Anyone moving towards a 1911?

[Leonidas77]

I know there's a 1911 forum, but I've posted this here to get feedback from people who might not be die-hard 1911 fans.

Recently, I had a friend ask me about buying a new ccw handgun. He asked which one was best to get. That's a difficult question to answer, so I asked him what features were most important. He said ergonomics, reliability, and it must be chambered in 9mm.

I thought about the features he wanted and it made the question more difficult to answer. Given the problems Glock and Sig have had, I wasn't going to recommend them. He had a M&P, but didn't like it. I finally suggested a PPQ. A few days later he called to tell me he bought the PPQ and that it shot great. The only downside for the PPQ is the availability of mags and their prices.

His experience got me to wondering if I'm looking at things the wrong way. I currently carry an older G19. The gun is perfect for my needs. But what if something breaks? Will the newly manufactured Glock parts affect my perfectly reliable carry piece? Or what about my HKs? Parts are often hard to come by and usually expensive for HKs. Plus, there aren't many people who can work on an HK. What happens if something breaks on them?

My point is this: At any given moment I can go online or even to the local gunstore and buy quality 1911 parts at decent prices from a number of manufacturers. Most of the parts I could install myself. But if the need arose, any gunsmith in my area could work on my 1911. I am not tied to any one company with their ups and downs in product quality or parts availability. Neither am I completely at the mercy of one company's customer service.

Has anyone else thought about this?

[Tzook]

This whole thing about Glock issues is being blown waaaaayyy out of proportion. There are 10 million different companies that make parts for Glocks, if you break an extractor or something, you won't have too difficult of a time finding a quality part to replace it.

But, I do see real value in the 1911 platform. You can't beat the ergonomics, and in my experience, in an environment where 1911's can be kept reasonably clean and have maintenance preformed on them they'll out preform anything else.

They also carry surprisingly well for their size

[jwperry]

I have and tried it.
Then I realized a 1911 is a big piece of steel, that even in my favoritist of holsters was noticeably heavy. It is also a pretty big pistol. The spare mags were super easy to conceal though.

[Meplat]

As another poster stated, the issue with Glocks is being blown out of proportion. And, in my opinion, it usually is blown out of proportion with every gun. Try to keep in mind that these incidents are exceptions to a generality or rule, they are not rules or generalities themselves. Unfortunately, it usually seems the opposite to people because you go onto the internet to a forum, one like this forum, and you will see problem threads and troubleshooting threads for EVERY pistol buried somewhere in its pages. And somewhere you might find a review about a guy who bought one and it worked fine, but for the most part you will only find problem threads. Why? Well, not everyone is going to run to the internet to update everyone about their pistol that worked just fine, like it should. On the other hand, people are more likely to report and share problems with a community to help diagnose and find an answer.

So, it quickly looks like you have 10 problem threads to one or two review threads where the gun actually works. The statistic unnerves people and makes them lose confidence in their gun. Go around long enough on forums searching for problems for any pistol and I guarantee, before long, you'll come to the conclusion that no pistol currently manufactured is suitable to even be a paperweight, much less a defensive carry gun.

The important thing to remember is that these are not rules, they are exceptions. Find a pistol from a manufacturer with a decent and established reputation and a model with a decent and established track record. Make sure the company has at least a one year warranty and has a decent track record and reputation for customer service and go from there. Nobody can guarantee any pistol is going to be 100% out of the box, but that is far more likely than you getting a lemon. And any company that is at least halfway decent will replace, fix, or send you the parts necessary to make your gun work until you're satisfied. You'll have to decide yourself whether that's a Glock, an H&K, an M&P, or even a 1911 or anything else.

Edit: As far as parts go, things break. You're not going to find a gun that will never need parts replacement, just as you will never find a car that doesn't need its oil changed and some basic care and maintenance once in a while. The important thing here is to find out what parts are common for needing replacement, snagging a few spares for the ugn, and keeping track of how much you fire and when to replace these parts.

[avengd7x]

As another poster stated, the issue with Glocks is being blown out of proportion. And, in my opinion, it usually is blown out of proportion with every gun. Try to keep in mind that these incidents are exceptions to a generality or rule, they are not rules or generalities themselves. Unfortunately, it usually seems the opposite to people because you go onto the internet to a forum, one like this forum, and you will see problem threads and troubleshooting threads for EVERY pistol buried somewhere in its pages. And somewhere you might find a review about a guy who bought one and it worked fine, but for the most part you will only find problem threads. Why? Well, not everyone is going to run to the internet to update everyone about their pistol that worked just fine, like it should. On the other hand, people are more likely to report and share problems with a community to help diagnose and find an answer.

So, it quickly looks like you have 10 problem threads to one or two review threads where the gun actually works. The statistic unnerves people and makes them lose confidence in their gun. Go around long enough on forums searching for problems for any pistol and I guarantee, before long, you'll come to the conclusion that no pistol currently manufactured is suitable to even be a paperweight, much less a defensive carry gun.

The important thing to remember is that these are not rules, they are exceptions. Find a pistol from a manufacturer with a decent and established reputation and a model with a decent and established track record. Make sure the company has at least a one year warranty and has a decent track record and reputation for customer service and go from there. Nobody can guarantee any pistol is going to be 100% out of the box, but that is far more likely than you getting a lemon. And any company that is at least halfway decent will replace, fix, or send you the parts necessary to make your gun work until you're satisfied. You'll have to decide yourself whether that's a Glock, an H&K, an M&P, or even a 1911 or anything else.

Edit: As far as parts go, things break. You're not going to find a gun that will never need parts replacement, just as you will never find a car that doesn't need its oil changed and some basic care and maintenance once in a while. The important thing here is to find out what parts are common for needing replacement, snagging a few spares for the ugn, and keeping track of how much you fire and when to replace these parts.

I agree with most of what you've said, but I've also been thinking a lot about what the op is asking.

I have quite a few glocks, but the only ones I carry and keep loaded at night are my gen 2 ones. my gen 3 19 hits me in the face with brass and to me that's a problem because I find myself sometimes flinching in anticipation of getting hit.

my gen 2s have never given me a problem, but they have thousands of rounds through them and I've wondered about replacement parts on a gun from the early 90s.

[okie john]

At any given moment I can go online or even to the local gunstore and buy quality 1911 parts at decent prices from a number of manufacturers. Most of the parts I could install myself. But if the need arose, any gunsmith in my area could work on my 1911. I am not tied to any one company with their ups and downs in product quality or parts availability. Neither am I completely at the mercy of one company's customer service.

I dearly love the 1911. I grew up shooting them in bullseye competition, and carried them when I was in the military. But there are better choices now, for the exact reasons you cited, plus a lot of others that I won't belabor.

There's a big difference between installing parts on a 1911 and fitting them properly so the gun is safe and reliable. Yes, your gunsmith MIGHT be able to work on a 1911, but very few smiths really understand the finer points of making one run 100%. The occasional hitch is OK for a range gun, but not for a concealed-carry piece that sees a realistic training regimen.

On the other hand, Glock parts truly are are drop-in, and if you have to be tied to one company for parts and service, you could do a hell of a lot worse than Glock.

Finally, you can buy several Glocks for the price of a proper 1911.


Okie John

[Leonidas77]

I would by no means recommend a 1911 for everyone, but I believe there is a place for them, especially for people willing to learn the platform.

I also don't believe 1911s require some special gunsmith with black magic skills in order to be made reliable. A local gunsmith might not be able to build a 1911 on par with Wilson, Nighthawk, etc, but he should be able to tension an extractor or replace a broken part if you can't do it yourself.

I agree that the Glock problems are probably blown out of proportion, but that doesn't matter when you have a $500 paperweight.

For all of the 1911's drawbacks, it does offer you a wide array of parts and a larger pool of people who can work on the platform. While I'll continue to carry my G19, I think I'll still keep my 1911.

[Pistol Shooter]

My first handgun purchase was a Colt MKIV Series '70 Government Model in 1975 when I was 21 yrs. old.

I love the 1911 platform but over the years I've searched for something as totally reliable as possible with different kinds of HP ammo.

Several years ago, (after I bought a problematic Colt Combat Commander XSE) I came to the conclusion that HK pistols were the answer for me.

LAV makes a great point about 1911's in this link:

http://militarytimes.com/blogs/gears...ur-first-1911/

[TiroFijo]

If I wanted a reliable pistol out of the box, with OEM mags and drop-in parts everywhere, all at a very affordable price, I would pick a Gen 3 glock 17/19. It is truly the world standard for a service pistol.

I know how to do basic work on a 1911 and mantain it, I've shot maaany thousands of rounds with them, and I really like the design. But with these same limitations, the 1911 would probably be the last pistol I would pick.

[Leonidas77]

Guys,

I don't believe the 1911 will ever be as reliable or as easy to maintain as a HK or Glock. I carry a glock for a reason. But does anyone consider the fact that at any given moment parts could become nonexistent because of problems with the manufacturer?

Consider if the same were true for rifles. Imagine if there were only one manufacturer making parts and doing repairs for the M4 platform. I think that would concern some people. That's exactly the case for SIG, HK, Walther, and Glock to a lesser degree.

All I'm asking is if anyone considers this fact and chooses to keep a 1911 around for that very reason i.e. parts availability and variety of parts manufacturers.