change powders?

[Travelingchild]

New reloader Currently reloading using HS6. This is what I learned on & have loaded over 20lbs in my short time reloading.

loads are 45acp 200gr. lswc(missouri bullets) at 8.3
reference hogdon online reloading/ & local reloaders

40S&W 180gr. tcfp(missouri bullets) at 7.2
reference lyman 49 edition/ & local reloaders

I'm thinking of switching over to 231/h38 due to cost.
I can get about 500rds per pound more using 231 vs hs6 If i did my math correctly. I've already switched to Wolf LP. for cost savings.

Pet loads using the above bullets? Prefer full power loads.
I have a Dillion Square Deal set up for each caliber.

Any reason I shouldn't switch or just stay with what I know?

I Might reload for 44 special at a later date.

[skyugo]

certainly worth a try. I use HS6 in 9mm. I like it because it's low flash, replicates the recoil of my defensive loads pretty well, and burns clean. No harm in trying out some different powders though. Watch out with some of the really efficient powders as they make it possible to double charge a case, so i'm told. I have never had an issue with double charges personally. 9mm is a pretty small case so any double charges with powders i've worked with would be immediately obvious.

[anthony1]

Its worth a shot. I'd just get a pound first and see if it works for you before stocking up.

[gringop]

231/HP38 is a bit faster than HS6. I use it in mid range 200gr 45acp, +P 38sp, and mid range 9mm. I use it in light 40 loads.

You may want to keep some HS6 around for full power 40 and 44SP. 231 may work but it won't give you as good velocities as the slower burning HS6.

I get good results from the loads below. Work up your own loads for safety.

45acp 200 gr LSWC 5" barrel 6gr 231- 931 fps.
38 SP+P 125 gr FMJ 4" barrel 5.7gr 231- 957 fps.
9mm 125 gr FMJ 4' barrel 4.5gr 231- 1050 fps.
40 155 FMJ 4" barrel 5.7gr 231- 959 fps.


Gringop

[JStor]

The 231 is good stuff, but I haven't used any 200 gr. bullets.

I use 5.5 grs. of Win. 231 for 230 gr. .45 ACP loads in Winchester brass, mostly with CCI 300 primers. Velocity from 5" Colt Government models runs 850-875 ft/sec. I use Speer Gold Dots and hard cast lead roundnose flatpoint bullets over this charge weight.

I have been wanting to try Ramshot Silhouette powder. Have you considered it? It is supposedly very low flash and clean burning.

[Snake Plissken]

I've been using MBC 45 ACP softballs over 5.0 gr W231 for 740 fps out of a P220....I think (I need to check the chrono again). It works very well. I do not attempt to run FMJ velocities with LRN.

Newest kid on the block is Ramshot ZIP and reports say it's better than W231 and the best you're going to do in 45 ACP if you can find it for sale.

[markm]

I'd switch in a heartbeat. I'd never use a powder that inefficient for bulk pistol ammo.

I like WST for 45. Max is 5.0 gr behind a 230 FMJ. HP38/W231 is good too.

[glocktogo]

HS6 is excellent for uber-hot loads. I use it in 9mm and .45ACP exclusively with JHP's and recreate +P and +P+ loads.

For standard velocity loading, I'd go with Clays for .45ACP and 231 for .40. Both are far more economical. You'll have less barrel leading with lead bullets using Clays in your .45 and much softer recoil. I think 231 is a little dirty, but it will work in both calibers if you go with it.

[Travelingchild]

I think 231 is a little dirty, but it will work in both calibers if you go with it.

Thanks for the info, This is one important aspect for me, I really don't want mulitple powders for 2 calibers, if at all possible. I'll work up some loads with 231/hp38.

As far as clean vs dirty powders I never worry about it.

I've discovered the only way to keep my firearms clean is to never shoot them it & that ain't going to happen.:D

[markm]

231 is flashy as hell if that matters to you. I don't mind it.

[chadbag]

It is probably all used up (I have not seen it anywhere for sale for a while) but if you can get the so-called "Russian Unique" aka "SALUT" Russian surplus powder, it is inexpensive, and works great in 9mm and 45ACP, and is low flash to boot.

If you find it, buy a case of it.

[m1a_scoutguy]

I think the Load Range will be close,,but take a look at TiteGroup !! I use it for both my 9mm & 45 ACP,,it goes along ways !! I think my 45 Load with a 230 Hard Cast or Jacketed is under 5 grn,,,4.8 I believe !! For my 9mm I know I loaded close to 1200 rds and did not use a full pound of powder,,using a tad over 3 grains I think for 9mm !! I have used 231 in the past with similar results,,but 231 was hard to find a while back & Titegroup was available,,so I made the switch !!

[glocktogo]

I think the Load Range will be close,,but take a look at TiteGroup !! I use it for both my 9mm & 45 ACP,,it goes along ways !! I think my 45 Load with a 230 Hard Cast or Jacketed is under 5 grn,,,4.8 I believe !! For my 9mm I know I loaded close to 1200 rds and did not use a full pound of powder,,using a tad over 3 grains I think for 9mm !! I have used 231 in the past with similar results,,but 231 was hard to find a while back & Titegroup was available,,so I made the switch !!

TiteGroup is an excellent powder for economy, accuracy and low standard deviation over a wide range of charge weights. The only reason I didn't recommend it first is because the OP stated he uses a lot of cast bullets. TiteGroup is a very hot burning powder, which usually isn't a good choice for cast bullets.

An option I haven't tried yet but that's on my short list is Solo 1000. It's getting a good following in the pistol sports. I can say for sure that under a 147gr 9mm, the flash is virtually nonexistant in low light out of a 5" barrel. It's supposed to be a good .40 & .45 powder as well.

[Travelingchild]

The only reason I didn't recommend it first is because the OP stated he uses a lot of cast bullets. TiteGroup is a very hot burning powder, which usually isn't a good choice for cast bullets.

Yup, that me & that's all I reload can't see spending the extra money (plated etc.) for punching holes in paper.

So while I research more, I infer that Cast bullets generally require a slow to midrange burning powder?

This is starting to make my head spin or it's my cold/flu medication.:cray:

[m1a_scoutguy]

TiteGroup is an excellent powder for economy, accuracy and low standard deviation over a wide range of charge weights. The only reason I didn't recommend it first is because the OP stated he uses a lot of cast bullets. TiteGroup is a very hot burning powder, which usually isn't a good choice for cast bullets.

An option I haven't tried yet but that's on my short list is Solo 1000. It's getting a good following in the pistol sports. I can say for sure that under a 147gr 9mm, the flash is virtually nonexistant in low light out of a 5" barrel. It's supposed to be a good .40 & .45 powder as well.

Yikeeee's,,I shoot cast 99% of the time with titegroup !!!! :eek: :eek: I do detect some leading,,but no real problems cleaning my BBLs !!! Hmmm,this will add even more questions for the OP,,,,,Sorry dude,,LOL !!! :)

[glocktogo]

Yup, that me & that's all I reload can't see spending the extra money (plated etc.) for punching holes in paper.

So while I research more, I infer that Cast bullets generally require a slow to midrange burning powder?

This is starting to make my head spin or it's my cold/flu medication.:cray:

It's not the burn rate, but the temp range that causes more smoke and leading with cast bullets. You want a fast enough powder to obturate the bullet quickly, but without gas cutting and lead vaporization any more than necessary. Clays, 231 (to an extent), WST, Vit 310 and 320, Solo 1000, etc. are all pretty good at this. The Vit powders are choice, but too pricey. Vit 310 and WST are a little on the volatile side and peaky for .40 loads, particularly as you approach max loads. Clays is a little fast burning for .40 and the larger flakes don't always meter well. This isn't as much of an issue in the lower pressure .45ACP as the .40.

Of all these, Solo 1000 is the one I haven't become personally familiar with yet. I have 4# and 8# jugs of Vit, Clays and TiteGroup I'm still working off of. I've gotten completely out of .40 now. All I have are 9mm, .38/.357, .44 & .45ACP. If forced, I'd load Clays exclusively for .45ACP and Vit 320 for .40. I could load 9mm with TiteGroup exclusively, because I've found many 9's that don't do well with lead bullets, so I load plated and FMJ exclusively for them.

It would be nice if Solo 1000 bridged the optimal 9mm/.40/.45 gap for a single powder. If you try it, let us know your results! Good luck!

[mtrmn]

Usually a powder that takes lighter loads will also be faster burning. It will reach it's max pressure peak much sooner, which means it is more sensitive to variations in charge weight.
For instance, loading say .45 auto with Unique and throwing charges with a powder measure charges may vary .2-.3 gr. This won'tmake as much difference in pressures as .2-.3 gr variance with Bullseye-a much faster powder.
Faster powders are easier to go over-pressure with. Just be careful and start low.
Also, fast powders will leave a lot more room in the case, making it harder to catch a double charge visually. Some powders are "position sensitive" as well. If the powder is forward in the case (next to the bullet) when fired, they may shoot differently than when the powder is at the rear near the primer. A slower more bulky powder usually does a better job with filling up the space in the case and doing away with this "problem" , if indeed it is noticeable.