Quality factory AK's now cost more than brand name AR's and are a better investment.

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05-09-19, 09:36
Bret

My take on Arsenal:
Configurations offered: A
Bulgarian factory quality: B
Quality of Nevada rework for 922(r) compliance: F
Paint Quality: D
Customer Service: FU
05-09-19, 09:38
Renegade

I do not see any investment potential on mass-produced commodity guns.
05-09-19, 10:31
RetroRevolver77

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ron3

Yea...I think I paid about $450 for a new AES-10B. (7.62 semi Romanian RPK) .

Sold it for about $700 several years ago. Oops.

It ran fine. Now people want $1200 or more for them. No way.

Which is exactly my point. They are importing them now for $1400 retail I believe. AK's seem to be the only rifles that I see this happening with and I own quite varied collection. Even stuff that was brought in during the ban is going for three times as much as it originally sold for. The same can't be said for a lot of other types of rifles unless it's to a ban state only type thing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bret

My take on Arsenal:
Configurations offered: A
Bulgarian factory quality: B
Quality of Nevada rework for 922(r) compliance: F
Paint Quality: D
Customer Service: FU

I've owned probably three dozen Arsenal AK's and only had issues with one.
05-09-19, 10:36
Doc Safari

Quote:

Originally Posted by RetroRevolver77

I've owned probably three dozen Arsenal AK's and only had issues with one.

I owned several over a period of 20 years. Multiple issues. Some problems required minor adjustments (like rattly receiver covers), others required a return to Arsenal for repair. When I switched back to AR's in 2010 I didn't have ANY issues for about eight years. I sold all my AK's and haven't looked back.
05-09-19, 10:48
RetroRevolver77

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doc Safari

I owned several over a period of 20 years. Multiple issues. Some problems required minor adjustments (like rattly receiver covers), others required a return to Arsenal for repair. When I switched back to AR's in 2010 I didn't have ANY issues for about eight years. I sold all my AK's and haven't looked back.

How much are your AR's worth now? How much are those AK's worth now? Most of the AK's I bought or let go are worth two to three times what I paid.
05-09-19, 11:14
Doc Safari

Quote:

Originally Posted by RetroRevolver77

How much are your AR's worth now? How much are those AK's worth now? Most of the AK's I bought or let go are worth two to three times what I paid.

I generally don't buy firearms expecting their value to appreciate.

I buy them for use and SHTF (which I had to give up a lot of due to a huge tax bill).

In the case of AR's I concentrated on Colts because I thought they would hold their value better long-term than some other brand that might not be around in a few years.

I literally have one AR left that might appreciate in value because it's a discontinued Colt model with the restricted rollmark.
05-09-19, 12:44
RetroRevolver77

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doc Safari

I generally don't buy firearms expecting their value to appreciate.

I buy them for use and SHTF (which I had to give up a lot of due to a huge tax bill).

In the case of AR's I concentrated on Colts because I thought they would hold their value better long-term than some other brand that might not be around in a few years.

I literally have one AR left that might appreciate in value because it's a discontinued Colt model with the restricted rollmark.

I think all the Colt AR's will appreciate in value at some point- probably the only AR's that actually will long term.
05-09-19, 18:14
Danus ex

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bret

Perhaps if you're doing it from an investment standpoint, but I buy based on what I want to have for my collection. I've found with guns and coins that if I buy what I like in nice condition, they'll generally increase in value over time. I have to disagree about the B&T and SAN offerings. Their prices have already taken up most of the upside potential. B&T offerings are not limited, so that will keep them from increasing in value. SAN's offerings are at least limited, but they're even more expensive. I totally agree with you about Colt AR's and ammunition.

Regarding SAN, SVDs, AMTs, and many other imported guns started expensive, then became painfully expensive. Nobody can guarantee that SAN guns will have the same fate, but they stand a decent chance.

B&T is tricky. While they're not rare or special now, their stratospheric pricing throttles the number of them that actually make it into circulation. 10 more years will reveal a lot there.

I sold off my gun collection in three ~$30k chunks. What sucked hardest was that finding buyers for firearms over $2000.00 takes considerably more time than guns under that number and your return isn't great. Definitely a bell curve there. What sucked second most was shipping 20 1200 round crates of Bulgarian 7.62x54R!

In practice, I'm similar to you. I just buy what I want and don't think too hard about it. This stuff can absorb you.
05-09-19, 22:31
Bret

Quote:

Originally Posted by RetroRevolver77

I've owned probably three dozen Arsenal AK's and only had issues with one.

Here are all that I've owned and what happened to them:
SLR-95MB: No problems.
106CR: Multiple feeding & ejection issues, three trips back to Arsenal NV and they replaced it.
106CR (replacement): Same thing as above. Turns out this was a used rifle with a lower s/n than my first one. They refunded my money.
106UR: Multiple feeding & ejection issues, three trips back to Arsenal NV and they refunded my money.
107UR: FS/GB canted. Turns out that the monkey in NV that installed it misdrilled the FS/GB pin which cracked the FS/GB. He drilled again anyway and sent it out. They replaced the FS/GB. I chopped the barrel and it runs fine now.
104FR: No problems.
104UR: Received at my dealer with twisted receiver cover. Turns out the rear sight on the receiver cover was rubbing on the edge of the box and it got smashed during shipment. A proper shipping box would have avoided this problem. They replaced the receiver cover with another, but didn't engrave the serial number. I had to pay to get that done myself. I chopped the barrel and it runs fine now.
106CR: After a decade passed since the previous 106CR's, I figured they had ironed out the problems. I was wrong. Rifle was massively overgassed, so much so that it broke the tail off of the disconnector in short order. Sent it back and they replaced the disconnector but did nothing to fix the overgassing problem. I called them and they claimed that I should send it back because the feed ramp area was defective. I decided that I'd fix this rifle myself, so I chopped the barrel which resolved the overgassing problem. It was still having some feed issues, so I tried Polish Beryl magazines. The rifle now runs fine so long as I use the Beryl magazines.

So, Arsenal is 2 of 8 for me. Keep in mind that the first one was not modified by Arsenal NV at all. Arsenal NV is 1 of 7 for me. Arsenal quality is a myth. Like I said, I'm an AK whore, so I subject myself to this against all common sense because the configurations they offer are great. After fixing 3, the 5 that I have now run fine.
05-09-19, 23:36
RetroRevolver77

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bret

So, Arsenal is 2 of 8 for me. Keep in mind that the first one was not modified by Arsenal NV at all. Arsenal NV is 1 of 7 for me. Arsenal quality is a myth. Like I said, I'm an AK whore, so I subject myself to this against all common sense because the configurations they offer are great. After fixing 3, the 5 that I have now run fine.

I've owned a lot more than that and I don't have these problems. I have about a dozen Arsenal AK's now- no issues. FYI- they only made 106's for one year, 2006 date code 46.

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