Target Heart Rate and burnig fat?

[Low Drag]

Hello everyone, I'm looking for a little help here. I hope someone has actual experience with this either as a trainer who has worked with people or someone who was actually in the same boat.

I've got back into road biking a few years back and have loved it. I live in the Denver area, it's a fantastic place to ride. I have only done recreational cycling, never raced or had any training outside of reading. I have a chronic form of leukemia that is manageable but keeps my blood levels low, mostly the white blood cells but also red and hemoglobin.

I am 50 years old and a big guy 6'1" and about 245# now, in my best shape I was 215# (when in the Marines - when I got into cycling the first time) so 190# is not in my future. I am trying to drop weight, I decrease my food intake off the bike, increase the pace, distance etc and I get nearly no results. I've done centuries the past 4 years with some pretty aggressive climbing (read interval work). As I train for the 100 mile event I'm increasing my distance each week. I've learned to eat while riding on long rides and soon after, the alternative is miserable (replace glycogen). I cut back the calories when not riding or on days when I'm doing 25 miles or less.

OK, enough background. I got a cycling computer with heart rate monitor and tried it out yesterday. I found that my "comfortable" speed/work level was well over my 70% - 80% of max heart rate to burn fat. Have I stumbled upon my problem? Is that magic 75% of your max heart rate the place to be for loosing fat? I could tell by the way I felt that I have the same "feeling" when I run, basically way over that 75% target.

So, does working out above that 75% heart rate make it difficult to lose weight? Is the whole 75% of max heart rate for fat lose thing snake oil? Does anyone have first hand info?

Thanks in advance.

[OdinIII]

I don't have anything to add other than to say that your post reminded me that I need to get a heart rate monitor and quit guessing how hard I'm pushing.

Good luck.

[bp7178]

At the end of the day, calories out has to be more than calories in. There is a metabolic effect to heart rate, but I don't think that's your problem. IMO, the target heartrate thing applies more to beginners than people who train often.

It sounds like you just got really good at riding. Your body is probably very tuned to it. Same thing happens to runners. As you progress, your body begins to dial into what you are doing, everything becomes more efficient.

I would take up running, or start doing some cross training...hell, if you have the bike, which if you have good equipment is very costly, go the triathlon route.

There is no reason you can't be 190lbs if that is your goal. 50 years old doesn't mean shit. Don't give yourself excuses why you can't do something.

[dookie1481]

Calories in/calories out will determine weight loss. You will generally burn more fat at a lower intensity that a higher intensity due to making fat burning pathways more efficient.

http://www.markallenonline.com/maoArticles.aspx?AID=2

[WillBrink]

Is that magic 75% of your max heart rate the place to be for loosing fat? .

No. Intensity is more important and the "fat burning zone" debunked a long time ago by physiologists. See:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zHol-hIJNx8

Consider adding in some form of resistance training to your program
start tracking calories and macros (if not doing so) and eat what's needed for your activity levels and goals.
Make sure your not deficient in any essential vites etc, (and your medical condition may increase likely hood you are) and discuss with docs use of multi vite, source of EFAs (like fsh oil), etc
Consider having a full hormonal/metabolic panel done

Good luck.

[Low Drag]

OK, so the 75% of max sounds like Keynesian Economics. Much has been written about it, it is repeated as "the way" but no one that anyone knows has actually achieved positive results from it.

So, what is a heart rate monitor for then? More snake oil?

[Low Drag]

At the end of the day, calories out has to be more than calories in. There is a metabolic effect to heart rate, but I don't think that's your problem. IMO, the target heartrate thing applies more to beginners than people who train often.

It sounds like you just got really good at riding. Your body is probably very tuned to it. Same thing happens to runners. As you progress, your body begins to dial into what you are doing, everything becomes more efficient.

I would take up running, or start doing some cross training...hell, if you have the bike, which if you have good equipment is very costly, go the triathlon route.

There is no reason you can't be 190lbs if that is your goal. 50 years old doesn't mean shit. Don't give yourself excuses why you can't do something.

The ride I did last Sunday was 50 miles on the river bike paths in the Denver area, no climbing. I kept my heart rate down. I took a quick break at 25 miles and came home. I did it in 3 hours, average speed was 16 and change mph, again I rode slow to keep the heart rate down. My gee-whiz-bang computer with heart rate monitor that factored my age, size and heart rate reported I burned over 2100 calories. This was an easy ride for me.

I think I do need to mix it up with running or anything else I can squeeze into my schedule. However I just got asked to do another season with Team In Training for a century in Moab, UT this Sept. So I'll be running back through the training cycle again. I will try to ride on my own at least 2 days a week and the team rides on Saturday, trying to make 100 plus miles per week and cut back on food (just not during a long ride). Bonking 30 miles from home or the car really sucks.

[bp7178]

A girl I used to date did the triathlon thing and she swore by cross training and doing bricks. She'd also do 100 mile rides for fun....I don't know about that lol.

I'd love to do cross training, but I don't have a bike...it seems guns consume a large portion of my meager income.

My last distance run, ie those over 4 miles, was 8.06 miles in 1:00:29 and spent 1191 calories according to Runkeeper.

The problem with calorie counters and bike IMO is that it doesn't take into account coasting. With running, if you're moving you're burning calories.

I think heart rate monitors are good for knowing your heart rate as it relates to your maximum, but as your training progresses you should aim closer to your maximum and for longer durations.

When running, I always balance pace and duration, and never stay at one very long. On my lifting days, I just run a fast one mile at a 6:00min pace. My 4 mile runs are closer to 7:00, and distance about 7:30.

I really rocketed my pace down by doing leg strength training, squats and all that jazz. I would suggest that as well. If you have three hours to spend on a bike, hitting the gym should be easy.

Try doing shorter rides aiming for climbs and speed. If what you're doing isn't working, its because you've gotten good at it and need to radically differ your training.

Really I think that is the key with any PT training. Don't get complacent. If you go to the gym and always bench 135lb for three sets of 8, how would you ever expect to gain strength?

[WillBrink]

OK, so the 75% of max sounds like Keynesian Economics. Much has been written about it, it is repeated as "the way" but no one that anyone knows has actually achieved positive results from it.

So, what is a heart rate monitor for then? More snake oil?

No, just highly outdated info that many cling to either due to not knowing any better or trying to sell something. Exercise physiologists don't recommend heart rate kept in "fat burning zones" any more (life decades...) as studies showed it's not the essential factor to weight loss, per comments made in vid I posted.

HR monitors do have uses and are an objective way to measure intensity and other useful feedback. Runners World had a good article on using monitor for training:

http://www.runnersworld.com/article/...-2X5-3,00.html

[WillBrink]

There is no reason you can't be 190lbs if that is your goal. 50 years old doesn't mean shit. Don't give yourself excuses why you can't do something.

Not saying you're wrong per se, but you ever walk a mile in those shoes? How old are you? Ever tried to exercise while being treated for cancer, in his case leukemia? Just sayin'