View Full Version : Rem 700 sps tactical vs varmint
xarmyguy77
01-18-12, 16:55
Im looking to buy my first Rem 700. Ive been seeing the sps tactical go on sale couple times a year in my area. My question is this, is the 20" barrel better in .308 or is the 26" barrel on the varmint better. Im shooting f class matches at 600 yds max for now. Seems the 26" might give me little higher velocity. Im no expert in .308 so looking for opinions of those in the know.
Thanks in advance!
Savage also came out with a F class ready rifle if that fits you better. I would go with the longer barrel to start. Yes the 20" will go to 1k bu the 26" will give you a bit more velocity which will help with the wind a bit more. I would find a 700 or even 70 action and have it barreled to a more fitting caliber for F class unless you want the FTR class, which is .223 or .308 only
I know this limits it's use otherwise being single shot
http://www.savagearms.com/firearms/models/
At 600yds, the 20" will serve you well. Keep in mind that the Hogue overmolded stock on the SPS Tactical AAC SD is junk.. Very flexible and makes contact with the barrel very easily. It's also very easy to torque on a bi-pod.
I spent a bit of time trying to reinforce the Hogue stock's fore arm and stabilize it but, alas it's still a POS! It's a shame because I really do like the tactile feel and contours of this stock.
I see a McMillan or HS precision stock in my very near future.
I went with the 20 inch. Both are good. I also bit the bullet and went with Tactical-threaded barrel, stainless ,5R, with upgraded stock. You are going to pay for all that at about $1,000. Pay it now or pay it later.
Its a great starter gun with many options for the future.
If you're only going to use it for target shooting l cant see any reason to get a shorter barrel.
I went with the 20 inch. Both are good. I also bit the bullet and went with Tactical-threaded barrel, stainless ,5R, with upgraded stock. You are going to pay for all that at about $1,000. Pay it now or pay it later.
Its a great starter gun with many options for the future.
Both the 700 SPS Tactical AAC with the standard 20" barrel and the 5r SS 20" were available locally. The 5r was about $600 more for me, so I went with the "plain" Tactical AAC model. So far I am happy with it, but I'll likely be upgrading the stock soon and that will put me in about the price range that I would've spend for the SS 5r. Not sure which stock I'll be going with, but I'm thinking the McMillan A-5.
Sometimes I do think that I should've just went with the 5r SS, but I figured as a first bolt gun, the cheaper version would leave me with more cash for ammo and I could upgrade later. So I guess in my case, I'm paying later.
How is your 5r SS running? I wish I had the open areas that you guys seem to have available to shoot. A man-sized steel at 600 yards would be awesome!
xarmyguy77
01-19-12, 06:47
After some more research I am also considering the savage 10fp. All three of these rifles seem to be in the same price range and all seem to have their quirks. Guess I just have to see what jumps out at me and get it. Thanks for the replies
xarmyguy77
01-19-12, 06:50
If you're only going to use it for target shooting l cant see any reason to get a shorter barrel.
Thats what I wasnt sure of. I thought I read people saying 20" is perfect for .308 match shooting. But for me I really dont need a short barrel and if its going to help me I will go with the longer one, thanks
How is your 5r SS running?
It's a good barrel, but the standard Hammer Forged SPS Tac bbl on my gun hangs right with it all day.
The 5R cleans up easier. And with IMR 4064 it shoots 30-50 fps faster than my gun. With Varget the 5R is only gaining 5-10 fps.
Thats what I wasnt sure of. I thought I read people saying 20" is perfect for .308 match shooting. But for me I really dont need a short barrel and if its going to help me I will go with the longer one, thanks
The ONLY reason I'd go for a longer barrel would be if I wanted to shoot the 155 scenar bullets.
If you're only shooting to 600 yards and using heavy Match kings/Amax/VLDs, the 20 will get you their fine.
The ONLY reason I'd go for a longer barrel would be if I wanted to shoot the 155 scenar bullets.
If you're only shooting to 600 yards and using heavy Match kings/Amax/VLDs, the 20 will get you their fine.
So you don't think that the extra velocity of the 26" barrel, which alone is worth a couple less inches of wind drift at 600 yards, would be worthwhile for the guy's stated purpose of shooting F class with the gun?
I know this site has a heavy "tactical" bent, but go to an F class match and ask around to see how many people recommend a 20" barrel over a 26". I'm having a real hard time thinking up any reason that I'd pick a 20" barrel over a 26" for F class shooting.
So you don't think that the extra velocity of the 26" barrel, which alone is worth a couple less inches of wind drift at 600 yards, would be worthwhile for the guy's stated purpose of shooting F class with the gun?
I know this site has a heavy "tactical" bent, but go to an F class match and ask around to see how many people recommend a 20" barrel over a 26". I'm having a real hard time thinking up any reason that I'd pick a 20" barrel over a 26" for F class shooting.
I guess it depends on your environment. If it's windy where you are, that extra bbl length and fast flying 155 scenars would zip right through it.
Out here we have 3-5 mph winds regularly.... and we're currently married to the heavy bullets... 26" is just so much gun.... but it may be the optimal choice for you.
I guess it depends on your environment. If it's windy where you are, that extra bbl length and fast flying 155 scenars would zip right through it.
Out here we have 3-5 mph winds regularly.... and we're currently married to the heavy bullets... 26" is just so much gun.... but it may be the optimal choice for you.
I'm not trying to tell the guy what's the optimal choice for me, I'm trying to tell him which gun would suit HIS needs better. If you're shooting F class then there's no reason to take a shorter rifle. As for the 155 scenars and wind, they'll pretty much always end up with more wind drift at long range compared to a heavier bullet with a higher BC when fired at the same pressures. If you really want to cheat wind with a .308 then you need to be shooting the higher BC bullets.
xarmyguy77
01-19-12, 10:24
Looks like I sparked a pretty good debate. The matches I shoot are all at the same range and its extremely windy always.
After some more research I am also considering the savage 10fp. All three of these rifles seem to be in the same price range and all seem to have their quirks. Guess I just have to see what jumps out at me and get it. Thanks for the replies
The Savage 10FP was also very much in the running when I bought my 700. The 700 was readily available locally and the Savage wasn't even available through special order here, so that made my decision easier.
There's a regular at the public range that I go to that has a set of the Savage 110BA rifles. He has the 300 Win mag, 308 Win, and 338 Lapua Mag versions. Seems like a sweet shooter. He's offered to let me try, but he was shooting the 338 Lapua that day and I didn't feel like wasting his rounds. If he brings the 308 Win, maybe I'll take him up on that offer.
It's a good barrel, but the standard Hammer Forged SPS Tac bbl on my gun hangs right with it all day.
The 5R cleans up easier. And with IMR 4064 it shoots 30-50 fps faster than my gun. With Varget the 5R is only gaining 5-10 fps.
What is the standard barrel for the standard SPS Tac AAC version?
Do you have velocity numbers for both the FGMM 168 and 175 out of your 20" SPS Tac (if that is indeed what you have)? I picked up a few boxes of the FGMM 168 on sale recently, but they were out of the 175. I haven't seen the 175 locally for quite a while.
What is the standard barrel for the standard SPS Tac AAC version?
Do you have velocity numbers for both the FGMM 168 and 175 out of your 20" SPS Tac (if that is indeed what you have)? I picked up a few boxes of the FGMM 168 on sale recently, but they were out of the 175. I haven't seen the 175 locally for quite a while.
I don't know about the AAC version. But according to Rem's site, the SPS Tactical comes with a Hammer Forge barrel... some searches show 1/12 and some 1/10... I haven't checked mine.
We don't shoot factory ammo, but We're getting 2511ish with the 175s... and about the same with the 168s with 42.8gr Varget.
I don't know about the AAC version. But according to Rem's site, the SPS Tactical comes with a Hammer Forge barrel... some searches show 1/12 and some 1/10... I haven't checked mine.
We don't shoot factory ammo, but We're getting 2511ish with the 175s... and about the same with the 168s with 42.8gr Varget.
Thanks!
For 175, I just have some Remington Match King BTHP. I'm taking the FGMM 168 to the range this weekend and will see how it does grouping wise.
It's been interesting reading about yours and Pappabear's venture into LR shooting with bolt guns. Sounds like you guys put in a TON of time and are making great strides. I hope to get more into to it now that I have the base setup.
It's been interesting reading about yours and Pappabear's venture into LR shooting with bolt guns. Sounds like you guys put in a TON of time and are making great strides. I hope to get more into to it now that I have the base setup.
We still make STUPID mistakes EVERY time we go out. But we see real improvement all the time.
That magpul dvd set release was timely. It's good refresher and new material.
It's funny because all of Pappabear's scopes and range finders, etc. are now obsolete for him.... He never thought he'd shoot beyond 400 yards not too long ago. Now he wants to shoot half way to China.
We still make STUPID mistakes EVERY time we go out. But we see real improvement all the time.
That magpul dvd set release was timely. It's good refresher and new material.
It's funny because all of Pappabear's scopes and range finders, etc. are now obsolete for him.... He never thought he'd shoot beyond 400 yards not too long ago. Now he wants to shoot half way to China.
My mistakes are much more basic, but I can feel when messed up a trigger pull or something. Upon confirmation of a pulled shot through the spotting scope, it's like I hear a little voice saying "A flinch will cost you a Buck Forty!" followed by "quote - markm". Haha.
You and Pappabear probably push each other pretty hard and the steady improvement is probably a function of the competition. I've got to get my friends with ARs to get into LR/precision shooting.
Beyond the public range, with max target distance of 450 yards, the next available evolution is high powered rifle matches at 200-600 yards. I believe the public range will allow you to put up your own metal targets, but I'd have to hike the plate up a good ways up the side of the mountain beyond the range backstop.
It really does help to have a partner to push you and spot for you. I went to my local range the other day solo, and found my self "making expensive noise". Its hard to stay focused. Yea, get your buddies out with their AR's, even with iron sights you can surprise yourself.
I have read a lot about the velocity of 308 and long barrels. Unless you are loading heavy ass bullets at OMG pressures there is little to be gained above 20". Not nothing like some say, but when we cut my uncles down to 20" from 26" we lost about 60 fps on average with 175s over a max load of varget(its what the rifle likes best). But the groups shrank about 25%, which I have to assume is from the better crown and the stightly stiffer barrel comparitively. Less whip. We putt a Police take of stock on it and had it glass bedded and I think total he has $600 in the rifle, $200 in the stock, $75 in bedding, and $100 to cut the barrel and crown it out. Prints .5 groups generally and is a real nice rifle. I like the short stiff barrel.
I guess in general I'm saying get the tactical, ditch the stock(it sucks) and see what it does. guess you could get the Varmint and shorten it if you don't like it.
Dollylamma
01-25-12, 18:56
After suggestions and some informal training by a couple of marine scout snipers friends of mine, I was able to reduce muzzle flip, use somewhat proper form and made what I consider accurate hits on the targets I was shooting at with a 20" barrel. Muzzle flip was an issue for me until these guys showed me how to shoot the gun. I personally like the 20 now, before I hated it.
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