around in it off road the "oh shit" handles will bust your noggin. You cant see a dang thing in reverse, I mean nothing makes backing a trailer a nightmare.
Gutshot John
09-27-11, 17:00
According to my research they've upped the horsepower in recent years as that was a common complaint.
The reviews I've read mark it as an excellent off-road vehicle...practical/comfortable/everyday vehicle? Not so much.
I'm just wondering how much I can live with. I hate full-time 4wd/Awd so my options are really limited to that or the Tacoma (wife hates pickups) and I don't think it will ride much better on the road anyways (at least according to the reviews). So it's either dedicated SUV or something practical.
What about a Jeep? or a Tundra :D
eternal24k
09-27-11, 17:04
My friend had one, I loved the look and concept but it has a cramped back seat and killer blind spots. He ended up selling it for a crew cab Tacoma and is much happier.
I still think they are sexy, but the blind spots are reallly bad
The reviews I've read mark it as an excellent off-road vehicle...practical/comfortable/everyday vehicle? Not so much.
Mine is my everyday driver. More comfy than the 2011 Jeep Patriot I just rented for 3 days and it hauls everything I want. What "practical" are you looking for? Last I checked, this is a Toyota built in Japan. Quality and reliability from everyone I've heard and I've had zero issues in 2+ years.
I still think they are sexy, but the blind spots are reallly bad
Horse hockey. Use your freaking mirrors and brain. If you're a blind senior citizen, then sure, stay away.
eternal24k
09-27-11, 17:42
Horse hockey. Use your freaking mirrors and brain. If you're a blind senior citizen, then sure, stay away.
cool story bro, doesn't change the fact they are there.
cool story bro, doesn't change the fact they are there.
Taking a ride doesn't make one an expert on visibility from the Captain's chair! Ya know, most complaints are from elderly women who couldn't see above the wheel without sitting on a copy of their Betty Crocker cook book. I think I'm starting to have a little fun with this! Thanks!
Taking a ride doesn't make one an expert on visibility from the Captain's chair! Ya know, most complaints are from elderly women who couldn't see above the wheel without sitting on a copy of their Betty Crocker cook book. I think I'm starting to have a little fun with this! Thanks!
I have driven my Buddy's 4 or 5 times, plenty to know visibility out of that thing sucks. I did step out of an F250 before driving it therefore I may be biased.
I like most everything else about it.
eternal24k
09-27-11, 19:35
Taking a ride doesn't make one an expert on visibility from the Captain's chair! Ya know, most complaints are from elderly women who couldn't see above the wheel without sitting on a copy of their Betty Crocker cook book. I think I'm starting to have a little fun with this! Thanks!
ok, spent a lot of time in it and it sucks, enough for it to be one of the first things he mentions and a factor for him selling it.
I was in the market for one when he bought his, and I'm glad he bought it first. Ultimately I decided my 4runner was a lot more practical without the cons.
"Ya know, most complaints are from elderly women who couldn't see above the wheel without sitting on a copy of their Betty Crocker cook book. " you sound like a really bright guy, so i am sure there is some statistical data to back this up.
I'm sorry if I insulted you, I know how some people get with their precious belongings. I see it all the time with [insert brand/model] gun owners. I was just putting my input through my observations and the experience of a friend. I know 2 people who had them, they are both happier with a Toyota truck or SUV of a different flavor.
4x4twenty6
09-27-11, 19:54
I think the FJ's are good looking vehicles. There are few in my area that are fixed up for offroad and really look bad ass. As for all terrain tires, i have some pretty aggressive a/t's (Mastercraft Courser C/T) and it is not bad at all. I drive an f150 4x4 so i have the E load range tires and they are great so far. Mud terrains are a pain in the ass on the road if you dont keep the rotated often and they make a lot of noise
I like the new Jeep Wrangler especially since they have the new v6 with a bunch more power. I have seen some videos and the comparative acceleration tests show the old v6 doesnt hold a candle to the new one. You can get it in 4 doors too.
Gutshot John
09-27-11, 19:57
I'll never buy an American car, from an American car company, ever again.
Especially those that take tax payer bailouts.
4x4twenty6
09-27-11, 20:05
I hear ya. I have only owned Fords and I have loved every one of them. I wont own any other American made vehicle.
I'm sorry if I insulted you
Not at all, I'm just having fun! Party on Wayne... :D
I worked for 15 yrs at Ford Motor Company. It's an industry fact that Chrysler makes the worst vehicles of the Big Three.
I've stated it before and I'll state it one last time: Ford didn't need a gov't loan because they mortgaged EVERYTHING (including the Blue Oval) for a $22 billion loan back in 2006. Call it "inside info", luck or "the first to fail"; it is what it is. I KNOW because I was there and chose to bail once it became hushed knowledge within the company. I'd much prefer that GM, Ford and Chrysler were all US-owned as opposed to us losing Chrysler (some time ago to Daimler-Benz and now Fiat). So if gov't loans were required then so be it. Once you have no domestic industry and you report to foreigner who despise you and treat you as property perhaps you (and others who gripe about GM) will "get it". Somehow I doubt that many will, though.
Now that this is out of the way try looking at the Ford Raptor. Let me qualify this: I, too, am not pleased with domestic vehicles and I have some issues with Ford Motor Company but I LOVE what they did to that truck. It could have been (and should have been) a "Rogue Warrior" as opposed to a "Raptor" but that's another story for another time.
I, too, adore the FJ. It's cramped, has huge blind spots and gets poor fuel economy. The dark green with black wheels STILL has me looking at it despite it's "flaws". Hell, I swear it whispers to me at night in a way Porsche does. Maybe they take turns. I dunno. But I find myself trying to justify purchasing one.
Gutshot John
09-27-11, 22:20
Other vehicles I'm considering:
Toyota: Rav4, Venza, Highlander
Honda: Crosstour, CRV and Pilot
Nissan: Xterra
4x4twenty6
09-27-11, 22:38
My parents own an Xterra and I have driven it enough to have a valid opinion. Drives good, great acceleration and breaking, steering is good too. The ride is uncomfortable in the back seat and ok in the front. Seats themselves are not all that comfortable. Getting in and out of the back seat is a pain cuz of the wheel well and door shape. I'm 6 feet tall and it's awkward getting in and out while trying not to drag your ass across the wheel arch which gets dirty. Cargo is cool cuz it's plastic all the way around.
Overall not a bad vehicle. I wouldnt own one because it doesn't fit my needs. My parent love it cuz it gets 21 mpg on the highway and it's just the two of them so a midsize suv is all they needed.
Other vehicles I'm considering:
Toyota: Rav4, Venza, Highlander
Honda: Crosstour, CRV and Pilot
Nissan: Xterra
Of the above mentioned, I would choose the Xterra hands down. The Xterra is the only one of these vehicles which is a true 4WD truck. The others are cars with an AWD type system. Given that you are looking at an FJ, I would assume you are wanting a truck that gives you a real off road bias. The Xterras are rugged trucks that have good off road reputations. The newer ones (since 2005 or so) have strong engines. They are simple 4WD systems (or at least were when I looked at them) but are available with locking diffs is you want better traction. In the end, I went for the larger 4Runner instead of the Xterra.
I would strongly recommend you looking at a 4Runner as well. The V6 models will get into the low 20mpg range which is about the same as the FJ (they share the same engine and drive train). While they don't have quite as good off roading ability (but still among the best of all the SUVs on the market), they have much better daily driver qualities in terms of visibility, ride, ease of entry, and cargo space. Lots of FJ owners have switched to 4Runners upon becoming dads......
have one 4 years now and love it ;)
its a killer off road rig and a good road rig but the blind spots are over blown IMHO it is tougher in some areas no doubt but only when backing out of a car space really use your mirrors go slow never a issue
check out the blue room lots of info their
http://www.fjcruiserforums.com/
http://www.happyfishstudio.com/Chad/1.jpg
no vehicle is perfect if you want it only for the road cause you like it then go for it but I think for those not wanting to off road there are better choices for daily driver for SUVs
for off road again they are incredible rigs but with lift tires and heavier roof rack heavy bumper winch etc... I get about 15 MPG tops
they are a great rig for durability/reliability though and I would not get rid of mine for any other rig except a land cruiser
its built in the Japan plant where commercial vehicles were made or at least was not sure if they changed that ?
the frame and such is basically the prado which is a landcruiser setup
kids fit fine in the back but adults would be tight and it would suck to be in the back :)
I have had tacomas before and a older FJ40 along with a few other off road and 4x4 rigs my two fav would be my FJ40 and this vehicle :)
We looked at the FJ Cruiser a couple of years ago and ended up getting a 4Runner SR5 V8 instead. It has been a phenomenal automobile and very comfortable. The V8 has good power and the gas mileage isn't terrible. We average around 24 HWY with it.
The Sequoia is also very nice and worth taking a look at.
Moose-Knuckle
09-28-11, 02:38
Well since our masters at the EPA won't allow us lowly serfs to import the Toyota Hilux, I went with the Tacoma.
Though if I had the Federal Reserve Notes I'd opt for a hand made Icon FJ. . .:eek:
http://icon4x4.com/overview/fj/models
a Icon would be cool ;) and of course a hilux would be cool also
Mr. Goodtimes
09-28-11, 11:12
Well since our masters at the EPA won't allow us lowly serfs to import the Toyota Hilux, I went with the Tacoma.
Though if I had the Federal Reserve Notes I'd opt for a hand made Icon FJ. . .:eek:
http://icon4x4.com/overview/fj/models
That ICON is pretty sick but 88k?? I think I'll just stick with restoring and doing a SAS on my 94 Ranger.
EDIT: If I had the money, however, I would most definitely throw it at these guys as I can appreciate a dedicated simple, hand made off roading vehicle. What they're doing is simply awesome. I'd order up an FJ43 with the diesel option. If I had 88k to spend on a vehicle I'd throw it at one of these trucks way before a Porsche or something of similar cost.
4x4twenty6
09-28-11, 13:32
ICON is a pretty sweet vehicle. I am partial to the early Ford Bronco's and if I had the money I would definitely build one. My first vehicle was an '89 Bronco and that thing was a ****ing beast. I wish i never would have sold it.
It would be nice if the EPA was completely done away with and let the car companys compete on their and come up with technology based on consumer needs and not a bunch of lies. This whole GREEN fever with our gov't is a big ****ing joke and a fraud.
ShortytheFirefighter
09-28-11, 13:38
I'll put another vote in for the Xterra. When I bought my last car they were on the short list, but in the end I ended up buying another WRX hatchback. My daily commute is over 50 miles and the mileage would have killed me. That was about the only thing holding me back. I'd take one over an FJ any day unless it was one of the aforementioned Icon trucks. I've always been partial to the older Toyota and Land Rover Defender models.
My wife and I are in the market for a new car (the Saabaru is getting traded in) and I've had a yen for the FJ Cruiser which reminds me of the old 1960s Land Cruisers which may be the coolest 4wd ever made (IMO). She said I could get what I wanted this year, if we bought her a car next year that she wanted...I figured that's a fair deal.
Dealer inventory of these are pretty tight and since I'm a member of Costco, the only local participating dealer has a Trail Teams with the BF Goodrich All Terrain tires etc. The dealership is looking to make a deal before the end of the month. The chances of me going off-road with any regularity aren't much but there are a few times a year when it would probably happen (hunting season, camping etc.) and I would probably go off-road a lot more often if I could.
Has anyone owned one and regretted it? Are the All-Terrain tires going to piss me off on normal pavement? Should I wait until I get some better options in stock?
do you find Costco gives you better purchasing power than buying yourself? (I'm in the market for a new Jeep... :D )
Gutshot John
09-28-11, 17:36
I don't know that it gets us better purchasing power. You still have to find your own financing. I would say it probably gives you slightly better pricing, the local Toyota guy said $300 over invoice.
I talked to my mechanic today (the guy I've gone to for years) and his recommendations were Toyota, Honda or Jeep. He's said he's seen rusting issues with the Xterra and some mechanical problems.
He likes the FJCruiser and 4Runner in terms of SUVs, Tacoma is a good truck though he thinks they are overpriced for what they are. Honda he likes them all but says the Pilots ride reaaaalllly nice. Jeep he says the Wrangler is the only one worth considering....so an American car did make it onto my list.
Short List:
1. Jeep Wrangler - full offroad capability in a reasonably comfortable on-road vehicle, nice amenities, better pricing and more incentives put this high on the list and it does look pretty cool. I'm a bit worried about quality here
2. FJCruiser - Great quality and offroad capability but the on-road performance makes me balk a bit. Little to no incentives and spartan amenities make it cool, but I'm a bit worried about comfort and practicality on long road trips
3. Honda Pilot - Great reputation for quality, on-road capability, luxurious amenities and very nice ride but weak off-road performance kind of eliminates the logic behind getting an SUV
eternal24k
09-28-11, 18:49
I am not sure what utility you need or weather you will be dealing with, but I would test drive the 4runner or rav4 too. Many a road trip I have gone on driving a Pilot. it is a very nice ride, but does not handle as tight as the 4Runner and as you mentioned, horrible off road (which might not matter to you), i live in the mountains up a long steep private road, and I have also had the pleasure of digging that thing out, its AWD so no nice 4 low, you can put it in what they call 4 low, but it takes about 1 ft of movement to engage, which sucks in 3 ft of snow. I loved the rear window that went down in the 4runner, great for lumber.
There are a lot of factors:
do you live in urban, rural, suburban? offroad/snow? family? other hobbies?
Gutshot John
09-28-11, 19:17
Live in suburban neighborhood, up a steep hill and winters around here can be gross. I'm outdoorsy, hunt/camp/shoot, wife not so much.
We test drove the RAV4 and it was ok but more my wife's speed then mine. This is my car, wife gets hers next year.
Test drove the Wrangler and I was very impressed, best all around ride so far, true 4x4, very comfortable and nicely equipped.
do you find Costco gives you better purchasing power than buying yourself? (I'm in the market for a new Jeep... :D )
I can tell you when I went in to get mine I used costco but wanted to see what they could do first ? so haggled and got it down they said no way could they do any more etc...
then said OK how about this and did the costco thing and it came down another 1 or 2 k forgot but a good chunk !
cant blame em for trying :)
a buddy of mine in the car industry told me that costco checks up on every sale and if the dealer tries to get more than the guaranteed amount over the actual invoice the dealership looses the costco deal ! so dealers dont mess about !
interesting to hear that ?
I usually never buy new cars though ? but these in 2007 were in short supply and hard to come buy and were not used yet ;) heheheh
will be curious what you think of the FJ when you test drive it ;)
I can say when I think there are better road cars I would not trade mine in for anything
I had a MB S class just before my FJ and can say the MB S class is most likely the finest touring type road long distance car you could ever get for under 100K :) and have done the same 1500 mile trip in that and my FJ and while the seats are not comfy compared to the MB they are not uncomfortable to me but can say driving it still makes me feel great every time I get in it I just love the thing park it still look back and smile inside
I think if one ever had a FJ40 or similar model they know the love of FJ fever
also the interior room for me is good in the FJ things like the rav4 are to tiny feeling :)
I still do think their are better options for on road with a touch more civility to them but again I like the more basic feel no fancy set it to 76 degrees type air conditioner ? just turn the dial to about this position :) like most cars used to have :) but who cares mine cranks out in the phoenix summers just fine and I stay cool
only thing I would like a bit more storage and refinements of the 4 runner at time but would not give up the FJ for them :)
these to me are the creature comforts I dont miss to much
when I moved here I left on Maui a Porsche a BMW convert 3 series and a suzuki GV japan model not spec for US ? but good small 4x4 true transfer case and frame low etc.. it replaced our toyota tacoma that was stolen :)
I am a car guy had some nice rides and even with cool cars most of them make it a few years and I get bored move on etc.. again I dont see getting rid of the FJ cause I do love it so much and trying to think ? I dont think their are to many other cars I have owned for over 4 years ?
Army Chief
09-28-11, 20:26
Were money no object, I would honestly have a hard time turning down an old Land Rover D90 Defender. Since it is, I went with an old (TJ) Jeep Wranger instead, at 1/3 the price. The Wranger is inefficient, loud, and drives like you're sitting on top of a washing machine ... and I pretty much love everything about it. When the east coast was in the process of getting pounded with several feet of snow last winter, we threw it in 4WD and drove to the movies. ;)
The FJ is an attractive and purpose-built vehicle, no doubt, though I suspect I would just head back to the Jeep dealer myself. It's hard to argue with what works.
AC
Gutshot John
09-28-11, 20:29
I test drove the FJ a few days ago. I liked it but it definitely felt like driving a serious off road vehicle. Which is fine but it lacked the on-road refinement and prompted me to write the OP. Visibility was constrained but would just take getting used to, though I'm not sure the wife could make the adjustment safely since she's never driven a big truck before.
All in all I'm very impressed with everything about the Jeep which has made me reconsider my bias against American cars, I'm still not as sure about long term quality though.
Belmont31R
09-28-11, 20:34
Were money no object, I would honestly have a hard time turning down an old Land Rover D90 Defender. Since it is, I went with an old (TJ) Jeep Wranger instead, at 1/3 the price. The Wranger is inefficient, loud, and drives like you're sitting on top of a washing machine ... and I pretty much love everything about it. When the east coast was in the process of getting pounded with several feet of snow last winter, we threw it in 4WD and drove to the movies. ;)
The FJ is an attractive and purpose-built vehicle, no doubt, though I suspect I would just head back to the Jeep dealer myself. It's hard to argue with what works.
AC
Our Jeep is a total POS and I can't wait til we get rid of it. 05 Liberty limited 4WD. Also based on about 4 dealers its obvious they have zero interest in after the sale support even under warranty and TSB's.
As far as the lack of rear view my 350Z can't get any worse. Every time I back up until Im about half way through the maneuver I have no idea if someone is coming down the lane or what.
Our Jeep is a total POS and I can't wait til we get rid of it. 05 Liberty limited 4WD. Also based on about 4 dealers its obvious they have zero interest in after the sale support even under warranty and TSB's.
As far as the lack of rear view my 350Z can't get any worse. Every time I back up until Im about half way through the maneuver I have no idea if someone is coming down the lane or what.
The Libertys are kind of in a realm of their own as far as most Jeep people are concerned. I think they've been pretty well excommunicated from the family. I wouldn't look at their performance as indicative of the rest of the Jeep family, particularly the Wranglers.
If you do end up looking seriously at a Wrangler, subscribe to the magazine Tread Lightly. If you don't have another way of getting one, the subscription will get you a Chrysler Affiliates code for Affiliates pricing (-1% off factory invoice). I've heard you can usually negotiate another 1% lower than that price if you're good at that kind of thing.
Myself, I've been happy with my 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee. It was quite an ordeal to purchase it, but its without a doubt my favorite vehicle. Its nice to have a vehicle that really feels like it fits me.
Belmont31R
09-29-11, 00:01
The Libertys are kind of in a realm of their own as far as most Jeep people are concerned. I think they've been pretty well excommunicated from the family. I wouldn't look at their performance as indicative of the rest of the Jeep family, particularly the Wranglers.
If you do end up looking seriously at a Wrangler, subscribe to the magazine Tread Lightly. If you don't have another way of getting one, the subscription will get you a Chrysler Affiliates code for Affiliates pricing (-1% off factory invoice). I've heard you can usually negotiate another 1% lower than that price if you're good at that kind of thing.
Myself, I've been happy with my 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee. It was quite an ordeal to purchase it, but its without a doubt my favorite vehicle. Its nice to have a vehicle that really feels like it fits me.
I understand its not a "real" Jeep, and we only have it because it was gifted to us by my parents. I actually like the thing except for the chronic problems and gas mileage. I like the interior layout and all that but there is 'always' something wrong with it or this or that part thats broke.
I test drove the FJ a few days ago. I liked it but it definitely felt like driving a serious off road vehicle. Which is fine but it lacked the on-road refinement and prompted me to write the OP. Visibility was constrained but would just take getting used to, though I'm not sure the wife could make the adjustment safely since she's never driven a big truck before.
All in all I'm very impressed with everything about the Jeep which has made me reconsider my bias against American cars, I'm still not as sure about long term quality though.
ahhh :) yeah that describes it pretty much :)
curious if you did a 4runner yet ? what you thought ? or did I miss that you drove one ;)
for my 2nd rig I might look at a used 2003-2007 land cruiser :)
save a ton over original and still get a great rig that can do insane stuff but better on road characteristics than the FJ I am told by people that have driven both and a platform that has stood the test of time and will be around at the 400,000 mile mark if take care of ;)
living in the islands most my life the only older rigs you see many of are toyotas :) when I lived in Honduras it was mostly older toyotas you saw that survive
not knocking other rigs just saying toyota has a good track record of making long term vehicles :)
eternal24k
09-29-11, 06:47
Myself, I've been happy with my 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee. It was quite an ordeal to purchase it, but its without a doubt my favorite vehicle. Its nice to have a vehicle that really feels like it fits me.
Out of curiosity, does your Grand Cherokee have tow points? My friend did not have a single one on his, but it was a late 90s, wondering if they fixed that.
Gutshot John
09-29-11, 07:08
I haven't driven the 4Runner. I'm sure I would have liked them best of all but to get one equipped the way I would have wanted puts it out of my price range.
Basically it's coming down to the safety/quality of the FJCruiser vs. the drivability/comfort of the Wrangler. The Wrangler probably fits my needs better and has more amenities, but there is something to be said about the FJ's cool factor and practicality (just hose it out).
I subscribed to Tread Lightly anyways.
I haven't driven the 4Runner. I'm sure I would have liked them best of all but to get one equipped the way I would have wanted puts it out of my price range.
Basically it's coming down to the safety/quality of the FJCruiser vs. the drivability/comfort of the Wrangler. The Wrangler probably fits my needs better and has more amenities, but there is something to be said about the FJ's cool factor and practicality (just hose it out).
I subscribed to Tread Lightly anyways.
I have been looking at 4x4's recently and always seem to come back to the Wrangler. I really like the 3 piece hard top on the four doors. Been to the dealership to paw over one but have yet to drive one. Currently I drive a 3 Series but I am getting tired of the hitting debris on I-15. Seems I can't go a week with hitting some kind of crap and the road is busy when I am on it, seems like I never have the chance to switch lane and avoid.
I plan on joining Tread Lightly, seems like a nice way to get a hassle free price.
The wife and I picked up a 2010 Trails Team. We love it! She drives it to and from work, and we are getting 16 to 18 mpg.
GET ONE!
........
My wife and I are in the market for a new car (the Saabaru is getting traded in) and I've had a yen for the FJ Cruiser which reminds me of the old 1960s Land Cruisers which may be the coolest 4wd ever made (IMO). She said I could get what I wanted this year, if we bought her a car next year that she wanted...I figured that's a fair deal.
Dealer inventory of these are pretty tight and since I'm a member of Costco, the only local participating dealer has a Trail Teams with the BF Goodrich All Terrain tires etc. The dealership is looking to make a deal before the end of the month. The chances of me going off-road with any regularity aren't much but there are a few times a year when it would probably happen (hunting season, camping etc.) and I would probably go off-road a lot more often if I could.
Has anyone owned one and regretted it? Are the All-Terrain tires going to piss me off on normal pavement? Should I wait until I get some better options in stock?
Gutshot John
09-29-11, 20:17
Actually it's not a Subaru, it's a Saab 92-X, basically built on a Subaru frame/transmission. It was ok, just too small, too loud on the road and the worst gas mileage I've ever seen in a 4 cyl.
Any input on whether I should get an automatic transmission in a 4x4? or a stick? I like sticks, my wife and I both drive them, but in Pittsburgh they kind of suck. That said, I want what will get the best performance from a 4x4.
If you're worried about price on the T4R I assume you're wanting the options of the TE? If so you can probably just go with the SR5 and do a few upgrades to the suspension/tires/stereo and come in way under the price they are talking. I own a 4th gen SE with XREAS and love the ride in the city the XREAS system provides and with some TA's the off road ride is really pretty good. If you can hold off a month or so I'm sure you can get a solid deal on a 5th gen T4R and even get below invoice at a decent sized dealer b/c they in the end aren't even paying close to invoice no matter what they say. Also make sure you shop the last few days of the month. You'll have better luck with the finance guy and sales guy wanting to make a quick $500 bucks or so and sell another vehicle for their monthly numbers. Good luck!
Out of curiosity, does your Grand Cherokee have tow points? My friend did not have a single one on his, but it was a late 90s, wondering if they fixed that.
On the 2011 Grand Cherokees you have to have an Off-road package to get tow hooks on the front or back.
Mine has two front tow hooks and the hitch on back.
Gutshot John
09-30-11, 09:39
No thoughts on automatic transmissions vs. manual?
DeltaSierra
09-30-11, 19:15
No thoughts on automatic transmissions vs. manual?
I have a Toyota 4Runner with a 3.4 litre V6 and five speed manual transmission.
I absolutely love this vehicle and wouldn't even dream of getting an automatic.
I enjoy driving a manual transmission, and whenever I have to drive an automatic, I remember why I never want to buy one...
Remember, your gas mileage will be slightly better (one or two miles per gallon) with a manual transmission if you drive reasonably (no jackrabbit starts, etc.)
No thoughts on automatic transmissions vs. manual?
prefer auto these days ? 20 years ago I would say manuals to me autos have come a long way just look at sports cars and race cars now with forms of autos
lots of the guys in AZ I know who off road like autos to
for the FJ guys I would say %90 like the autos for crawling and off roading them and we have some hard core guys in the area with them :)
even many of the crawler guys are building autos now
its a personal preference
eternal24k
09-30-11, 22:51
I have a Toyota 4Runner with a 3.4 litre V6 and five speed manual transmission.
I absolutely love this vehicle and wouldn't even dream of getting an automatic.
I enjoy driving a manual transmission, and whenever I have to drive an automatic, I remember why I never want to buy one...
Remember, your gas mileage will be slightly better (one or two miles per gallon) with a manual transmission if you drive reasonably (no jackrabbit starts, etc.)
Too bad they stopped making them stick :(
Gutshot John
10-01-11, 21:50
Settled on a fully loaded Jeep Sahara ordered from the factory today. It wasn't the best deal ever but I'm somewhat geeked.
Settled on a fully loaded Jeep Sahara ordered from the factory today. It wasn't the best deal ever but I'm somewhat geeked.
Nice. Did you get the 4 door or 2 door? I am going to drive a 2012 on Thursday. Just drove a 2007 Unlimited last night. That engine is just terrible. Thought I might save some money by buying used but no chance after that.
congrats on the new ride :) post some pics when ya get it
most of all take it off road a bit and enjoy :)
variablebinary
10-02-11, 01:44
My wife and I are considering the FJ as well.
We are torn between the FJ, and Xterra.
I would consider a Jeep too, I just havent gotten around to actually driving one yet.
Settled on a fully loaded Jeep Sahara ordered from the factory today. It wasn't the best deal ever but I'm somewhat geeked.
you're getting the 2012 right?
Gutshot John
10-02-11, 08:30
Yep 2012 4 door, dark forest green with saddle leather interior.
Initially I was a bit concerned about engine/road/wind noise but when we test-drove the soft-top I was impressed. It was smooth and quiet. Engine/road noise are far less than my current car, wind noise was there with the soft-top so we ordered the hard-top which we would have done anyways. That you can remove roof panels is pretty sweet.
I recommend test driving the Wrangler before making a decision, just to see. It's far more refined and a more comfortable ride than the FJ. They changed the engine apparently in the 2011 models from an inline 6 (which made lots of noise and apparently had reliability issues) to a 3.8 V-6. This year they switched to a 3.6 V-6 which apparently boosted HP, torque and fuel economy over the 3.8. The FJ had noticeably more engine noise.
My mechanic also gave the new Wranglers a huge thumbs up, though not the rest of the Jeep line. He also liked the Toyotas/Hondas but he waved me off the Xterra and Fords.
The FJ still looks awesome but it would have been less practical for my needs. Factor in the media system and navi, built-in mifi, sweat leather seats and the same off-road capability as the FJ and I was pretty stoked. :dance3:
Other than that deciding factors against the FJ were that I had to get automatic transmission if I wanted to be able to switch from 4 wheel to 2 wheel drive. Manual transmission on the FJ is full-time 4wd. I tend to prefer manual transmission and my wife agrees. Mostly it just felt like riding in a bathtub so it looked cool from the outside but from the inside it just wasn't the same "wow" factor. If however I lived out West or a place where I was going 4 wheeling every day, I wouldn't hesitate to get the FJ.
If the engine, and body-color hard top option, had been available for the Wrangler two years ago when I bought my Tacoma, I would have chosen the Wrangler. The current engine, IMO, is too anemic for the Unlimited to get out of it's own way on the highway, and for me with a daily commuter that's a deal breaker. The new engine should resolve that.
I'm currently shopping for a camper shell for the Taco, and can't help but wonder if I wouldn't be better served, or happier, simply putting that $2k along with whatever equity I have into getting one of the new Wranglers with a hard top. Might have to make a trip to a dealership.
I'd recommend a 4dr wrangler rubicon. I've had two other jeeps, 98 v6 Cherokee, and 2005 grand charokee 4.7l v8). Both which went 100,000 plus miles before I sold them without any big maintenance - just the scheduled stuff.
I looked at xterras, FJs, Hummer H3s, and Wranglers in my last search and landed on the Wrangler for a few reasons.
-The FJs blind spots are real bad. And that's coming from someone who owned/raced an Audi TT for years. Those things have terrible blind spots, so much so that I stopped tracking it because I was never comfortable when quickly checking gaps into/out of corners. Sure if you're a normal person you might be able to deal with it but for me, it was terrible and a deal breaker. The interior was a bit funky
for me and the wife mandated 4 doors. So that crossed that off the list. Said TT, just because I still like to whore it out :)
http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t294/myersma2/IMG_1372.jpg
http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t294/myersma2/IMG_1446.jpg
I liked the xterra but the interior was a bit cheap for me. And I'm used to old Jeep interiors, so I'm pretty tolerable on that front. And the hummer h3 was ok, but IMO modern Hummers don't justify the name. And I was again reminded of the TT because of the H3s small windows.
So I landed on a Wrangler. I got a 2011 because I got an amazing deal on it. Didn't get a 2012 because engine/tranny changes make me nervous if I own a model year 1. 1-2 mpg as a result of new tranny is kinda appealing but the 60-70 extra hp is worthless. Looks good on paper, but after drivetrain loss I'd bet maybe 20hp of that makes it to the road and is perceptible on the 'butt dyno'. And I like the 3.6L, you can practically stand between the fan and front of the block, and mechanics are familiar with it.
I broke my own rule and got a new 2011, looked at an 08 but didn't like the old interior and at 60k miles it was only 3,500 less than a brand new one. Case in point that Wranglers are #2 to hold their value, right behind the Honda CRV. Things I love about it:
- the redesigned interior in the 2011s are great, functional and good looking.
- great sound system (7 speakers with sub) blue tooth, aux plug in, USB plug in, 2 cigarette plug ins, and even a 2 prong conventional plug.
- free satellite for a year
- lockable center console
- it's the Glock of SUVs, aftermarket crap is available from everybody.
- the rubicons are the shit offroad, hands down. Unlocking sway and locking diffs make an enormous distance when wheeling
- select 2wd, 4wd hi and low. And it's a mechanical lever, not a electronic button
- epic turning radius
- solid front and rear Dana diffs/axels. Sure they don't drive as smooth as independent suspension but it's a suv, not a towncar. And the Dana rear end in my dads '57 chevy is the only part he hasn't broken since installing it. The things converting tons of power, so quality diffs IMO.
- the freedom top is sweet. You can take small sections of roof off over the front seats and leave the rear/cargo cover on. Or take it all off
- it's bigger than my 05 Cherokee, both inside and out, and the head room is unbeatable. Rear legroom is good, and so is cargo room. You'll be hard pressed to find something you can't fit in the back with the top off and seats down.
- mileage is great, 18 city 21 highway are my #s. I've gotten 24.3 before going 63.
- it's fun in the summer and winter, show me another suv that's a year round fit like that
- the bfgs it comes with are great tires, quiet but capable. They will do until the time comes for a 2-3" lift :)
- the sahara model wasn't worth it to
me as I didn't care about body colored roof/fenders but you can get those options on 2012 rubicons
- the jeep wave
- everyone loves it
http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t294/myersma2/0ef3aa89.jpg
http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t294/myersma2/63780370.jpg
http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t294/myersma2/7fba9474.jpg
If I could change one thing it'd be the towing limit. It's a fat bitch and can only handle 9000 or so lbs total. I think that's around 4,xxx of boat/trailer. So that'll narrow the boat search when the time comes but you shouldn't be looking at wranglers if you want to tow a ton.
Bottom line, capable, holds it's value, simple to fix, good on gas, and a great wheeling community to be a part of.
The new FJ is one of the least capable off road vehicles you could buy off the lot. A Land Rover Discovery with automatic transmission is more capable.
Most people only use their SUV for 'mall wheeling.' They like to profile in their 'bad ass' truck that will never leave the road. Largely, this is because most such buyers lack the training or experience to fully realize the capability of the vehicle, AND, most people don't need this capability.
For your average commuter (if the shoe fits) what they really need a vehicle that can handle heavy snow on paved roads. I think Subaru Forester will answer the call for most people. Really, any vehicle with high ground clearance will handle snow better than your average sedan. The biggest problem in snow is loss of traction and snow damming under the vehicle. An old heavy 2WD drive pickup will do better than most any modern AWD sedan, IF, you know how to drive it.
If you really want to get a capable off road vehicle, the current Jeep Wrangler series is the best you can get just driving it off the lot. If only they made them in diesel in the US.
One other thought on vehicle selection, most of the roads in the US suck. Here in the areas in and around DC, the roads simply destroy cars. If you have to routinely drive in these conditions you may want to consider a vehicle that is designed to handle poor road conditions.
. If only they made them in diesel in the US.
The CRD here would be amazing. Someday maybe..
]The new FJ is one of the least capable off road vehicles you could buy off the lot. [/B]A Land Rover Discovery with automatic transmission is more capable.
hehehehe OK where did you pull that one out of ?
the two best off road rigs stock are the rubicon and the FJ both have lockers and such stock these days
does the diso have locks now stock (and not a center dif lock) ? or do you still have to stick in a ARB or other aftermarket :)
head over to www.ih8mud.com and see if people think the FJ sucks off road :)
discos are good vehicles but they are not the same IMHO :)
the rubicon you can take farther than the FJ but a good driver behind both and the FJ can pretty much go any place the Rubicon can but I would with after market give a small lead to the Rubicon but both will leave the disco behind on the rocks stock
Gutshot John
10-02-11, 19:23
One question I had is asked out of relative ignorance.
Whether or not to get the LSD for the jeep? There wasn't an option for a true locker on the Sahara only an LSD. I know it comes standard on teh Rubicon, but again I wanted a road vehicle with off-road capability (not serious rock-crawling or anything) rather than a serious off-roader.
I figured I could have a true locker installed later if I wanted to go that route.
That said does it make sense to have them put an LSD on as well?
not unless you plan on really off roading it
and that means go more places that you might need sliders etc...
traction wise on trails and such you will be fine most likely
I would hit up some jeep forums though and see what they say I like jeeps think they are cool :) but dont have one so for what to get besides ARB of course which is a air locker not sure what the best thing to get IF you decided you need one ;)
other thing a strong bumper front and rear and a winch would be where I would put money if you go that route first :) not sure what the skids are like stock ? but skids and a set of sliders are nice to protect things if you really get into off roading
again this can kinda be like guns :) everyone thinks something dif but the bottom line its usually the operator so if you got into some jeep clubs some do group runs I know the AZFJ group here in Arizona does a run every week and helps new people out etc..
that way you dont go buy something you dont need so take it out with a group get to know it and learn to work what you have then go form there :)
other thing a strong bumper front and rear and a winch would be where I would put money if you go that route first :) not sure what the skids are like stock ? but skids and a set of sliders are nice to protect things if you really get into off roading
skids are pretty much everywhere stock, the only thing I'd add is rock rails.
you can add lockers down the road but you'll end up spending more, voiding warranties, and have lots of headaches that way IMO.
Gutshot John
10-03-11, 08:22
Sadly there is no way to add a true locker upfront, only an LSD.
MOPAR apparently sells these and if I have the dealership adds stuff later it shouldn't be too big of a deal.
I would take the winch and bumper over lockers as the next add on cause a winch can get you out of things if you need to
lockers are nice for sure but a winch IMHO is a MUST have for off road stuff
one of the guys from our club got a cool box for the rear of his Jeep that was pretty cool steel lock box that you could take the lid off still use the space etc. but when the top was down a solid box
made by that tough box company or tuffbox something like that :)
Honu, Tuffy Security Products?
http://www.tuffyproducts.com/
Honu, Tuffy Security Products?
http://www.tuffyproducts.com/
yeah thats it :)
this was the one he had thought it was pretty slick the way it worked and could get out of the way when needed
http://www.tuffyproducts.com/p-294-275-tuffy-2011-jk-security-deck-enclosure.aspx
totally mind blanked on the name :) been working till 6 am last few nights trying to get caught up :)
Honu, Tuffy Security Products?
http://www.tuffyproducts.com/
Great stuff!
Gutshot John
10-03-11, 20:11
Honu, Tuffy Security Products?
http://www.tuffyproducts.com/
Ok...I'm in.
It makes me wonder if there is the same level of customization available on other vehicles and if I stumbled across the jeep in kind of a happy accident.
Jeep has a lot of stuff for sure more than any other
but others also have lots of options and many of them are good the thing you have to look out for are the bad jeep ones !!!! that is the downside with SO MANY choices quite a few crap parts
large companies like ARB or smaller companies that make killer stuff on a small scale
and there are some great fabricators that hang out on the forums and make some insane good stuff that blows away many of the options
just get into the groups and forums and see what really works :)
head over to that expo link I sent :) you will see lots of people with great setups many custom ones
Gutshot John
10-04-11, 09:00
So I'm wondering if I hit a bit of a snag and I need some salesmen advice.
I got a nice price on the jeep and fair value on my trade (though I might have been able to sell it for more) but the dealership said the offer was only good for a month but he said it shouldn't be a problem since the last few orders from the factory have taken about 3 weeks, and even if it went longer ge said their motivation is to sell me the car I want at the price we agreed. So we paid the $500 they were asking to place the order.
The color we chose (black forest green) is apparently a new color and in looking around for a swatch I could see online I came across where this color isn't even available to go into production for about 2 weeks. Even if mine is the first jeep to be produced it seems like it will be cutting that window tight and in many cases the internets, don't think many of them will be available until Nov/Dec.
The reasoning behind the month window is if the market for my Saab drops out it provides them with wiggle room. Knowing car salesmen this gives my the heebie jeebies and and the car salesman to offer significantly less when the jeep does arrive.
Should I be concerned and how would you approach this if it does take longer and they try to bone me? Should I forgo the jeep I really want and have them find a jeep that's available now?
eternal24k
10-04-11, 09:13
Having just gone through with this and the timeline thing (I was shooting for a 0% APR that was going to end), it can be a total gamble waiting for a car that has A) not been made yet or B) on its way to the US and/or not cleared customs.
I personally would give your specs with priorities (configuration would be my priority, but color could be yours) and have them find it in their network. My gf got hung up on a color for hers and it was impossible, there are dealer backorders, priorities, and other allocation methods at work.
In the end, you will never get a better deal than on a car the dealer already has in their lot.
I personally wouldn't stress over it, provided you didn't sign anything that commits you to the special order car regardless of your trade-in value.
I don't go nuts with dickering with car dealerships. I have better things to do with my time. I know that for some guys it's half the fun to shave $0.50 off their monthly payment but if I have to dicker for two hours or more that's just not worth the effort.
4x4twenty6
10-04-11, 10:46
I saw a guy by my house with a blacked out FJ with about 4" lift and 35" mud terrains on gunmetal color rims and aftermarket bumpers.
That sucker looked BITCHIN'!
If Ford would come out with another fullsize Bronco i think they would have tremendous success.
The Raptor has really carved its own little niche in the offroad market and proved to be pretty successful despite the shitty economy.
Ford could probably take a significant portion of the market if they came out with an affordable fullsize bronco. It has been 15 years since the last bronco rolled off the assembly line. Time for a comeback! F150's already have an electronic selectable rear locker, great new engines(especially the ecoboost) and transmissions and the Raptor has a Torsen front differential for 2012!
I have wanted to pull a torsen from a ranger rear end to put in the front diff of my truck for a while now but lack the funds.
I saw a guy by my house with a blacked out FJ with about 4" lift and 35" mud terrains on gunmetal color rims and aftermarket bumpers.
That sucker looked BITCHIN'!
The Raptor has really carved its own little niche in the offroad market and proved to be pretty successful despite the shitty economy.
Neighbor has a wrangler like that. I've got tint done and my rims are gunmetal. Can't wait til the ATF stops sucking my $ up so I can get a lift/tires
Those Raptors are SICK! I've been meaning to get to a stealership and drive one.
hehehehe OK where did you pull that one out of ?
From an off road driving course my unit sent me to.
We had a selection of commercially available vehicles of the type one might rent CONUS and OCONUS. Among them was the FJ, which was one of the weakest stock vehicles. Perhaps a heavily modified FJ is awesome but as it comes from the factory it is best suited to profiling while fighting thru rush hour traffic on your way to your contract job in Crystal City. At least, that is where I see them used the most. They also seem to be very popular in high end retail areas. On the trail? I have yet to see one personally.
From an off road driving course my unit sent me to.
We had a selection of commercially available vehicles of the type one might rent CONUS and OCONUS. Among them was the FJ, which was one of the weakest stock vehicles. Perhaps a heavily modified FJ is awesome but as it comes from the factory it is best suited to profiling while fighting thru rush hour traffic on your way to your contract job in Crystal City. At least, that is where I see them used the most. They also seem to be very popular in high end retail areas. On the trail? I have yet to see one personally.
well you are not on trails then :)
here in AZ pretty much the biggest state for off roading they are all over
also you had a selection and you say its weakest ? again to bad pretty much everyone else disagrees with you in the off road world ?
very curious what your daily off road rig is ? that you own ?
I see a lot of Land Cruisers as mall queens does not mean they are not any less of a rig I see just as many jeeps never getting dirty ?
again no proof your opinion only
funny about the high end retailers ? really a cheap toyota ? this is where I see discos mostly with people trying to be so cool in them yet you dont see those off road to much
AZ, now that does need to be factored in. I am only telling you what I see. I work and live around the DC area. The biggest threat here on a regular basis will be snow, some mud, possibly high water, and 3rd World road conditions. The AZ driver will usually not face this sort of terrain except for some rocky roads which describes most of our normal 'paved' roads.
The OP lives in PA. Most people do not go off road, but frequently the on road conditions can be just as bad. I am a big fan of large tires and high ground clearance, balanced against the fact that you still have to drive on the public roads.
In truth, most of my 'wheeling' experience has been limited(?) to HMMWVs and some rented NTVs - mostly the Toyota Land Cruiser and Toyota HiLux. My daily driver is a Jeep that I bought because it was cheap and durable. This area will destroy most cars in short order.
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