View Full Version : Situational Awareness When Shooting
I know this topic has been talked about before, but I want to relay something that occurred this weekend. The AZ crew went out to their normal shooting spot this weekend to let some rounds loose.
I arrived fashionably late as per SOP. I was looking around with the binos when I noticed a something at the base of a hill southwest of our location. It appeared to be a vehicle- nothing unusual.
After everyone parted ways my curiousity got the best of me so I went over to look at the vehicle. I was able to drive to within about 200 feet of it and then I had to walk over by foot.
I knew something was wrong almost from the get go. The vehicle looked as if it had rammed into a rock, sustaining damage and some windows were broken. I looked in the area and didn't see any other signs of life or anything else. I snatched the plate laying on the ground and then contacted to local S.O once I got to cell phone range.
A few hours later a deputy showed up and I guided him as best I could to the area (it was pitch black because of cloud cover and our full moon was on vacation).
It turns out that the vehicle was stolen in the Phoenix area at the end of October and the indicators were that the vehicle was more than likely used for a drug run. It was then dumped either because they damaged it or some other issue. Curious to note that the rear seat had been removed which is usually an indication that the back seat area was loaded up as well.
The area where we shoot is near an area that is a well known smuggling area and the back door to I-8. Poeple often go out in the area to shoot and ride outdoor vehicles.
So the moral of the story is be aware of your surroundings even places that you may have been dozens of times. Even though Janet, Barry and Eric Holder want us to believe that the border is safe, we all know the reality. It is quite possible that we could have run across a group of human or drug smugglers. Make sure to keep your vehicles locked up if you aren't in the immediate vicinity. Know your legal rights and what you can do should you be put into a situation.
Fairly certain that if a group of drug runners saw the motley assortment:D, and heavily armed, AZ crew; they would go somewhere else.
Interesting read. Reminds me of No Country for Oldmen. Up here in the Midwest we don't have issues like that, we have other problems (mainly meth cookers). In my best Obi Wan Kanobi voice, "always mind your surroundings".
eternal24k
12-13-11, 08:16
Good looking out. I have been making a conscious effort to maintain a higher level of situational awareness on a daily routine, but I am lucky enough to be on the safer border.
My friends and I go shoot in roughly the same area IG. You never know who or what you'll find, and it's a good idea to keep an eye out. If it gives you a bad vibe, there's probably a reason.
Best to shoot with a buddy or three. Always maintain guns in ready condition for unwanted guests, two or four-legged. I spend a lot of time in backcountry, and am no longer surprised by the people and things I find there.
Thanks for the reminder. I like the SoCal desert, the beauty, and the freedom, but I try to keep a keen eye out for approaching trouble. I am usually just out there with my wife, and children, and help is far away.
There was a story out of Irvine, Ca just south of where I live. Super low crime stats. An employee at a Ralphs supermarket came in the store with a samurai sword, and hacked three shoppers to death. I thought to myself, you can't let your guard down anywhere, period.
Heavy Metal
12-13-11, 11:22
I have found residue in fire pits in the national forest that I am certain were from a meth lab. Plastic tubing and the like.
You don't have to be near known illicit activity either. Here's a recent attack similar to the Platt/Mattix MO at a gun range here in Oklahoma. Bastard bushwhackers nearly killed a retired vet out for his morning range session! :mad:
http://www.newson6.com/story/16117945/man-shot-multiple-times-guns-swiped-at-wagoner-county-shooting-range
WAGONER, Oklahoma - The Wagoner County Sheriff's Department is investigating a shooting of 73-year-old retired veteran at a gun range near Wagoner. It happened around 7:30 Thursday morning.
The victim, Kenneth Payne, was shot multiple times and taken to a Tulsa hospital. Sheriff Bob Colbert said he is expected to survive his injuries.
The Wagoner County Sheriff says it appears Payne was leaving Toppers Gun range and walking back to his truck when someone shot him multiple times in the head.
Payne was seriously wounded but managed to grab his cell phone and call his family for help. His family called 911 and alerted authorities.
Authorities say four guns were taken as well as a portable tool chest. Colbert said no money was taken during the robbery.
"We got a 73-year-old veteran that was shot, left for dead. He'd served his country and basically, somebody tried to snuff this guy out. It's terrible," Sheriff Colbert said.
Sheriff Colbert says Payne is an avid gun enthusiast and practices at the range every day. Payne retired from the Air Force and lived only a few miles away.
The Sheriff is asking the public for any information regarding vehicles or anything that might have been seen during the timeline. OSBI is also investigating the incident.
Our local shooting forum took up a collection to replace his stolen firearms and equipment. I sold a milsurp rifle and donated half the proceeds. We're almost to our goal and will be presenting the stuff to him soon. It pisses me off that criminals are bold enough to target a shooter at a range! :mad:
The scariest character we've run into out there has been Iraqgunz. :confused:
I bet it can get spooky out there after dark though.
It was so dark that I had a hell of a time leading the deputy to that sight. The moon was being covered by those clouds. And what the hell is up with the rain at the moment?
The scariest character we've run into out there has been Iraqgunz. :confused:
I bet it can get spooky out there after dark though.
It was so dark that I had a hell of a time leading the deputy to that sight. The moon was being covered by those clouds. And what the hell is up with the rain at the moment?
I was patrolling one time out in the desert in North Phoenix and came back to the station with a bullet hole from a rifle in the back of my truck. If you're going to go shooting out there someone should always be on watch with a loaded rifle. Too much bad shit goes on out there. I know I don't have to tell you that, but others here need to learn that lesson. If they'll shoot at police rigs for shits and giggles, they'll shoot at you.
It was so dark that I had a hell of a time leading the deputy to that sight. The moon was being covered by those clouds. And what the hell is up with the rain at the moment?
Did you bring your rifle/gear with you? Did the Deputy object?
..... No way I'd wander around in "no man's land" near the border at night without a rifle and gear. If the Deputy had a problem with that, well, he's welcome to go find it on his own.
No way I'm trusting a cop to protect me from the cartels/smugglers.
I was reading down this thread to see if anyone would post this story from Oklahoma before I did. Glad to see you did so. It's a very sobering reminder of situational awareness and, more importantly, the fact that the presence of a weapon won't always stop attackers.
You don't have to be near known illicit activity either. Here's a recent attack similar to the Platt/Mattix MO at a gun range here in Oklahoma. Bastard bushwhackers nearly killed a retired vet out for his morning range session! :mad:
http://www.newson6.com/story/16117945/man-shot-multiple-times-guns-swiped-at-wagoner-county-shooting-range
Our local shooting forum took up a collection to replace his stolen firearms and equipment. I sold a milsurp rifle and donated half the proceeds. We're almost to our goal and will be presenting the stuff to him soon. It pisses me off that criminals are bold enough to target a shooter at a range! :mad:
I think we all had enough loaded rifles to be considered the reborn Viper Militia. :D
I was patrolling one time out in the desert in North Phoenix and came back to the station with a bullet hole from a rifle in the back of my truck. If you're going to go shooting out there someone should always be on watch with a loaded rifle. Too much bad shit goes on out there. I know I don't have to tell you that, but others here need to learn that lesson. If they'll shoot at police rigs for shits and giggles, they'll shoot at you.
My SBR was in my vehicle with me as we drove out. When he pulled up behind me and I went to meet him I was wearing my Glock. His concern factor jumped up about .000001 percent.
Did you bring your rifle/gear with you? Did the Deputy object?
..... No way I'd wander around in "no man's land" near the border at night without a rifle and gear. If the Deputy had a problem with that, well, he's welcome to go find it on his own.
No way I'm trusting a cop to protect me from the cartels/smugglers.
I think we all had enough loaded rifles to be considered the reborn Viper Militia. :D
Oh, the good old days...
Things like this always remind me of how Platt and Matix got their cars and some guns.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1986_FBI_Miami_shootout
On October 5, 1985, Platt and Matix murdered 25-year-old Emelio Briel while he was target shooting at a rock pit. The pair stole Briel's car and used it to commit several robberies. Briel's remains were found on March 1, 1986 but were not positively identified until May 1986.
On March 12, 1986, Platt and Matix robbed and shot Jose Collazo while Collazo was target shooting at a rock pit. The pair left Collazo for dead and stole his car, a black 1979 Chevrolet Monte Carlo. Collazo survived the shooting and walked three miles to get help.
Things like this always remind me of how Platt and Matix got their cars and some guns.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1986_FBI_Miami_shootout
On October 5, 1985, Platt and Matix murdered 25-year-old Emelio Briel while he was target shooting at a rock pit. The pair stole Briel's car and used it to commit several robberies. Briel's remains were found on March 1, 1986 but were not positively identified until May 1986.
On March 12, 1986, Platt and Matix robbed and shot Jose Collazo while Collazo was target shooting at a rock pit. The pair left Collazo for dead and stole his car, a black 1979 Chevrolet Monte Carlo. Collazo survived the shooting and walked three miles to get help.
My friends and I discussed this very thing when we decided to only go shooting in pairs or, preferably, three or four.
Moose-Knuckle
12-14-11, 21:58
IG, thanks for sharing your story. One can never be too safe.
Anytime I go to the square range I always CCW for this very reason even though some ranges do not "allow" it for "safety". :rolleyes:
Someone also posted here about a man being murdered and having his NFA items stolen at a public range in the past year. I forget the details, but it gave me a lot to think about when I go shooting.
Belmont31R
12-14-11, 23:42
Its one good thing about having a dedicated range master. Usually where I shoot all they do is BS with you and spot targets when its only 1-3 people there but you're never 'alone' per se.
I learned this lesson early on when my neighbor was taking me shooting up in the hills, and he kept a little pistol CCW'ed at all times and we took the rifles loaded with us to check/change targets. You could bury someone out there and they would likely never be found. When we drove out or in he had the pistol tucked under his leg.
I always keep a swivel head even with the RM there and check out people who is coming and going. If someone really gave me the creeps it would only take me a couple minutes to pack up.
arizonaranchman
12-15-11, 08:26
My SBR was in my vehicle with me as we drove out. When he pulled up behind me and I went to meet him I was wearing my Glock. His concern factor jumped up about .000001 percent.
Usually the response I get from LEO's when out and about with a sidearm on my hip in AZ is a curious "what you carrying there?" or something similar. A very pro-gun state and just how the other 49 states should be.
Dirtbags would be scarce if everyone was actually armed. Crooks are cowards by and large, only getting away with the BS they do because they know 99% of the people have no way to stop them.
My friends and I discussed this very thing when we decided to only go shooting in pairs or, preferably, three or four.
That was my big wake up call. I learned about it years after the fact but it changed the way I shoot. There were many times in high school when I had rifle and ammo in the truck and would go shooting by myself afterwards in a pretty secluded area.
My friends and I discussed this very thing when we decided to only go shooting in pairs or, preferably, three or four.
When my friend and I go shooting at a quarry neat a cabin of his, we always have at least 1 AR loaded, and we each have two AR mags on our persons, usually in our belts with our loaded pistols too. Can't ever be too careful.
I live in a college town, and it didn't take me long at the public range, that when a vehicle drove up to check in, my head went up and I took good note as to who/what had just arrived. I have seen some things happen more often with college kids, than with fuds. My first goal is safety, then I will keep an eye out and offer advice in a easy way if needed. Some times I just keep a damn good eye out and packup, drive away. I also keep a pair of binos in my rig for keeping an eye out when ever I'm out doing anything. If I'm sitting somewhere for a while I will glass around, as well as keeping a local eye out. Sometimes you catch good things too, but when you do, no matter what, don't let one thing consume you, so as not to notice other things around yourself.
Life is to good to leave early.
Thanks for the heads up Gunz... I think many of us take our environment for granted when shooting. Oddly I think us being surrounded by firearms put our guards down.
Most of my shooting is done at a private club but it is secluded and bad shit can happen anywhere if we aren't dialed in.
GeorgiaBoy
12-16-11, 07:43
A little off topic, but how does this desert shooting work? I see it on YouTube all the time but I can't understand it.
- Is this public land for shooting/recreation?
- How big is it?
- How you know where others are shooting/riding?
- How do you know if your backstop is safe? I hear bullets ricocheting and whizzing all of the time.
- How do you know that someone isn't just over the hill that you are firing at?
Excuse my ignorance.
Thank you for the reminder and the wake-up call, IG. It got me to thinking about the last time we went shooting in the woods here in Washington. I'll have to discuss with my shooting partners where we will need to step up to avoid becoming victims.
I do miss Arizona
See my responses.
A little off topic, but how does this desert shooting work? I see it on YouTube all the time but I can't understand it.
- Is this public land for shooting/recreation?- I believe it is BLM land if I saw the signs correctly.
- How big is it?- thousands of acres.
- How you know where others are shooting/riding?- Situational Awareness on everyones' part. You just have to be aware.
- How do you know if your backstop is safe? I hear bullets ricocheting and whizzing all of the time. - We use a small hill as the back stop and when we shoot long distance there are mountains as natural backstops.
- How do you know that someone isn't just over the hill that you are firing at? It depends on what direction we are shooting. We can see certain areas as we drive out.
Excuse my ignorance.
How do you know that someone isn't just over the hill that you are firing at?
I've been on the wrong end of ass tards out there and had bullets dropping an whizzing all around me.
When we shoot to 1000, we can see all the way into the big mountain that backs us up.
I've been out shooting in the desert when some idiots on dirtbikes rode past us and straight downrange, ignoring the half-dozen people firing rifles. We shook our heads at the idiocy, called a cease-fire, and waited for the morons to leave. Sometimes you just have to be the better person and deal with it. Most of the time, though, I've found that people tend to go to their own little patch of desert, there's plenty for everyone.
SW-Shooter
12-17-11, 01:33
Right outside of Las Cruces, New Mexico is a community shooting range. Sometimes you're the only one out there for hours on end, the kicker is there is a State prison right across I-10, no more than 3/4 of a mile away from the range.
It wouldn't take much time to get some firepower, a vehicle and be gone with several different directions and the Mexican border less than 30-45 minutes away. It always kind of made me feel a little self conscious when I shot there on my own.
Someone also posted here about a man being murdered and having his NFA items stolen at a public range in the past year. I forget the details, but it gave me a lot to think about when I go shooting.
Always a good reminder.
http://topics.pennlive.com/tag/raymond%20peake/index.html
I've been out shooting in the desert when some idiots on dirtbikes rode past us and straight downrange, ignoring the half-dozen people firing rifles.
I don't stop shooting for those white trash idiots. We don't get those assholes much where we shoot now. But years back I had that happen all the time.
ThirdWatcher
12-18-11, 16:34
Another argument for electronic earmuffs.
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