Even under the new rules a gun trust is still worth it to prevent your firearms from ever being effectively banned. As long as your descendants keep the trust up, your scary guns will be legal forever.
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As has been posted several times, criminals and/or 'criminal organizations' don't register ANYTHING with the BATFE. They are criminals not fools and providing direct evidence of their participation in a crime is not high on their 'To Do' list. Do criminals do stupid things - like driving their own car with the license plates registered to them still clearly visible? Yes they do, but that is out of 'routine' or habit. Willfully tying themselves to a firearm that they might use in a crime? Come'on!
That said, we can thank our 'friends' at the National Firearms Act Trade and Collectors Association (cited by name in the final rule) and fired LAPD Officer Christopher Dorner, who in Feb 2013 launched a 'vendetta' against LEOs using NFA firearms that were transferred via a trust (a SBR and a suppressor as I recall) for the new rules AND for the unending lectures from the politicians. Both provided the nexus between criminals using trusts to obtain NFA weapons/devices.
That doesn't make it a fact, however.
MikeN
You concerns have zero to do with you getting a sign off or Trust.
Don't let Obama's lies slow your exercising of your legal rights. If he were not lying, the MSM would be plastered with stories of criminals using Trusts. Obama thinks he's a fancy lawyer pleading to a jury. He's a perverse little twit. The only thing he has accomplished in 8 years is that he can now sit through an interview without a teleprompter and his suits look as nice as Jay-Z. Which is pretty much all he ever hoped for. He just wanted to be the cool guy and never hesitates to tell everyone. "Hey I taught Constitutional Law, I know a thing or two about it." Well no Barack, just because you teach it, doesn't mean you really get it. Lot's of screwed up teachers in the USA.... "I won two elections"... Yes Barack we know... Now you are the same twit you have always been but your suits are much much nicer.
Have you ever heard the MSM reporting about all the criminals using Trusts? The crime being committed through Trusts? The NFA firearms used in crimes? Don't you think the headlines would be absolutely plastered with that info if it were true?
You simply need to determine which type legal document will best serve your legal rights. A Trust is a tool that helps you and other Trustees while you are alive as well as others after you are dead. A will, pretty much just offloads your junk after you die. It's not a vehicle for current affairs. A Trust can be a vehicle for current affairs.
IOW, all the lies and deceptions of the left have nothing to do with whether you get a sign off or Trust. You decision is a matter of legal family planning under your legal rights. The left will continue to tell lies until the cows come home. That's not a concern in your decision. That's a concern next November.
The batfe did not produce one instance of a prohibited person using a trust to obtain an NFA item when a FOIA request was submitted
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I remember reading about one case in the Midwest recently. But I can't recall the details.
Out of all of my previous FA purchases under my trust each & every one went thru a 4473 before taking delivery on stamp day.
If you do, I'd love to hear any details. I'm in Northwest Indiana (NWI), and we're pretty free. However, I'd like to stay on top of the "evidence" either way.
To the individual asking about the Colt 6933, www.gandrtactical.com has them listed on their site (site sponsor here, I thought?). I have assumed that they are in stock. Hasn't mattered directly to me, as I'm a little way from moving forward with a purchase.
To everyone, thank you for your replies. It would seem that there is a severe lack of evidence to support our wonderful president's position, which seems to be an eight year trend.
I'd wager that there are more law abiding folks out there in possession of illegal SBR's due to complete ignorance of NFA laws than there are criminals going through the hassle of using trusts to aquire NFA items illegally. Frankly, if criminals were using suppressors in the commission of their crimes you can pretty much garauntee that the gun control crowd would be publicizing it in an attempt to further their agenda.
Frankly if you are interested in setting up a trust its still a great route to go. Even if the new ATF ruling goes through and you have to submit the extra paperwork for each person, they're still a great tool for estate planning when it comes to any NFA items you may collect before your death. Going the individual route makes that much harder.
Lastly, I think the only way to check and see if something is in stock with Grant is to try and add it to your shopping cart. If the item is out of stock it will give you an error message. He's been having the 6933's listed for a while but I doubt he has any stock left. Hopefully Colt will have a production run sometime this year.
Right, that's the law. Theoretically with a trust though you could have 10 co-trustees on the trust who aren't legally permitted to use the NFA item (convicted felon, haven't passed extra FBI bg check, etc) and they could carry the trust item with paperwork and LEO/BATFE are probably never going to question it.
In reality though, the chances of criminals doing this seems quite low. They typically just carry what they want how they want, regardless of what the law is.
I would wager that it's far more likely that criminals are working for corporations who are allowed legal use of NFA type items and never getting the full vetting that ma and pa kettle's trust is the source of funneling "illegal" weapons to prohibited persons.
BS on the instance of theoretical abuse. Any decent LEO who comes across someone arousing suspicion is not going to just trust their word saying they are good to go while handing them some special price of paper. They are going to look that person up in their own system, run their background and arrest record on them and depending on the results will consider the paper work in light of their search if they even know what a trust and NFA laws are. If not they will likely call ATF and or superiors and rely on their own system even more. Either way you can surely bet that if his search comes back with felony convictions that trustee is not walking away with his SBR and paperwork in hand. The whole premise 41p is based on is contrived. Trusts do nothing legally to make an ineligible person eligible, in that instance all that has taken place is the implication of the settlor in the crime of supplying weapons to inelligable persons.