View Full Version : Just curious: ear protection in the military?
I'm sitting here watching a military channel program that piqued a question, just out of curiosity.
Do soldiers engaged in combat wear ear-pro? What kind? I mean, bad enough shooting indoors but add in use of explosives, the need to communicate, and anything else... just makes me wonder. I can't imagine not having ear-pro in that environment but it would have to be pretty good active electronic muffs or something.
Sorry if this is the wrong section. I don't have access to the general forum yet.
During my tour in Afghanistan I was on top of a M-ATV in the turret with either my m2 in the main mount with a 240b in a swing mount we fab'd up, or the mk19 with the 240b in the swing mount.
The only earpro I used were the Bose (spelling not sure, the popular stereo equip company) headset with microphone. These were hooked up to our Vix system that allowed us to talk to each other in the vehicle and by flipping a toggle to the convoy or to higher depending on the freq selected.
It didn't provide much in the way of hearing protection, but my ears typically did not ring after firing rounds.
I didn't do any dismount work, but the boys who did ran the same headset, hooked to a mobile Harris radio.
That is my experience and knowledge on the use of earpro while overseas.
Earpro is issued. Most often it's either the ribbed plug type or the foam plugs. That doesn't mean they're in when lead starts flying. Being on the ground you need to be able to pick up audible cues and these muffle those out.
In Iraq we also used the Bose headsets when doing mounted ops but not dismounted. Some nice ergonomic active hearing devices would be fantastic. Especially the type that amplify low freq sounds but stop high decibels.
There have been times I even shoved cigarette filters in as improvised earplugs. You do what you have to.
Sent from my SPH-M930BST using Tapatalk
Not a lot. All the vehicles have intercom headset systems that guys generally have on, guys with shit to do on a radio usually have Peltors or Liberators, but I never saw your standard rifleman with any kind of ear-pro in. They had plugs issued, but needed to be able to have a conversation more than they needed ear-pro.
When Dismounted
There is an earpiece in my left ear for comms. Usually carry one that blocks noise that actually gets inserted into the ear canal and another that sits on the outside earbud style that is plastic and foam covered like a regular earbud. Even the best ear pieces take a shit on a fairly regular basis so it's good to have two. When you have rotary wing working in close proximity it's hell on comms, so for air assaults I'll generally use the rubber noise blocking ear piece. Otherwise I use the earbud for better SA.
On the right side I rig a regular earplug to my helmet with a piece of 550 gut and secure it with velcro. If the noise gets to be too much I put it in. But it's out until needed.
I've used Peltors and Liberators for comms but as much as I want to like them I just can't. Good ear pieces work just as well for my purposes and are not nearly as constricting.
When Mounted
I always wear a full noise canceling headset like the Bose ones that come with the VIC-3 system found in most modern military vehicles. You don't want to hit an IED with no ear protection. Not worth the risk.
Thanks for your replies & your service guys.
Sounds like ear-pro is a bit of an afterthought. There must be a lot of hearing loss as a result of military service. My grandfather is a ww2 & Korean war vet with almost total hearing loss due to a grenade that went off nearby. Must be pretty common even still.
Thanks for your replies & your service guys.
Sounds like ear-pro is a bit of an afterthought. There must be a lot of hearing loss as a result of military service. My grandfather is a ww2 & Korean war vet with almost total hearing loss due to a grenade that went off nearby. Must be pretty common even still.
Most of us who made the military a career--even those with extensive door-kicking experience--probably suffered more hearing loss from peacetime training activities than combat.
I've seen lots of photos of guys wearing Peltors, but they're almost all SOF...
Because of our job and certain equipment systems, we get TCI Liberator-II's for comms and other uses - they're good, but still underused for how valuable they should be.
Running PRC-153's limited options significantly, and unless you're job is something like the JTAC, running peltors or TCis on foot was a bit much.
mkmckinley
01-15-12, 00:55
If they're smart they do. There are guys in their 30s in my company that are walking around with hearing aides. A lot of people will argue that ear pro hurts SA but with newer designs I haven't found this to be an issue. For walking around I like the Surefire ear plugs or the standard issue green and yellow ones work pretty good too. In one ear I'll run an ear bud for the radio. In Vehicles Peltors are the way to go.
Back in 06-07 I rolled with one earplug on the roadside ear (my right ear) and nothing in the other ear (my left ear) so I could hear my crew and the radio. During dismounted patrols I would leave it the same because my roadside ear was also my rifle side ear. I did that for 16 months.
Fast forward to today and the ringing in my ears is far worse in my left ear. Go figure.
Heavy Metal
01-15-12, 13:29
If you are a right-handed shooter, the left ear recieves more noise. The rifle itself obscures some sound from the right side.
Glad to see some some wearing on their own, and or being issued HP. I'm sure it has it's pros/cons as some touched on above.
I do know most of my old school mil friends say "what?" a lot, I'm sure part due to simple age too.
I'm not sure what, if, any follow up exists, but this is from an article I wrote called "Nutritional supplements for America’s SOF and LE Tactical Teams (http://www.optimalswat.com/content.php?r=121-Nutritional-supplements-for-America%E2%80%99s-Special-Ops)" on supps that may be of benefit to mil community:
Hearing and Lung protection against High-energy impulse noise (BLAST)
Due to the regular exposure of high-energy impulse noise (BLAST) by soldiers, permanent hearing loss is a serious problem that can affect soldiers’ operational effectiveness as well as their long-term health and combat readiness. Several studies find the mineral Magnesium quite effective for reducing hearing losses due to BLAST.
Animal experiments find there is a correlation between serum magnesium level and noise-induced permanent hearing threshold shifts (NIPTS), so researchers looked to see if this mineral would act as a direct prophylactic against hearing loss in humans. Three hundred healthy, normal-hearing recruits who underwent two months of basic military training, including repeated exposures to high levels of impulse noises (gun fire, explosives, etc.) were tested. During this placebo-controlled, double-blind study (Attias J. et al. Oral magnesium intake reduces permanent hearing loss induced by noise exposure. Am J Otolaryngol. 1994 Jan-Feb;15(1):26-32), subjects received either 167 magnesium aspartate or placebo daily.
The results showed permanent hearing damage was significantly reduced with the magnesium group vs. placebo. In fact, the results were so impressive the researchers concluded “This study may introduce a significant natural agent for the reduction of hearing damages in noise-exposed population.”
Additional placebo-controlled double blind studies have found the same effects of magnesium’s protective effects on hearing loss from high impulse noise induced damage (Joachims Z, et al. Oral magnesium supplementation as prophylaxis for noise-induced hearing loss: results of a double blind field study.Schriftenr Ver Wasser Boden Lufthyg. 1993;88:503-16.).
Heavy Metal
01-15-12, 13:49
There is also evidence anti-oxidant vitamins can help preent hearing damage.
I take those and I also supplement Magnesium. If ya'll ever see me at a class, you will likely see me popping vitamin C during the day.
My annual physical has not insicated any further hearing loss in many years in spite of my fairly frenquent exposure to gunfire.
There is also evidence anti-oxidant vitamins can help preent hearing damage.
I take those and I also supplement Magnesium. If ya'll ever see me at a class, you will likely see me popping vitamin C during the day.
My annual physical has not insicated any further hearing loss in many years in spite of my fairly frenquent exposure to gunfire.
I didn't see data on anti oxidants specific to hearing damage, but if you follow link above, there's good data for using them for lung damage caused by BLAST:
Another area of the body particularly sensitive to damage from BLAST is the lungs. In this instance, it is an abrupt rise in atmospheric pressure above ambient lasting for a very short period via concussive forces from detonations or other causes. Not surprisingly, exposure to high-level BLAST can be lethal to soldiers. Low-level BLAST encountered by military personnel during training and combat can also cause significant injury to sensitive organs and other areas of the body. Research carried out at Walter Reed Army Institute of Research has shown in several animal models that exposure to low-level BLAST results in pathological changes to the animals’ lungs. Their conclusion was that exposure to BLAST can lead to antioxidant depletion and oxidative damage with an increased risk of long term lung problems such as respiratory insufficiency and adult respiratory distress syndrome (ARDS). Their report (Elsayed NM, Gorbunov NV..Interplay between high energy impulse noise (blast) and antioxidants in the lung. Toxicology. 2003 Jul 15;189(1-2):63-74) suggests a potential benefit from antioxidant supplementation before soldiers are exposure to BLAST. Considering how inexpensive and safe magnesium and various antioxidants (i.e. vitamin C, vitamin E, etc.) are compared to the risk to hearing and lungs from BLAST, it behooves SOF soldiers to consider the use of the above and for medical-military institutions to consider recommending these compounds.
Heavy Metal
01-15-12, 18:33
There are several studies out there, here is one:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/03/070328111138.htm
In a new study in animals, University of Michigan researchers report that a combination of high doses of vitamins A, C, and E and magnesium, taken one hour before noise exposure and continued as a once-daily treatment for five days, was very effective at preventing permanent noise-induced hearing loss. The animals had prolonged exposure to sounds as loud as a jet engine at take-off at close range
I heard about the link between anti-oxidants and hearing loss several years ago.
Heavy Metal
01-15-12, 18:35
There are also studies that show taking anti-oxidants proximate to exposure to a high dosage of radation can help greatly reduce cellular damage.
Heavy Metal
01-15-12, 18:37
Perhaps the Brinkzone needs to do a video on the multiple possible positive benefits to the consumption of anti-oxidant vitamins and minerals suppliments? Hmmm? :D
There are several studies out there, here is one:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/03/070328111138.htm
I heard about the link between anti-oxidants and hearing loss several years ago.
I have to look at the primary sources, but will add that info to future articles on the topic for sure.
There are also studies that show taking anti-oxidants proximate to exposure to a high dosage of radation can help greatly reduce cellular damage.
Yes, and some other compounds. You can download a poster session as a PDF I had at the ISSN conference a few years back on that and other uses for supps in mil I didn't cover in article:
http://www.optimalswat.com/content.php?r=142-Supplement-Use-by-SOF-from-ISSN-Conference
I'd attach to this thread, but I think it's too big a file.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.