PDA

View Full Version : Varmint AR info



MegademiC
11-10-11, 00:53
Of all my friends, Im the gun guy. Hence, a buddy of mine is building his first ar up for a groundhog/varmint/coyote gun and wants me to basically build it for him.

Everything I research is for combat/defensive stuff and Ive never hunted varmints so Im asking here.

This guy wants a very accurate ar, sub MOA. Everything in me is screaming BCM ss410 18" with 13"vtac. However, I see many people on the internet love thier rock rivers. I hate RR since I feel they are way overpriced for what they offer as far as carbines/combat guns. Are their vermint guns good? My friend has the lower, Im building the rest up for him. So far this is what my plan is:
some upper with match SS 18-20" barrel
Geissele SSA(dpms lower parts kit since the trigger is getting replaced)
magpul prs or ace skeleton or A2(ill talk to him about what he wants)
scope choice of : Nikon m223(2-8), Leoupold Mk AR(3-9), Nikon coyote special, or vortex pst, all with pepr or ssalt mount.

So for a non combat varmint rig, hows it sound so far? I really want this guy to get the most for his money. He plans on hunting (he says) out to 300 yds but id say the gun should be good out to 500 since he might hunt other places with more room.

Any suggestions of some good SS uppers to look at? Im not gonna have him get a noveske since I think they are overkill for his needs. How is the (ugh) dpms mk 12 for this role? I would get the stag Model 6 but 24" barrel is rediculous.

Sorry for the long winded and possibly stupid post, Im out of my element here. Never thought Id be looking at some of these brands.

Bigun
11-20-11, 04:08
Of all my friends, Im the gun guy. Hence, a buddy of mine is building his first ar up for a groundhog/varmint/coyote gun and wants me to basically build it for him.

Everything I research is for combat/defensive stuff and Ive never hunted varmints so Im asking here.

This guy wants a very accurate ar, sub MOA. Everything in me is screaming BCM ss410 18" with 13"vtac. However, I see many people on the internet love thier rock rivers. I hate RR since I feel they are way overpriced for what they offer as far as carbines/combat guns. Are their vermint guns good? My friend has the lower, Im building the rest up for him. So far this is what my plan is:
some upper with match SS 18-20" barrel
Geissele SSA(dpms lower parts kit since the trigger is getting replaced)
magpul prs or ace skeleton or A2(ill talk to him about what he wants)
scope choice of : Nikon m223(2-8), Leoupold Mk AR(3-9), Nikon coyote special, or vortex pst, all with pepr or ssalt mount.

So for a non combat varmint rig, hows it sound so far? I really want this guy to get the most for his money. He plans on hunting (he says) out to 300 yds but id say the gun should be good out to 500 since he might hunt other places with more room.

Any suggestions of some good SS uppers to look at? Im not gonna have him get a noveske since I think they are overkill for his needs. How is the (ugh) dpms mk 12 for this role? I would get the stag Model 6 but 24" barrel is rediculous.

Sorry for the long winded and possibly stupid post, Im out of my element here. Never thought Id be looking at some of these brands.
Since it is a "Varmint Rifle" a 1 in 9" or 1 in 12" twist barrel would be my first choice the 45grain Sierra Blitz or nosler ballistic tip give spectacular results on the pesky rodents and rarely penetrate both sides of a coyote lessening pelt damage. I also would look at a light varmint weight barrel in at least a 20" barrel for maximum velocity. I had a Armalite M 15 heavy barrel that was a spectacular shooter and would also look at the Bushmaster predator upper with the fluted barrel for ease of carry. Both uppers would be more than up to the job at hand even if not considered tier 1 for 2 legged critters.

PrarieDog
11-20-11, 22:38
Let me start with what I know and what I am moving towards. ICurrently have an RRA 1/8 SS bull barrel. Very Accurate (less than 1/2 MOA w/hand loads and if I do my part) and has not given me any issues in the 7K + rnds I have put through it. I use Hornady 55grn v max bullets. My old man uses a stag left hand 24" SS barrel. It is even more accurate than my RRA.

I only shoot the rifle a few times a year and get into some high round towns where the barrel is smoking hot and I just pull a bore snake through it about every 300-500 rnds. We do not shoot off of benches but rather walk through the dog towns and shoot off of extra tall Harris bi-pods. Most shots are out to 300 but we do stretch it out to 500+ depending on wind.

With all of this said, it depends on what your buddy is going after. If it is coyotes and such then you just need a good barrel rather than a heavier barreled unit. If he is going to shoot prairie dogs then I would look to a heavier barrel.

As for twist 1/8 works good w/55grn rnds. You could go 1/9 or 1/12 if all you were going to shoot was light weight rnds.

For me I am getting tired of carrying such a heavy rifle that is unbalanced. (Does not ride on my shoulder well while carrying it on a sling). We tend to walk 5-10 miles at a outing with all of our gear with us. The rifle is the part that I could lose the weight off of the easiest.

So getting to my point, I am looking to build a 18 - 20 rifle with a heavily fluted barrel or a JP barrel with the cooling fins for heat management. If I go with a fluted barrel I am going to use a troy extruded light weight hand guard. I think you would be fine with a 18" barrel. There is really no need for a brake as you could still see your shots through the scope.

The set ups from BCM look like a good way to go also in an 18" SS barrel. One other place to check is white oak. The owner is very knowledgable and can build what you need. Good luck.

Lastly, If he is going for smaller targets I would get a scope that at least goes to 12 - 14 power. If he is chasing coyotes then 3-9 is good. Lastly if he plans on shooting a lot then dump some money into a real good scope. Looking for hours or days through a marginal scope can cause head aches and will result in misses or not picking up the target all together.

MegademiC
11-21-11, 13:16
thanks guys. Hes not gonna be shooting prarie dogs at all that I know of... Just yotes. I asked in the ar tech forum and got my answers. He has the scope, leupold, no clue what model but its a 3-9. I settled on the BCM 18" ss410 with the vtac extreme 13" tube. I have an extra ace stock hes gonna use till he decides what he wants for a stock(may just keep it) and a spikes LPK with a geissele SSA-E. I figured 1/8 will let him use 40-45 all the way to 77grain projectiles. Ill make a post about it once its build and I shoot it(gotta make sure it works for him).;)

I have no clue what kind of shot he is, so Ill shoot it to see how it throws em.

PrarieDog
11-21-11, 19:12
Sounds like you have a pretty nice set up. Definitely don't need the weight if you are chasing coyotes. Post it up when done, i'd like to see it.

MegademiC
11-21-11, 22:19
Thanks, I'll be sure to, but it will probably be after Christmas. Im also gonna help a friend build a middy for his GF (psa hf kit). Im a poor college student so im living vicariously through others right now, haha. I CANNOT wait to graduate. :D

:(

NorthDakota
12-07-11, 11:00
Let me start with what I know and what I am moving towards. ICurrently have an RRA 1/8 SS bull barrel. Very Accurate (less than 1/2 MOA w/hand loads and if I do my part) and has not given me any issues in the 7K + rnds I have put through it. I use Hornady 55grn v max bullets. My old man uses a stag left hand 24" SS barrel. It is even more accurate than my RRA.

I only shoot the rifle a few times a year and get into some high round towns where the barrel is smoking hot and I just pull a bore snake through it about every 300-500 rnds. We do not shoot off of benches but rather walk through the dog towns and shoot off of extra tall Harris bi-pods. Most shots are out to 300 but we do stretch it out to 500+ depending on wind.

With all of this said, it depends on what your buddy is going after. If it is coyotes and such then you just need a good barrel rather than a heavier barreled unit. If he is going to shoot prairie dogs then I would look to a heavier barrel.

As for twist 1/8 works good w/55grn rnds. You could go 1/9 or 1/12 if all you were going to shoot was light weight rnds.

For me I am getting tired of carrying such a heavy rifle that is unbalanced. (Does not ride on my shoulder well while carrying it on a sling). We tend to walk 5-10 miles at a outing with all of our gear with us. The rifle is the part that I could lose the weight off of the easiest.

So getting to my point, I am looking to build a 18 - 20 rifle with a heavily fluted barrel or a JP barrel with the cooling fins for heat management. If I go with a fluted barrel I am going to use a troy extruded light weight hand guard. I think you would be fine with a 18" barrel. There is really no need for a brake as you could still see your shots through the scope.

The set ups from BCM look like a good way to go also in an 18" SS barrel. One other place to check is white oak. The owner is very knowledgable and can build what you need. Good luck.

Lastly, If he is going for smaller targets I would get a scope that at least goes to 12 - 14 power. If he is chasing coyotes then 3-9 is good. Lastly if he plans on shooting a lot then dump some money into a real good scope. Looking for hours or days through a marginal scope can cause head aches and will result in misses or not picking up the target all together.

I'll echo the above. I had a 24 inch 1:12 Heavy Barreled WOA upper on an LMT lower with Leupold 6x18 VXII in a Larue Mount. The stock was a PRS and the entire package was heavy, esp with Harris Bipod.

This past year, I used a RRA elite operator (that I have now sold) 1:9 16 inch barrel with MI handguard and the 6x18 VX II to take Pdogs at 320 and 399 with 1st shot hits using either 52 gr Federal HP or basic Wolf 55 gr FMJ steel cased.

I learned that you don't need a HB monster. The 16 inchers will do the job fine.

I have since focused on setting up my LMT CQB and LMT/Colt 6940 upper for the PDOG and coyote roles. The LMT CQB Monothic setup has an ACOG for coyotes and the LMT lower/Colt 6940 upper will have a Leupold MK4 6.5-20.

Glass is more important than barrel. Once you get dialed in, you should be good to go...and if you do a lot of volume in the dog towns, the CL barrels are nice. Plus, it's a lot nicer to carry a 16 inch setup as I do what you guys do...a lot of walking and no benches.