Best grain 9mm round for Glock pistols?
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Best grain 9mm round for Glock pistols?
For self defense I use the 68grain Leighi Defense from Underwood ammo, this stuff is so great that Bill Wilson of Wilson combat bought the company .
The great thing with this ammo is 115 grain ball ammo for practice has same point of impact
I go the opposite direction and carry 147gr RA9T in my time off. Consistently meets FBI penetration standards from a variety of barrel lengths with above average penetration and expansion, subsonic in a pistol, says “Ranger” right on the box.
What’s the objective here?
Ive shot a bunch of 115, 124, and 147. I haven't really seen a difference as far as accuracy goes between grain weight.
For years my department carried the Speer Gold Dot 124 +P and it was a proven performer. We recently switched the Winchesters new Ranger One 147 grain and it has worked well so far.
Weight is just weight, gets too much consideration, and is only one of many variables in play.
See also: "what weight is most accurate", "what weight is most reliable", "my gun doesn't work with <weight>", trajectory matching of weights
My agency has used GD 124+p for the better part of 20+ years. It works extremely well in everything from micro 9’s to full size service weapons. As the guy that use to do all the shooting reviews for the city I can tell you that it works.
My carry pistols are comped or ported.
The efficiency of both are maximized by amount of gas Volume (which isn’t necessarily hand in hand with chamber pressure).
I carry 124 HST+P or Gold Dot+P. Accuracy with either is nearly identical, shot to shot is quickest in my hands with these.
I get issued defensive ammo. I havent been issued anything ive been dissatisfied with, so I just carry what Im issued. In my career it's been 180 grn HST .40, 230 grn +P HST .45, 124 grn +P Gold Dot 9mm, and 147 grn Ranger One 9mm.
All have shown to be performers in gunfights and would carry any of them without question. We were a bit apprehensive of the Ranger One at first as I believe we are the first major department to use it. But it's proving itself.
124g gold dot and 124g nato is what I use
Not sure why the question is Glock specific. 124 Gr +P GDHP is the 9mm defensive ammo I settled on for my G19, G17, and other 9mm pistols.
Andy
Federal HST 147gr +P. The standard pressure version is also doable since it appears they don't make the +P one anymore.
I have to laugh......25 years ago I wouldn't touch a 147gr 9mm load. Hell, I was a .40 (at a minimum) fan back then. Modern bullet design has it's merits.
My wife gets limp-wrist failures on lighter weights with the Glock 19.3 that is our nightstand gun, so I use 147gr Gold Dots (and the corresponding 147gr Speer Lawman for training). I use the same in my carry gun so I don’t have to stock multiple types of ammo. Not a great reason, but there it is.
Currently I'm using Federal HST +P 124gr. I just got some Lehigh Defense 90gr Extreme Defense ammo. Going to hit the range and see how it cycles through my MR920. May end up switching to it.
Bill Wilson was so impressed with Leighi Defense performance he bought the company and he is on record as carrying in his 9mm Leighi Defense
I’m sure if Winchester ammo was a small company available for purchase within Wilson’s means, and Wilson thought it would do well under his umbrella, he’d be carrying RA9T, and telling us that he does. He certainly wouldn’t say “well, I bought Winchester, but I’m really more impressed with Gold Dots, but Speer wasn’t selling. So I sell Winchester, but carry Speer.”
I don't know for sure, but I think he was impressed with the hunting rounds by Leighi and that sparked his interest. The pistol rounds just came with the company. Leighi make multiple styles of handgun ammo and he carried the fluted rounds, because they work.
I think the fluted rounds are better than traditional ammo for the following reasons. First they are barrier blind, second they have no cavity to kill up with material so the round becomes like a ball round. I then think in the 357sig round with the over 2000fps speed they will do rifle like damage.
They sell a few brands.
https://shopwilsoncombat.com/Wilson-...partments/221/
Best I can recall from 20 years ago they were selling.45 ACP using VV N320 for low flash and decent velocity with a Speer 200gr, but can't recall if it was the ash tray or gold dot.
“Ash Tray” and you’re dating yourself. :cool:
That’s going back a ways, and yeah- I shot them.
I don't see where they've been tested at those speeds, and Lehigh doesn't list them as a rifle/carbine bullet. The do have an extensive line of rifle bullets too of course. The 357 Legend has its own design, so no overlap there. Has this design been tested within FBI protocols at the velocities you're anticipating? I didn't see anything on YouTube either. I'm not bashing, just asking. It seems to be an omission on their part, or maybe I just didn't find what I was looking for.
Bullet construction is infinitely more important than weight.
We do need more testing with these bullets at higher velocities.
I did see some testing vs armor.
I wish I could test these myself but I don't have the facilities. I rely on the Underwood-loaded 68 gr Lehigh bullet in three guns. 9mm pistol (1710 fps), 9mm carbine (2120 fps) and .380 (1405 fps). These numbers are from my chronograph best I can recall at the moment.
New Lehigh factory.
I wouldn't mind investing in them.
https://youtu.be/8ZXBDTb8iHg
Guys I found the new prototype Leigh Defense projectiles they are developing.
https://i.imgflip.com/7ezhxi.jpg
But seriously, I wouldnt be jumping ship from JHPs to Lehigh projectiles unless I see some large dept OIS data or autopsy data correlated with lab testing, even something like being backed by professionals like DocGKR would be decent, as far as I know there is nothing but hearsay in terms of real world performance from their bullets.
I have seen the damage it does on flesh, but not human. It works great Bill Wilson also talks about shooting hogs with it.
The late Jim Cirillo talked about rounds above 1900fps work different than pistol velocity rounds.
When it comes to the 65 grain 357 sig, I have no doubt it will work better than any regular pistol round. It is hitting at the same velocity as an AK or SBR AR
There are many of videos of these bullets doing JHP-like damage to meat and gelatin. With more consistent performance than JHP's.
But not from rifles.
Check this one out. Start at 4:30. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=FWgXc9L9vx0
I think the lightweight Lehigh pistol bullets do as much damage as an expanded hollow point with fewer drawbacks (can't clog, don't have to expand) with additional benefits. (Lighter gun, less recoil, barrier blind, won't break up, can penetrate some armor, less likely to over penetrate)
I do think they aren't as desirable at longer ranges (50 yds?) Because being light they will lose momentum faster than a heavier bullet and may not penetrate enough.
It's interesting how some people who quickly accepted red dot optics on pistols are very skeptical on new-tech bullets.
124gr +P GDHP is what I carry, and it works well on my Glocks and Sigs handguns.
I like Gold Dots 147gr and Federal HST 147gr too.
I watched it, even Andrew agrees at the 9:00 "while it looks cool it doesnt really prove anything" https://youtu.be/FWgXc9L9vx0?t=543
The video conclusion's is that its still a big question mark whether this wounding mechanism actually translates to real world performance. Im not sure how this relates to red dots on pistols, red dots pistols have been around for almost 2 decades in the competition world, and they only hit the main stream about 5 years ago?
Im pretty open minded to new tech if there is sufficient data to back something up, but there isnt in this case. Remember 4.6mm and Five-Seven also produce pretty dramatic temporary stretch cavities and no one is writing home about their spectacular real world performance.
I've attended a considerable number of autopsies and seen the end result of handgun ammunition on human flesh. When it comes to ammunition, I want to know how it performs in the field. I don't care about temporary wound cavity, bullet weight or bullet velocity. I want to know the track record of the cartridge. The key question is "how fast did the violent attacker stop after being shot with the cartridge?" You cannot collect that data on the autopsy table or from the medical community. It has to come from people who use the ammunition in a fight and competent witnesses.
Once a significant amount of real-world data is collected, I'll consider a cartridge for defensive carry. Time will tell if Mr. Wilson's LeHigh cartridge is a fight stopper.
I'm only mildly interested in the stretch cavity performance of the Lehigh bullet.
If it cuts a hole as well as a jhp but does so while possessing the other advantages it has that's good enough for me.
I
As someone who carried FMJ ammo for years, and still got the job done with our 9mm firearms. I am not sweating it much. I will note that my carry pistol and PDW (soon) is in 357 sig, which is substantially faster than the 9mm. I really have to get out and shoot something alive with the 357 sig.
My brain tells me that 2200-2300 fps, is well 2200-2300fps, and that even without the flutes must produce a lot more damage than a 9mm at 1100-1200 fps.
but