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Before anyone gets on my case about scientific method, or the fact that the Lancer has a warning included with it, or why anyone would ever spray 100% deet on a magazine...
The warning is exactly what led me to this test. I read it, and was curious how the other two magazines on the market would do with deet. I'm intentionally trying to saturate these things to the point of failure. I've hosed them off with water, hit them with the compressor, and will be re-soaking them tonight, tomorrow night, and Saturday night and then using them as my first loads and as often as possible over the course of a 3-day class this weekend.
More to follow.
Nice test, I like my Lancers and I would'nt even use DEET myself, I prefer permethrin. But I might just have to do that to one of my Lancers, just because it looks cool. I'll throw in a Thermold and Orlite. Awesome post! Oh, and it's nice to see folks put Lancers through the same kind of tests Lancer puts them through. I'm gonna' do a series this winter on how they perform in the cold and wet.
Interesting test: thanks for going through with it.
For skin application, I've switched over to picaridin. It's safe for plastics and although I don't spend a lot of time in places that require bug spray, it kept me bite free on a week long trip into the mountains and otherwise hasn't let me down so far. I can't vouch that it is just as effective as DEET, but it's plenty effective for my needs.
I was always curious as to what DEET would actually do to the Lancer mags. Thanks for sharing.
I'd be interested to see the same test repeated with loaded magazines. A load within will impart stress to material that may produce earlier or differential failure.
They will all be getting re-sprayed tonight, wiped off in the morning, and loaded. They will get used tomorrow as much as I can get a chance to load them.
Obviously, the Lancer is out of the test.
FWIW, the windows on the Pmags are already gummy and fogging. The paper towels I used to wipe them off with stuck, and the air hose caused some odd effects.
Cool test, thanks for posting it.
I'd be curious to see the effects of deet on the feed lips while the mags are fully loaded and the springs under compression... I wonder how much quicker the lips on the Lancer would have failed?
Could you do a test of DEET on carboned up bolts? You might be onto to something here!
Nice test.
This is exactly how it happens in the real world of soldiering. You put some extra mags in you pack along with some other personal items. And, at least some of the time you will open your pack to find that something has busted open, leaked, spilled, or melted.
I saw a partially dissolved M18 Claymore that got soaked in hydraulic fluid. If you work with vehicles, diesel fuel is a constant threat. I had a jar of mama's jam bust open in my pack one time. Melted Powerbars are always a given. Hand cream likes to leak. CLP can be leaky too depending on the type of bottle. And, of course the ever leaky bug juice.
At this point I have developed a keen eye for what will leak and try to double wrap it in a ziplock bag. Of course, there is always some poor bastard who will open his pack at the end of the day to find that something exploded in his ruck.
I can't wait to see how these mags shoot after that treatment.
Wonder how long it would have gone if the mag was full
At least you will not have any bugs in your work bench area for a while.
:cool:
I was hoping to buy some lancer mags.... but this... makes me wana buy just pmags:(
I've always thought milspec chemical tests were a bit extreme, but you make a good point. I would not personally choose my magazines based on chemical compatibility alone (DEET or otherwise), but it's good to know how the materials react to common chemicals they might come in contact with. All else being equal I suppose I'd take whichever product performs best against the bug spray, gasoline, CLP, etc.
Another thing I have noticed about Lancer mags is the mag catch recess is a bit shallow for my taste. It won't reliably hold a Lula Loader.
Interesting experiment/test here. Looking forward to further "developments" after the 3-Day excercise! :cool:
Yeah, DEET is some caustic stuff. I wonder how long it would take a mag to break down when soaked in Coca-Cola :D
On a serious note, I don't use DEET so it's a total non-issue for me (my bug spray usually consists of garlic pills and a spray can in the field). Frankly, it's a breath of fresh air that Lancer even said, "Don't get DEET on the mags" in the first place. I think a lot of companies wouldn't even bother with that caveat as to sell more magazines.
Hmm, this should be tried out on other polymer/plastic products like USGI followers, I'd be interested to see if those break down like some others do.
(This kind of reminds me of when I had a bottle of Montana copper-killer burst inside my ammo can of cleaning gear, haha)
I happened to have a loose x39 round in the bottom of the can... You can guess what happened to it :D (along with my brushes and my bore snake and a whole bunch of other shit...)
When I opened the can, I smelled it immediately and knew what happened (who doesn't know that smell?). I just shut that bastard and took care of it the next day (it was late and I didn't have time to hose out the ****er at 2:30 in the morning).
I've managed to destroy several Suuntos and Chacos with Deet. Chacos completely delaminated soles from Deet soaking into the webbing slots:mad:
I really try and just tolerate Skeeters when I can:eek:
In the Army, I stayed the hell away from DEET and used Avon's Skin so soft! My wife liked it better too.:D
I had to constantly spray the stuff on which was ok but DEET was terrible and I refuse to use it still.
I see some folks here mentioning other chemicals or sprays and I might look into it.
Anyone, know what effect Skin so soft has on PMAGS?:D
Ugh, this reminds me of the time a bottle of bore solvent burst in one of those cheap cleaning kits. Melted the plastic, and everything fused together. Only $15, oh well.
Ooops, one too many I's.
http://www.google.com/search?q=israe...rlz=1I7GGIH_en
So how did the test go Rob?
Pmags are still plugging along. I stopped re-spraying them because it just seemed pointless.
the TD mags were sidelined because they don't appear to like to work well with the 75 grain Wolf ammo I shoot, so other than the fact that they haven't exploded I can't comment on them.
I may try to chip the damaged plastic off the windows on the Pmags and re-spray but I haven't gotten to it yet.
Thanks for the update. Seems like Pmags are the way to go, no matter what....
Great repost. I love my lancers for range work - past this i am impressed the pmags still are it! And I use a lot of Deet!
now i know my pmags will serve me fine when I fight Aliens with acid blood
This was an old wives's tale / myth / scam - sort of like thinking Baking Soda removes refrigerator odors, or Airborne prevents or reduces the duration of a cold. It was professionally debunked 18 years ago. Unless you mean Skin So Soft bug repellent, which is actually bug repellant. They made that after people kept on thinking their standard product had an effect on Mosquitos - so they made a product they could legitimately market for that purpose.
http://www.snopes.com/oldwives/skeeters.asp
Consumer Report's test took tanks filled with Mosquitos and people put their arms in, and then they counted the number of bites over time. Absolutely nothing but DEET worked in any significant way.
If you use non-DEET bug spray, you have to constantly re-apply it.
DEET compatibility is a very important thing for the military, and for the Individual Carbine solicitation, each company needs to provide 30 samples of each type of plastic on your weapon specifically so that they can test it for things like this.
http://www.fmeainfocentre.com/fences...;s%20Guide.PDF
http://npic.orst.edu/factsheets/DEETgen.pdf
http://npic.orst.edu/factsheets/DEETtech.pdf
http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa011699
http://img716.imageshack.us/img716/9...10416at113.png
As you can see, the proper application of DEET is 29 times more effective than Skin So Soft with Bug Guard added, over 100 times more effective than ordinary Skin So Soft, and more than 1500 times more effective than the least effective wrist-ban product.
Deep Woods Off is the best mosquito repellant and I can't imagine seeing this test and picking anything else.
You had better make sure that you aren't going out into much sunlight with Deep Woods Off though; I put some of that stuff on one day (it was all I had available at the time) and went in and out of the woods into open sunlight . . . big mistake. That stuff will burn you if you're not careful. :cray: