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Thread: "Fast" AR

  1. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Surf View Post
    A few more thoughts.

    Rob, I would say that your set ups above would do well as a competition rifle and your top rifle mirrors my dedicated set up pretty darn close but again I will mention that I am not a competition shooter, but (out)shoot with them often enough.

    For myself on a true critical use rifle, I am not that comfortable or completely sold with the durability of many of the minimalist tubes on the market that I have used but I have yet to try a few of the newest designs however. I am sure with design development my mind will change. For my own personal feelings a critical use rifle will have a fixed FSB despite the arguments over durability of modern optics, etc, etc...

    I have both an 18" intermediate length Noveske SS SPR barrel and a 16" midlength SS Noveske LW profile barrel. I personally prefer the 16" mid for weight and length savings and it is damn accurate enough to do what I need it to do out past competition distances. I really wouldn't have too much of an issue with a 14.5 either, other than the fact that I wanted the LW profile of the 16".

    I have no concerns with the Vltor A5 on a critical use rifle, but I am not sold that I gained any benefit on performance.

    EOTech EXPS, well I am an EOTech fan. I am of the camp that loves the ret. Use the 65 MOA ring like a big dot up close, small 1 MOA dot for precision, 6 oclock hash for precision at a specific close distance. Use it for ranging and for engaging moving targets at various distances & speeds. Durability has been good in the 553's and no issues that I have noted in the XPS line ups.

    After running the MBK, Titan and Rolling Thunder, I really do prefer the BC, go figure? I also find that it is the only acceptable device for critical use.

    BAD lever. Been running them for years, even on all of my critical use rifles. On a gaming gun, I can't see how it is not a clear advantage? There is no denying that even a highly proficient shooter can shave at least a couple tenths on reloads. If it works or is reliable on a rifle, it flat out works. The device really seems to have lost its flavor for some reason. No big deal as I was running them before they ever became the device du jour on the market or before they even hit the commercial market period.

    As far as an ambi-lever goes, they go on almost all of my carbines.

    On a critical use rifle the S3G is a no go IMO, too darn light. An SSA would be acceptable, but again as I always say a nice USGI is just as capable.
    Some of the things you mention are exactly the kinds of things I want to test. For example, I want to run the same gun with the S3G and the GI (as I think you've done) and quantify the gains. I also want to shoot both guns at some amount of distance and see if the lighter trigger gives me tighter groups. Similar for pretty much all of the parts, but I also want to do a sum of the parts thing.

    I think the Noveske, DD, and possibly the Geiselle Brazilian handguards may address some of the mounting concerns that you and I share with the first-gen tubes.

  2. #82
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    Anyone want to speculate on which would be softer shooting (and hopefully therefore faster, since I'm not sure of any other benefits of softer shooting), a KAC SR15 with Triple Tap and A5 or the same lower with a 14.5" mid-length and Battlecomp?

    interesting thread/thoughts as usual, rob

    I have been using a KAC SR15 with triple tap and micro T1 since they first came out as my "HD"/class carbine. And I have gone through several 3gun rifles, trying the different stuff.

    My previous dedicated game gun was carbon fiber upper and lower receiver, and hand guard
    17" rifle gas with titanium muzzle brake (carbon fiber barrel)
    JP fire control and their aluminum bolt carrier
    pneumatic buffer
    micro T1

    It was amazingly 'fast' target to target, but the extremely low overall weight offset some of the go fast parts. While it was "reliable" (no malfunctions in class or a year of matches), it was not "durable" (cf receiver wore out, and i don't think the aluminum bolt carrier would have lasted much longer)

    My latest dedicated game gun is 18" rifle gas with standard weight (.750 past gas block), and muzzle brake
    SD3G trigger
    vtac round hand guard
    z6i 1-6x
    UBR

    honestly, it outshoots the SR15/TT in all respects, including the "smooth" category, but not by a wide margin. my splits on the same target are faster, but, it's slower target to target than the carbon fiber game gun was or the SR15. (more accurate too...)
    I will say the SR15/TT is a pleasure to shoot and the softest 16" I have shot.


    for HD, my new project is a
    noveske 10" upper with switchblock,
    delta p designs mini brevis suppressor
    SD3G trigger
    UBR

    if pics are helpful, i'll be happy to add them.


    regarding "tactical" vs "gamer"
    just my opinion, but I'd wager money my latest dedicated game gun would hold its own against my 6920 in any test I can imagine that stops short of needing chrome lining in the barrel to pass. It's plenty tactical, except for the overall length and weight. Now that SPRs are popular, I guess that doesn't matter so much either. ....perhaps the z6i 1-6x is not as robust as the micro T1 though ....and I only go outdoors when it's over 70* so if 18" rifle gas is unreliable in the cold, i wouldn't know.

  3. #83
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  4. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by trinydex View Post
    It should be noted that, even though Haley could easily outshoot the vast, vast majority of us with a stock carbine, most of his weapons have Surefire muzzle brakes on them.

  5. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by justin_247 View Post
    It should be noted that, even though Haley could easily outshoot the vast, vast majority of us with a stock carbine, most of his weapons have Surefire muzzle brakes on them.
    Since we can't really see the muzzle brake, I think it's more interesting that's a 300blk gun.

  6. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by archad View Post
    What scope is that?

    Edit - never mind, IOR 1 & 4x32 Pitbull Tactical 35mm Rifle Scope
    Last edited by Canonshooter; 04-28-12 at 16:08.

  7. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by trinydex View Post
    Exactly what I was going to post after reading through this thread.

  8. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by trinydex View Post
    Yeah........that's pure badass fast!

    Really like to see what kind of hits on the target he acheived on that string.
    Scoby


    “Laws that forbid the carrying of arms disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes. Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man.”Thomas Jefferson, quoting 18th century criminologist Cesare Beccaria in “On Crimes and Punishment”, 1764

  9. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoby View Post
    Yeah........that's pure badass fast!

    Really like to see what kind of hits on the target he acheived on that string.
    All to the head...

  10. #90
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    For all the mention about "accessories" making faster, I'm a bit surprised no one has addressed gas-port.

    Perhaps being a bit myopic because of a struggle with a 12.5" CHF Centurion barrel upper, having used a crazy amount of combinations of buffer-weights and springs trying it to get it to eat "underpowered" (russian steel case etc) ammo, to no avail whatsoever.........., but:
    This 12.5" upper is extremely "soft" (little recoil) shooting with 5.56 ammo - making it inherently "fast".
    All due to the size of the gas-port, which is a major factor in the performance of a rifle.

    So much so that at this point I have come to believe that, besides quality of barrel & BCG, the next most important item is gas-port.

    Before this build I completed a 16" CHF Centurion barrel w a VLTOR upper, 11" Troy slick rail making it very light weight, on a Noveske gen2 lower, ST-T2 buffer and CAR spring, Geissele SSA trigger group, and was very surprised with how exceptionally little recoil it had and how flat it shot - almost unreal.
    My frame of reference for all above would be my go to rifle, Noveske N4 16" rifle, same trigger group and rail. (With both barrels a Rainier XTC comp)

    In all brutal honesty there is a world of difference between these two mentioned rifles, with the gas-port being the one and only real significant variable factor.

    All this, however is of relatively little value without training and experience, as others have mentioned and having witnessed for myself, any decent plain-off-the-shelf-stock-rig will be exponentially "faster" in the hands of someone like Defoor or Haley, et al.

    PS
    Caveat, just in case - the 12.5" Centurion barreled upper shoots exceptionally reliable with 5.56 ammo, any of it, for which it is designed.
    The fact it won't eat crappy .223 ammo, for which it is NOT designed, is in no way a detractor of it's superior quality, just something stupid i am trying to make it do.
    Like putting a Ferrari-engine in a Yugo and bitchin when it won't roll.
    Per Ardua ad Astra.
    STS - gone but not forgotten.

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