Aimpoint, Aimpoint & magnifier, or ACOG w/ Doc

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11-13-09, 16:40
Alaskapopo

Quote:

Originally Posted by C4IGrant

If I am not mistaken, once you put a magnified optic on your gun, you have to qual as a sniper?

That would be highly dependent on the department. No department in my state has a regulation like that. Now pretty much all of the departments that I am aware of up here require you to qualify with your iron sights in addition to your optic. Every department can have different rules and regs. As for needing a magnifier for LEO work like I said before most of the time it would not be necessary but some times it can be very handy. It also depends on rather you are working in a rural or urban setting.
Pat
11-13-09, 20:51
Submariner

Me, too.

Quote:

Originally Posted by rob_s

If I was going to use an ACOG (of the type that they attach the DR. to) I would put an Aimpoint T-1 on an offset mount out front instead.
...
I vote RDS with tip-over AND removable magnifier.

Even though I agree with rob_s, the H-1 on an LT-724 works well in close, particularly when we train to go to the Aimpoint first. I could not stand to sell the TA31F at market price. This made keeping it worthwhile. Best of both worlds. YMMV.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...ot56/M2003.jpg
11-13-09, 21:52
UrbanRunner

Based on much of the feedback here and on thoughts of how I would be deploying this weapon I'm leaning towards option #1 - an Aimpoint. I'll need to give the specific model some more thought. One consideration that I had not included in my original list was a short dot option.

After reading the feedback in this thread:
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=4209

From USMC03, "The Short Dot gives the end user almost the same capabilities as an Aimpoint and an ACOG in one optic."

The S&B short dot would seem like an excellent option other than the $$$$
11-13-09, 23:37
Singlestack Wonder

Quote:

Originally Posted by UrbanRunner

Based on much of the feedback here and on thoughts of how I would be deploying this weapon I'm leaning towards option #1 - an Aimpoint. I'll need to give the specific model some more thought. One consideration that I had not included in my original list was a short dot option.

After reading the feedback in this thread:
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=4209

From USMC03, "The Short Dot gives the end user almost the same capabilities as an Aimpoint and an ACOG in one optic."

The S&B short dot would seem like an excellent option other than the $$$$

Take a look at the Trijicon TR24's...sorta the best of both worlds...
11-14-09, 00:45
Alaskapopo

The TR24 is a great scope. I wish they (Trijicon) would add one of their ACOG reticles to it. That is the only thing missing from an otherwise great optic. A bullet drop compensator. How hard could it be.
Pat
11-14-09, 00:56
patriot_man

Quote:

Originally Posted by Submariner

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...ot56/M2003.jpg

This gets a +1

Having an optic mounted on top of an optic makes a large offset from the bore. This reduces the offset while you have both unmagnified and magnified optics. I find that an ACOG will be better than any optic + magnifier. Might as well have both ACOG and red dot.
11-14-09, 09:49
JSantoro

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alaskapopo

The TR24 is a great scope. I wish they (Trijicon) would add one of their ACOG reticles to it. That is the only thing missing from an otherwise great optic. A bullet drop compensator. How hard could it be.

Agreed. I've fallen in love with their horseshoe reticle, particularly in green. Fingers crossed that that is a future option. I'd be all over that like stink on poo.
11-14-09, 09:51
rob_s

Quote:

Originally Posted by C4IGrant

TA33 series for magnified.

Yep. 3x, better eye relief, lighter, smaller.... better than the standard ACOG IMHO.
11-14-09, 12:07
gjj

I had the ACOG + T1 in the Larue mount as shown above. I didn't like it. I sold the T1. The ACOG (TA11) remains on my gun.

Why?

I think having two possible sights on a gun slows you down. When you mount the gun in a dynamic environment (for me this is hunting), you hestitate because your brain has to decide "which sight will I use?" This adds an addition decision path into what should just be a situation where you mount the gun and shoot. I found this happen over and over again hunting jackrabbits. Usually, I am walking in the desert and they unexpectedly take off just a few feet away. You get startled and are trying to get on target as the rabbit runs in and out of your line of sight behind bushes. This has many of the same characteristics of a real SHTF scenario ... surprise, dynamic movement, target obstruction. Having two sighting choices makes things much worse.

After I sold it, I was doing some research and learned my experience was not new or revolutionary. It is explained in Hicks Law.

Hick’s Law, started out as a paper written in 1952 and simply set up an equation that states the mind takes time to decide between options. For the record, the equation is TR+a+b{Log2 (N)}. Another famous police trainer mentioning Hick's law said:
“Lag time increases significantly with the greater number of techniques.”

The bottom line is that I find the ACOG as fast as the T1 up close. In situations where I can't see the reticle, I will point shoot.

P.S. This same effect also applies to having a 3X magnifier. Your brain goes through the same limiting decision loop ... "magnifier in or out?" This slows you down.
11-14-09, 13:01
sovereign

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alaskapopo

The TR24 is a great scope. I wish they (Trijicon) would add one of their ACOG reticles to it. That is the only thing missing from an otherwise great optic. A bullet drop compensator. How hard could it be.
Pat

It must be pretty damn hard, because people have been asking for it for years.

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