S&W VTAC M&P 9mm Review

[MilitaryArms]

I'm a fan of the M&P series of pistols, so when the VTAC came along I snatched up the first one my dealer had available. Here's a review of the features of the VTAC:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8KIP-yTFD3Y

Questions and comments are welcome.

[ck1]

Those sights will compliment my rail-mounted pistol bayonet nicely. :)

[decodeddiesel]

Those sights will compliment my rail-mounted pistol bayonet nicely. :)

:confused:

There is a point to those sights, they are not a gimmick. Personally I don't care for them, but some very qualified people do.

I am sure you are joking about the bayonet thing, right?

[kmrtnsn]

They actually work quite well. I'd prefer the front sight was a tad wider but I'm just so used to shooting Trijicons, it's my personal preference.

[ck1]

:confused:

There is a point to those sights, they are not a gimmick. Personally I don't care for them, but some very qualified people do.

I am sure you are joking about the bayonet thing, right?

Yes, I'm kidding. JMHO, but those are pretty much as gimmicky as gimmicky gets.

Different strokes for different folks.

Excellent reviews/YouTube channel though in all seriousness.

[Urabus23]

Nice review:)

I'm still waiting for a local shop to get one in to check out the sights. I wonder if S&W will release a VTAC in .45?

[dirvo85]

This VTAC pistol looks very different on the slide than the one I saw at my local fun shop. The finish of the slide in the video looks like a flat FDE color. When I saw the VTAC in real life it looked shiny and more gold like than in the video. It almost looked like a pimped out pt1911 with a gold plated slide. Has s&w changed the finish on these?

[willowofwisp]

This VTAC pistol looks very different on the slide than the one I saw at my local fun shop. The finish of the slide in the video looks like a flat FDE color. When I saw the VTAC in real life it looked shiny and more gold like than in the video. It almost looked like a pimped out pt1911 with a gold plated slide. Has s&w changed the finish on these?

There is a finish difference, from the first ones released to the new ones, I saw a comparison on another forum, new ones look crappy IMO.

[kmrtnsn]

There is a finish difference, from the first ones released to the new ones, I saw a comparison on another forum, new ones look crappy IMO.

I have a VTAC from the first run. Smarter people than me tell me that the slide on these was PVD coated, a process akin to anodizing (a simplistic comparison). How the second series are coated I do not know.

[kmrtnsn]

10-3, not sure how I posted twice.

[John W]

Thanks for posting, your review was good. Great editing, angles, close ups and clear concise audio. Keep up the good work. :tup:

As far as the slide/finish issue. What was the manufacture date of the pistol?

For what its worth, S&W has changed the finish of their pistols. Earlier models carried a flat finish on the slides. Recent models have a shinier finish which is harder and protects/wears better. You will be able to tell the difference between finish types on the slides with quick inspection.

[mikeith]

There is a finish difference, from the first ones released to the new ones, I saw a comparison on another forum, new ones look crappy IMO.

i agree. i think it would look nice with a black slide and black grips though.

i've been trying to trade my m&p .40 for one but local gun shops low ball me on mine.

[DUNDEM]

Those sights look like they have a different hold depending if it were night or day.

[N2CH_556]

Nice review / video.


Those sights look like they have a different hold depending if it were night or day.
That's what I was wondering about, too.

[polydeuces]

Gimmicky like "it doesn't look cool even though it may work really well?"
And VTAC is known for putting out gimmicky stuff? As much as my initial reaction was "hmmmmm...", considering their reputation i feel very strongly about giving this a whirl - the more I look at it the more I see it and like it - as in "now why didn't i think of this.."

re: Hold - when the situation arises where these are NEEDED, I don't think "hold" will be much contemplated....

[FChen17213]

I have a VTac M&P 9mm that I am sending back to S&W for some issues with light primer strikes, but I will post some observations I have had so far.

I have shot about 600 rounds through the gun. The gun is accurate enough for a service pistol for the most part. As bad a shot as I am, I have been able to get 2-3" groups at 25 yds offhand relatively consistently. These are 10 round groups too, not 5 round groups. There'd often be a flier, but I know that it was definitely operator error rather than the gun.

I like the sights. They do shoot POA/POI...at least with the Fiber Optics in daylight.

The finish......there definitely leaves something to be desired. While mine was a dull FDE color, it felt very chalky and rough. It's very "frictioney" (that's not a word) to say the least. It also wears very fast. A 600 round gun that hasn't even been holstered should not have a bunch of shiny parts where the finish has worn off in a couple of weeks.

Overall though, if S&W can fix my light primer strike problem, I will still have been satisfied with the gun. Nonetheless, I am sticking to my Glocks. As much as I want to love the M&P, there are just the bugs that still exist, whereas the early 3rd Gen Glocks are just about perfect.

[JHC]

I've shot a few mags through a VTAC and the sights work very well. I think the Trijicon HD sets - avail a few years ago might have pre-empted the invention of the VTAC variant - they are THAT bright in sunlight; but be that as I think it may, the VTACs work well.

[Kchen986]

FWIW, I remember looking in to colored meloniting/nitrocarburizing and I distinctly remember that the 'tan' melonite had a lower Rockwell hardness rating.

[Sensei]

On my drive home from Ft. Benning a few days ago, I stopped at one of my local gun shops in my home town. Much to my surprise, they had a M&P9 VTAC in the display case. As usual, they listed a price well over MSRP ($999) but I was able to haggle them down to $720. The SN is in the range of DWU14XX and it was supplied with 2 mags which seemed to drop free without problems. I was sensitive to this issue as another shop in my area had a similar VTAC a few months ago but the supplied mags did not drop free. I only wish that I had paid a little closer attention to the mags in the store - more on that in a minute.

I paid for the gun and ordered the APEX DCAEK and RAM when I got home. I spent a day playing with the trigger which had the usual factory uptake grit with about a 6 lb break near the rear, and zero tactical reset. Today, I took the weapon out to the range along with some other weapons that I had upgraded just prior to leaving for deployment. I typically fire about 100 rounds to function check my M&Ps prior to installing the APEX kits since Smith does not like after market parts if you have to send it back for warrant repairs. Thus, I brought 6 boxes of 124 gain Federal AE, 3 boxes of 115 grain Speer Lawman, and some 147 grain Gold Dots to burn thru my Smith and a Gen4 G17 that I was testing.

While loading the supplied mags, I immediately realized something was wrong as the rounds were very loose and would barely stay in the mag. When I looked closer, I realized that the supplied mags were actually for a .40/.357 and suddenly realized that Smith shipped the wrong caliber mags with the pistol. Luckily, I brought a couple of my wife's M&P9 mags and proceeded with my test fire.

On my first 3 mags of Federal AE, every round flew back in my face striking me just above my eye pro on the right. It was virtually the same spot on my forehead with each round. I then loaded a mag with 115 grain Lawman and got the same result - just a little lower on the eye pro lens. By now, I was starting to feel like Bin Laden with a small red area on my right brow and flinching with every shot due to the fear of getting hot brass under my eye pro. I reluctantly loaded 5 rounds of 147 grain Gold Dot and again got hot bass on my forehead on each shot.

Feeling that I gave a fair chance at break-in, I abandoned further attempts at firing the weapon. I've already submitted the online request for warranty repair. I know that this can probably be fixed with a simple tune of the extractor, but I'm not familiar with that process on a M&P. Not to mention the fact that I will probably need to ship the supplied 40/357 mags back to get the correct 9mm mags.

I'll post more updates when I get the weapon back and get a chance to make it home again from this deployment.

[MikeCLeonard]

I have a VTAC from the first run. Smarter people than me tell me that the slide on these was PVD coated, a process akin to anodizing (a simplistic comparison). How the second series are coated I do not know.

I'm surprised to hear that the finish of these VTAC pistols is not holding up.

Not like anodizing, PVD finishes simply impart a very hard surface layer to the substrate metal. It does not penetrate like anodizing does.

A PVD applicator some of you may have already heard of is IonBond. I can attest to the durability of the black IonBond PVD finish as I've had a number of guns and parts coated through IonBond. The black finish I received back on my guns/parts, stood up to my Gerber pocket knife, a Quarter, and my Strider BT scraping against it...hard. Hell, I even wiped my sweaty hands all over a PVD'd flash hider after going for a jog...then left it out on my porch for 2 months...No rust...but I can't even figure that one out.

Anyhow...Maybe the colored PVD coatings are for some reason not nearly as hard as the black...though I guess PVD is just the application process...not a description of the imparted finish.

I'll add that many times I thought my IonBonded finish had been scratched, only to find out that whatever scraped against it deposited its own material...which easily wiped off. The finish had not be scratched...the scraper had simply lost some material.:)

[kmrtnsn]

I'm surprised to hear that the finish of these VTAC pistols is not holding up.

Not like anodizing, PVD finishes simply impart a very hard surface layer to the substrate metal. It does not penetrate like anodizing does.

A PVD applicator some of you may have already heard of is IonBond. I can attest to the durability of the black IonBond PVD finish as I've had a number of guns and parts coated through IonBond. The black finish I received back on my guns/parts, stood up to my Gerber pocket knife, a Quarter, and my Strider BT scraping against it...hard. Hell, I even wiped my sweaty hands all over a PVD'd flash hider after going for a jog...then left it out on my porch for 2 months...No rust...but I can't even figure that one out.

Anyhow...Maybe the colored PVD coatings are for some reason not nearly as hard as the black...though I guess PVD is just the application process...not a description of the imparted finish.

I'll add that many times I thought my IonBonded finish had been scratched, only to find out that whatever scraped against it deposited its own material...which easily wiped off. The finish had not be scratched...the scraper had simply lost some material.:)

I have had no issues with my VTAC finish. I have also have not had any functional reliability issues of any kind. Mags have dropped free, it feeds hollowpoints just fine, and fires every time I pull the trigger, now at well over 3,500rds.

[az doug]

Sorry for the hi-jack but I just watched the video and misinformation drives me crazy. Not that it matters to the issue at hand, the VTAC M&P, but S&W released the Model 39 to the civilian population in 1955, not the 1960s. It was developed for the U.S. Army service pistol trials that took place in 1954.

Like others have said, the sights on the VTAC M&P aren't for me, but I am sure others like them.

[Smash]

Somewhat off topic as well but you can contact S&W about getting the FDE back straps that are on the VTAC version for your regular m&ps. Just call their customer service line. I have the part # on an email if anyone needs them but they should know what you're asking for.

[St.Michael]

HAHAh that's you? That's pretty funny I watched the video a few weeks ago! I like the video though.

[Freelance]

I had an opportunity to try one of these at a recent training day for a friends company. I shoot a standard M&P9 and was curious to shoot with those new VTAC sights, to see if I liked them. It took a second to get used to them but I found the sights to be great. I was day shooting so much like the Trueglow TFO fiber sights on my M&P9 the daytime fiber optic sights were very bright and visible on the M&P VTAC. I definitely noticed a slightly lighter smoother trigger on the VTAC M&P than mine was stock. Felt similar to my M&P after the addition of the APEX sear/trigger kit I installed, but a bit lighter and smoother. Very attractive pistol IMHO. I would pick up another VTAC model in .40 to compliment my 9 if I have the chance and funds :)

[Sensei]

Got my VTAC back from S&W a couple days ago after getting its ejection problems fixed. Turn around was 8 days including shipping. The technician replaced the barrel and mags (it shipped with the wrong caliber) and even included a couple of extra mags as a nice gesture.

For this range session, I started with 147 grain Federal AE. The first mag had one spent casing hit the top of my head and one other hit my right shoulder. All of the other rounds fired from the box had casings ejecting to my 3 o'clock. However, I noticed that my accuracy from this box was way off with all rounds shooting about 8" high at 15 yards. In addition to shooting high, my groups were way off compared to my experience with 124 grain ammo (I had previously fired only 5 round of 147 grain GD with this pistol which was probably not enough to notice this variance). Given this pattern, I have to wonder if Randy's theory of premature barrel unlocking might be at play with this pistol and heavy loads.

I did fire an additional 100 rounds of 115 grain WWB and 50 rounds of 124 grain Federal AE. All rounds ejected to my 3 o'clock with none striking my forehead. In addition, there were no malfunctions with any ammo. My accuracy with the lighter loads was much better and typical for what I've come to expect from an M&P prior to installing APEX parts.

Overall, I like the pistol. I've not had any finish problems despite about 500 presentations from a Secrete City Kydex holster. I've also had no problems with the sight picture and find similar pick-up with the "VTAC stack" when compared to using my other M&Ps with iDot Pros. I don't have my timer on this deployment to quantify any difference, but my practice dry fire draws and live fire at the range feel fast.

[Sensei]

Me too. These are actually my second favorite sights. The AmeriGlo IDOT Pro is still my favorite sights - especially during daylight due to the bright orange front sight. Having said that, the VTAC sights are a step above all of the other night sights that I've used mainly due to the fiber optics that really stand out during the day compared to more traditional brands.

[kwelz]

Besides those abominations of sights what does this offer to justify a 150-200 increase?

[1oldgrunt]

anodizing is done to aluminum not steel....anodizing ONLY surface hardens it odes NOT penetrate the metal.

[Odglock]

Besides those abominations of sights what does this offer to justify a 150-200 increase?

The gold package, goofy sights and it says VTAC.

[Hokus Grey]

I shoot a stock M&P9 with about 15,000rds through it in a little over 2 years. It's been about as close to problem free as you can get. Figured I needed another one, as I love the platform and it looks like I'll have one of these VTAC 9's for the end of December. I'm planning on running this gun hard over the next year in courses, so hopefully it's as reliable and durable as my stock M&P9.

Thanks for the video review!

[loupav]

I really enjoyed this review. Thanks for posting.

[chavez_e_chavez]

a great review indeed

[BrianS]

Cool review, but I didn't understand why you said you might want to rethink making it your daily carry because of holster wear on the finish. Just a nitpick I guess but we ought to be about function and not form if self defense is the purpose of carrying and not fashion, which I think is the case for most of us (I hope).

[MilitaryArms]

Cool review, but I didn't understand why you said you might want to rethink making it your daily carry because of holster wear on the finish. Just a nitpick I guess but we ought to be about function and not form if self defense is the purpose of carrying and not fashion, which I think is the case for most of us (I hope).
If I lived in Afghanistan, I wouldn't care. If it were the only finish available on the M&P, I wouldn't care. Since neither are true and I have a choice, I prefer to have a firearm that resists wear for my daily carry. I know it's not the hardcore thing to say, but it's the truth and I suspect most folks, if they admit it or not, prefer their weapons to stay nicer longer and do care about undue wear. At least in the civilian world.

I carry a G19 with the EXO finish and it looks like the day I bought it in terms of wear. I shoot the be-jebus out of it and it still looks great. I'll never have to worry about refinishing the pistol as long as I own it regardless of how hard I am on it. I like that.

Chances are if I go with a M&P for daily carry, I will send it off to FailZero for the same finish my EXO Glock has because I've been so impressed with the durability.

If you like salty gear, outstanding.