AWESOME info. The Centurion/Schmid model I have (sent in to Centurion this week, they are adjusting something on it) had a very light first stage (to me) and a heavy second stage. I might try this when I get It back.
AWESOME info. The Centurion/Schmid model I have (sent in to Centurion this week, they are adjusting something on it) had a very light first stage (to me) and a heavy second stage. I might try this when I get It back.
That looks exactly like the Sionics trigger I recently put over 10k rounds on, close to half of that in a suppressed 9mm SBR. So far so good. My pull weight has been slightly under advertised, using a cheap gauge.Quote:
Originally Posted by sinister
Just did this. Big difference on a gun I intend for precision. The second stage was “stopping” when setting up for a careful shot.Quote:
Originally Posted by sinister
I cut about 1.25 coils off an Unbranded AR (brand) disconnector spring. I don’t have a trigger gauge, but this is much better than the stiff red coil that came with the Centurion-Schmid.
Same size springs. Schmid on left, UAR on right. Schmid is not a conical spring, though.
https://i.imgur.com/Eawv4hm.jpg
Trimmed 1.25 coils from narrow end.
https://i.imgur.com/d8cdRuV.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/IaSsxPW.mp4
edit... wrong thread.
I'm not the world's biggest fan of aftermarket triggers, I know there are some good ones..... and lots of bad ones too. We have guys show up for Patrol Rifle class with all manner of aftermarket triggers and many are way inappropriate for the street or in the house-- too damned light or patently unreliable. If it's held in with special pins (screws in the ends) or has to have the exterior retention plates (screws again), as far as I'm concerned it's not fit for a serious gun.
It seems like a lot of instructors are pushing light triggers and muzzle brakes. I don't think we should become dependent upon either. Over the years I have noted that the students with brakes and light triggers do not as a group shoot any better. In other words being so equipped does not necessarily guarantee a top shooter. I am NOT saying you can't-no-way shoot better and faster with a better trigger and softer shooting rifle, sure you can. But to me it's not worth giving up absolute reliability and it's not worth the extra noise (I know this is not a brake thread but to me brakes and light triggers are kinda in the same category).
We've had many guys show up with cassette triggers that are held in place by the set screws that push on the receiver floor to jack the FCG up and retain the pins by putting them in shear. Clever but destined to come loose. I always ask the class: "You want a super light trigger? Let's say you're off duty and have been pulled over six states over. You're with the family but you and your car match the description of some guy that just robbed the bank two towns behind you. They've got you out of the care and you're being covered by a rookie with an AR, he's all shaking like a leaf and has wet his pants but he's got you at carbine-point and his finger looks like it might be on the trigger. What pull weight do you want that rifle to have?"
OK, I got that out of the way. NOW I can say, I think it's totally fine to have a whole selection of aftermarket triggers and play around with them. Yes!- there are many good ones out there. I have my own selection-- and I have been disappointed by most. I have almost all the ones mentioned above and some others. All are what I consider to be top quality-- clever designs well executed. I do have my match rifles and, ehm, prairie game management rifles. This is where I test the triggers I admonish people not to have for more serious applications. This is where I try to moderate my stick-in-the-mud outlook on triggers. But.... there has been much failure. Universally it is this-- WOW that trigger is great, so light, no overtravel, short easy reset and-- it bump fires off my shoulder. I saw many such triggers offered at NRA a couple weeks ago, and I asked one purveyor, "Do you ever get people asking about your triggers bump-firing off their shoulder, and what do you tell them?" He responded, "Yes. I tell them, "learn how to shoot!'".
So THAT's my problem, now I know! Oh, I can make them not bump fire but I ask the group, should I have to modify my technique, should I have to carefully and consciously hold the rifle/carbine a certain way, in the hope of not getting a two-shot burst? My answer to that is "no". Should there be such a thing as, "Oh, you're holding the gun wrong"? My answer again is, "no". It should work if the hold is right, or if it is wrong.
Lighter guns, more trouble, heavier guns, less trouble, but still-- trouble.
I guess I could have saved myself the trouble of writing the above and just asked the question: "Am I the only one who gets bump-fire off my shoulder with lighter triggers?"
Delete
Over more years than I care to admit I've been issued M16s or some derivative with the range of "Good (or acceptable) but heavy" triggers to "HAY-SOOS CHRISTO, that trigger SUCKS."Quote:
Originally Posted by Ned Christiansen
As a trainee the stock Colt M4 (single-stage M16A1 / 723 carbine) trigger is acceptable, but heavy. It works, to the GI spec of around 5.5 to 6 pounds. Not ideal once you actually know what you're doing. The example of a rookie trooper is always the default factory trigger -- and that still doesn't guarantee he's not going to ND into you or a family member or passenger.
The Geissele SSA-E makes me bump-fire, for both combat (speed) and precision. I won't use them.
The SSA or G2S and the Schmid work for me in personally-owned guns, the Super Select Fire in a government-owned weapon. The three-round burst trigger sucks donkey appendage.
NONE of my weapons even has a GI-style single-stage trigger. If you need one I can send you one.
Life's too short to shoot junk guns.
I have 3 SSA-Es and an SSA. With my most recent SSA-E I was going to try a Schmid trigger, but when I saw they were on sale for $150 I thought, why bother. I like the crisper break of the SSA-E over the SSA, but I have SSA springs in my SSA-Es. So they all pull at around 4.5 lbs on my cheap trigger gauge.
This is my stance too. The GI trigger only bugs me when shooting groups with good magnification. I've pulled GI triggers out of gun that would not be acceptable too however. One felt like it was full of beach sand.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ned Christiansen
My first AR purchase was in the 90s. My first aftermarket trigger was 2014. I wanted a 1S trigger that was a bit lighter than a GI without sacrificing safety/reliability. By chance I read an article in MilitaryTimes titled 10,000 Trips of the Trigger that had been published years earlier. After reading the article I purchased a Wilson Combat TTU. Its been in my primary AR ever since. My TTU has well exceeded the author's 10k review. Flawless operation and feels the same as the day I bought it. Thank you GearScout.