Girsan 2311 (2011 clone) for the win?

I have this posted elsewhere but think this info is useful here too.

I recently bought a Girsan 2311 which is a 9mm double stack imported by European American Armory. The gun is a 4.25" commander size with a Gen 1 STI pattern grip. It runs on STI magazines.

The gun is a bushing style with a W/N ramped barrel. It is pre-cut for the Holosun K and ships with a fixed rear sight cover plate. The gun also ships with a very inexpensive red dot that seems more like a marketing gimmick than an actual aiming device.

The frame is a Government Model in terms of rails and cycle distance and is not actually a Commander. It is a Government with .75" cut off the front end.

The trigger is decent at five pounds with no provision to adjust over travel. The slide to frame fit is pretty good. Barrel and bushing fit is nothing extra. I'm confident in saying a new bushing would improve accuracy. Accuracy now is nothing to write home about.

Most surprisingly is that the gun actually works and works well. I have right at 1,000 rounds fired with only one malfunction which was a failure to go into battery with one of my reloads. Mags used have been mostly Atlas which probably certainly helps. Prodigy mags work but are hit or miss with slide lock engagement. The one Check-Mate mag that came with the gun also works okay.

What's the point? I see this gun being of interest to a burgeoning competition shooter who may want a hicap to mess with but for whatever reason doesn't want to spend the money on a pricier option. It should also appeal to someone wanting a beater to use in place of the more expensive Staccato or whatever. A gun to use for one handed manipulations or as a dedicated trainer. Something that can get bumped/banged/roughly handled without much concern for value. It should also find a place with the hobbyist who wants a gun to mess with but doesn't need the pedigree of the other guns. A gun to practice gunsmith skills on.

Here are a few pics. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...4df887e9a9.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...dd40ce35f4.jpg

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Tok, I saw these guns and wondered. I believe manufacturing in general often makes even budget guns pretty decent these days. Its very interesting to hear you can buy a budget 2011/2311 gun and reap all the benefits of a 2011 design for budget money. Keep banging on that gun and keep us posted.

And yes, Atlas mags are great and have the most powerful springs on the market IMHO, and I've seen where Stacatto now makes mags with stronger springs which may be a preferable design for 2011's. So interesting to hear they run good in your gun.

Keep banging Tok!

PB

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Originally Posted by Pappabear

you can buy a budget 2011/2311 gun and reap all the benefits of a 2011 design for budget money. Keep banging on that gun and keep us posted.

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I don't know about reaping all the benefits. The trigger, while usable, isn't as good as it could be. The barrel fit is a bit loose so the gun isn't as accurate as it could be either.

If the frame, slide and barrel are of decent quality and will last awhile the rest of the stuff I'm fine with.

EAA needs a catchy motto for these guns. Maybe "40% of the quality for 30% of the price."

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Speaking of budget guns, I was just in a LGS and took a hard look at this 9mm 1911. I was surprised how good the gun felt in my hands, the safety clicked nice, the beavertail was fitted decent the gun felt OK. I had to stop myself.

http://i.imgur.com/p1TqgGX.jpg

PB

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Originally Posted by Pappabear

Speaking of budget guns, I was just in a LGS and took a hard look at this 9mm 1911. I was surprised how good the gun felt in my hands, the safety clicked nice, the beavertail was fitted decent the gun felt OK. I had to stop myself.

http://i.imgur.com/p1TqgGX.jpg

PB

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I looked over a Tisas lightweight Commander a few months back. The gun was surprisingly nice. I think it was called the stingray. It seemed like a nice gun for $500.

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Speaking of Tisas I read on another forum they will be offering a hicap in the near future.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pappabear

Speaking of budget guns, I was just in a LGS and took a hard look at this 9mm 1911. I was surprised how good the gun felt in my hands, the safety clicked nice, the beavertail was fitted decent the gun felt OK. I had to stop myself.

http://i.imgur.com/p1TqgGX.jpg

PB

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I'd love to shoot that against the Hi Power I just got. I've read good and bad (here) on the Tisas guns.

If I bought a Tisas, I would want to handle it. I handled two other models and both had terrible safeties on them. They were so soft it felt like they were just floating with almost zero click. They felt like $500 guns, but this one felt superb and like I said, beavertail great.....still for $500 you could swop out some parts from Wilson and be good to go. The slide and frame were decent so building it up for a guy handy with 1911's would be a great project gun! The knock off Wilsonish grips were pretty nice too.

PB

I do hate bob tails, but that price can bring a lot of concessions.

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Originally Posted by markm

I do hate bob tails, but that price can bring a lot of concessions.

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EGW sells a "bobtail regrets" mainspring housing that might be of interest.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tokarev

EGW sells a "bobtail regrets" mainspring housing that might be of interest.

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That designation is funny.

MJD Solutions has pics on socialist media of his grip installed on a Girsan. He says it is a straightforward install.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...7800f4ac45.jpg

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Interesting. Looks like a 1st Gen STI grip module.

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Originally Posted by gaijin

Interesting. Looks like a 1st Gen STI grip module.

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Yes I think that's right. But no bottom "grip" screws. Also the MJD are supposed to have a bit more magazine well flare built in.

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In for a penny in for a pound. I'm going to send the slide off to C&H and have it cut for the cross plate system. I thought about sending it to DSC to have him cut it for the Dawson/Staccato plates but the C&H is a little cheaper. Both seem to be available for a decent variety of optics so either wouldn't be a bad choice.

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I was able to handle one of these in a NOT so LGS, Flaggstaff AZ. How much do these guns weigh, it seemed pretty stout to me? They had two budget guns I was looking at and Im not 100% it was yours but it was hefty and made me think, this much be a pussy cat to shoot. But slide was smooth and at a quick glance seemed OK built for the money. Guy said they have sold a bunch and no issues. He was a huge fan.

PB

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Originally Posted by Pappabear

How much do these guns weigh, it seemed pretty stout to me?

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EAA website lists this version at 25.6 ounces. I haven't put it on my postage scale to verify.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tokarev

EAA website lists this version at 25.6 ounces. I haven't put it on my postage scale to verify.

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Then this was a different gun. It was close to 40 oz or more. Maybe my hand scale is off but not 15oz.

I had to go on the hunt, I thought Im losing my mind. it was a Rock Island at a cool 2.7 lbs =- 43.2 oz

PB

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Originally Posted by Pappabear

Then this was a different gun. It was close to 40 oz or more. Maybe my hand scale is off but not 15oz.

I had to go on the hunt, I thought Im losing my mind. it was a Rock Island at a cool 2.7 lbs =- 43.2 oz

PB

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The Rock Island is a Para Ordnance clone or similar. Not an STI 2011 clone as is the case with the Girsan.

Internet rumor is that Tisas will have a 2011 clone out in January. If this is true and the gun is anything like the Raider, Sting Ray, etc it should be a good product.

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Why would you go this route over Prodigy? The kinks have been worked out and they can be had for around 1k on sale.

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Originally Posted by Stopsign32v

Why would you go this route over Prodigy? The kinks have been worked out and they can be had for around 1k on sale.

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Curiosity mainly. That and I like the concept of the lighter aluminum frame. A fully loaded Prodigy with a light and dot is pretty darned heavy.

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Here's the slide back from CHPWS. I had the factory Holosun K / RMSc cut replaced with the Cross Plate system. This plate is for a Holosun 509T.

The plate had to be installed slightly more rearward than C&H normally does because the factory holes would have caused issues with the new holes. The C&H tech said it shouldn't be a problem. Looking back maybe I should have had them install it in the usual stop and just drilled two new holes instead of four.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...bced844ab9.jpg

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https://youtu.be/KhTbUK95qEI?si=YtkyRDDP82Ryd_SK

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tokarev

Here's the slide back from CHPWS. I had the factory Holosun K / RMSc cut replaced with the Cross Plate system. This plate is for a Holosun 509T.

The plate had to be installed slightly more rearward than C&H normally does because the factory holes would have caused issues with the new holes. The C&H tech said it shouldn't be a problem. Looking back maybe I should have had them install it in the usual stop and just drilled two new holes instead of four.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...bced844ab9.jpg

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Going Enclosed emitter, nice. Instal shoot and lets some pics of it installed. Your taking that gun to the next level.

PB

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Originally Posted by Pappabear

taking that gun to the next level.

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One thing I've discovered is that something is wrong with the grip. As mentioned earlier, the gun works fine with Atlas mags and feeds fine (but doesn't always lock open) with Dura Mags. It doesn't work with factory Staccato mags or the handgul of squeezed and tuned Checkmate mags. These won't either latch in or stay latched in and are very loose inside the grip.

I had initially figured the mag catch itself was a little short and replaced the catch with a new one from Dawson Precision. This did nothing. The problem seems to be that the mag catch itself doesn't protrude far enough into the grip to properly catch the mag.

Something else I note is that the small retaining tab on the right side of the thumb safety isn't long enough to fully sit inside the retention groove in the frame. It is fine when the safety is off but is exposed when the safety is on. What's saving things now is that the joint between the right and left paddles is crazy tight. But I don't want to rely on this to keep things together over the long haul.

So in addition to a new grip the gun also needs a new safety. I guess while I'm at it it needs a tighter barrel bushing. These are all things EAA needs to identify and clean up in production.

It will be interesting to see how the Tisas/MAC shakes out but I'm pretty confident in saying that it will be the better gun.

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At this point I'd say there's no reason to roll the dice on one of these. Not when Prodigys and MACs are not too terribly much more expensive.

https://youtu.be/8z6Vis3KX7E?si=b4wnrvOxSlYG-1Wm

Budget 1911s are often not so budget after they need a bunch of parts replaced to make them decent. I'd say that's definitely shaping up to be the case with the Girsan. It is true that the Prodigy can also be a roll of the dice but it is also true that Springfield seems to be taking care of any problem guns. EAA? Who knows what they're doing at this point? And the MAC guns may yet shake out to be decent but are just too new on the market.

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