M&P 45 or Lightweight Operator?????

[Jason Weekley]

Wanting to get a new .45 and I can't decide which of these two I want. Whats you're imput? I don't know why but I'm leary of the aluminum frame on the lightweight operator If it wasn't for the green frame I would go with the MC Operator. And for the M&P 45 safariland dosen't make a 6280 or a 6004 for the M&P 45 with a surefire X200. Or that I can find.

[Jim D]

Wanting to get a new .45 and I can't decide which of these two I want. Whats you're imput? I don't know why but I'm leary of the aluminum frame on the lightweight operator If it wasn't for the green frame I would go with the MC Operator. And for the M&P 45 safariland dosen't make a 6280 or a 6004 for the M&P 45 with a surefire X200. Or that I can find.
What other guns do you have? What are you intending to use this gun for? What is it about each gun that you like?

[Jason Weekley]

What other guns do you have? What are you intending to use this gun for? What is it about each gun that you like?

Glocks 34,35 and 19. For possible duty use. Ive always like the 1911 and I like the being able to change the grip size on the M&P

[Jim D]

Glocks 34,35 and 19. For possible duty use. Ive always like the 1911 and I like the being able to change the grip size on the M&P

You can change the MSH and grips on the 1911's though, too.

If the 1911 feels good...then there you go. If it doesn't feel right, then the M&P might be a good choice.

You will never be able to have the trigger that the 1911 has, on an M&P.

The SA guns are really good. I shot a TRP today right along w/ a NH Talon... I shot that TRP much better than the NH, and preferred the feel of the TRP, too.

Just go w/ your gut. If you like the 1911's, SA is a good company to get them from.

[Hawkeye]

M&P 45 would be my choice. Dont worry about Safariland. I'm sure they'll have the 6004's out for them soon. Waiting on one myself.

[mpardun]

I found the Operator not as reliable out of the box (true for other Springfield's too)...once I get them "tuned up" and better mags that changes. It'll cost more to start and several hundred more to make combat reliable (no questions 100%). I found my Kimber Ultra CDP more reliable out of the box, with a little TLC and $'s spent with a smith, 100%. DO NOT use metal follower mags if you go this route (ie. CMC Power Mags), they will damage the frame. They make great concealed carry guns (light & small), but do not plan to shoot it much - service life is 25 - 50% of a steel 1911. Titanium is also problematic as in reality it is not as slick (more porus I was told) and is more suceptible to damage than is tempered carbon/stainless steel.

Save your money, buy the M&P.45: the trigger is not as nice but Dan Burwell or Bowie can fix that for ~$75 (shorten pull length & weight) & it is 100% reliable (or wait till after shot show and get the M&P.45 Compact). I have the FDE full size version and really like it. HK45 on order and waiting for S&W to formally relase the Compact myself. What can I say, I am a sucker for .45 ACP...

If it's $ and a 1911 you want, skip the Operator and go straight for an Ed Brown (no Al frames tho...but my fav. - have owned 5), Wilson, Yes to Al (1) or Nighthawk, Yes to Al (2) - they are all pricey ($2k+) but literally another caliber of quality, fit-n-finish (punn intended :-)).

[Failure2Stop]

I am not a fan of aluminum framed 1911s. They get pretty beat-up during feeding. I agree with the statement, "Aluminum 1911s are made to be carried a lot and shot a little."

I had a TRP Operator that was very nice. I don't so much regret the sale as much as miss the gun. If you are going for a shooter, I would definately stick to steel or titanium.

[olds442tyguy]

I am not a fan of aluminum framed 1911s. They get pretty beat-up during feeding. I agree with the statement, "Aluminum 1911s are made to be carried a lot and shot a little."

I had a TRP Operator that was very nice. I don't so much regret the sale as much as miss the gun. If you are going for a shooter, I would definately stick to steel or titanium.
They have ramped barrels, so I wouldn't say it's as much of an issue. There are many guns that use aluminum frames that have more abusive actions that hold up just fine. Aside from that, I've never heard of an aluminum frame 1911 breaking.


BUT, I don't know that I'd bet my life on any factory 1911. I personally dislike the M&P's for ergonomic and design issues, but I'd probably trust an M&P more than a box stock 1911 of any mass manufacture. If you have the money to load it up with better parts, I say go for the 1911.


I wouldn't rule out a G21SF though. I've never been in a gunfight and probably never will, but if you told me I had to, I'd probably grab one of them.

[trio]

I actually liked the G21SF better than the M&P45...and I like the M&P 9mm better than a G17...the G19 is a push,....I currently have better sights on my G19...so I carry it...but when I get that rectified, I will probably go back to carrying my M&P.....


i probably would choose a lightweight 1911 over the M&P...but a G21SF over them both...

truthfully, though, if you want a .45 carry gun, you should be looking at the G30...IMHO, the M&P 45 and G21SF were both probably too big for CCW in all circumstances....the G30 solves this problem very nicely....dammit...maybe I need another G30....

[Failure2Stop]

They have ramped barrels, so I wouldn't say it's as much of an issue.

Thanks, I was unaware that they were ramped. Then again, I am not a big fan of ramped 1911s.


There are many guns that use aluminum frames that have more abusive actions that hold up just fine.

I had a Kimber Tac-Pro II. The feed ramp got dented up immediately. It would cause stoppages with most JHP, and even FMJ would dent the feed ramp. After some investivation I discovered that I was not alone in my experience.


Aside from that, I've never heard of an aluminum frame 1911 breaking.


Neither have I, at least not anything attributable to the aluminum frame (just to clarify, I do not necessarily believe that aluminum 1911 frames are "unbreakable").

p.s.- Thanks for the tag line.

[olds442tyguy]

Thanks, I was unaware that they were ramped. Then again, I am not a big fan of ramped 1911s.



I had a Kimber Tac-Pro II. The feed ramp got dented up immediately. It would cause stoppages with most JHP, and even FMJ would dent the feed ramp. After some investivation I discovered that I was not alone in my experience.



Neither have I, at least not anything attributable to the aluminum frame (just to clarify, I do not necessarily believe that aluminum 1911 frames are "unbreakable").

p.s.- Thanks for the tag line.


Just to clarify, only the four inch and three inch Springfield's use a ramped bull barrel (not counting TRP Operator). The full size lightweight is non ramped as far as I know.

I looked into SA and Colt's LW frames here about a year back and didn't find any complaints. I've never owned one though, so I take back my comments earlier after hearing your troubles. I think even now Kimber has moved over to a ramped bull barrel on their 3" and 4" guns. Full sizes likely use non ramped barrels, but I'm just guessing on that.

Originally I didn't trust aluminum framed guns. After seeing what's been done to Sig's and their cast aluminum frames though, I have a bit more confidence in them. Like you, I wouldn't call them unbreakable by any means though.

Nice signature. I actually said that because I had just read an article about how the Chinese recycle used condoms and don't bother to disinfect them in the process. The article said in a lot of cases even the manufacturing process isn't enough to kill off all of the bacteria. :mad: Buy American for your safety.

[rhino]

Aluminum alloy frames are not as delicate as some might believe.

From 1995-1996, I shot over 14,000 rounds through a lightweight Para-Ordnance P14.45 before I retired it to daily carry status from use in matches. The slide to frame fit is looser (the anodizing is very abrasive!), but it's the most reliable gun I've ever owned (including several Glocks, a Sig Sauer P226, and a CZ-75).

[Failure2Stop]

Maybe it was just a certain batch of Kimber frames?

I did a search a couple of years ago when the issue first started annoying me, as the Tac-Pro II was supposed to be my "super-cool, Concealed Carry, Milt Sparks wearin', lightweight , .45 ACP, 1911, bestest coolest pistol ever!" pistol (oh the naivete of youth:rolleyes: ), to discover the same issue with other aluminum-framed 1911s. Anyway, I just did another google search for "1911 feed ramp aluminum kimber". I got about 5 applicable links over two pages. Not overwhelming, certainly, but also not quite isolated. Still, it is less than the number of pages for "glock kb", and I am not anti-glock, though the kB will definately not "polish out" :D .

I must admit that I was dealing with a sample population of 1, which was enough to form a possibly overly critical view of the pistol. Maybe just some of the frames were not properly surface hardened?

I forgot about Sigs, I have not seen any issues with them (ex-wife had one) like I had with my Kimber.

Then again, it's all academic, as I would still choose the M&P.

[Jason Weekley]

Ordered a M&P45 with NS today. It will be in my hands on friday. Will the M&P45 with a surefire x200/x300 fit in a safariland 6280 w/m3 holster? if not can the holster be altered to except this combo?
Thanks for everyones imput.

[matt7184]

Just to clarify, only the four inch and three inch Springfield's use a ramped bull barrel (not counting TRP Operator). The full size lightweight is non ramped as far as I know.

It is ramped (I am looking at mine right now :p ) No problem with it, has feed everything from good magazines.

I've had both the M&P 45 and LW Operator. The 1911 is more comfortable grip wise but shooting wise it didn't matter much for me. Personally I'd get an M&P and save my money and put it towards gear.