moral obligation vs. lawsuit mentality

[calicojack]

so today at work some of the medics and I were having a discussion about treating patients when they/we are off the clock. I was SHOCKED to hear what i was told, to an extent.

As everyone knows we, in the EMS field, work under medical control and a specific dr's license.

Apparently, in my state, If a paramedic performs a non-"basic" intervention (ie: needle decompression) that medic can a) loose their license b) open themselves up to a lawsuit (which wouldn't be covered by malpractice insurance) and c) open themselves up to possible criminal charges if things go south. which opens a whole nother can o' worms for the untrained civilian who carries an ifak around with them.

The general consensus at my service is that the medics will keep on riding/moving if they see anything go south, if they can, and not intervene.

this bothers me. For me, i got in this field to help people, all the time, not just when i'm on the truck. to me, shit happens. as trained professionals we have a moral obligation to intervene as medically needed.

[Kchen986]

There's usually a good amount of legal defenses that will arise if you act during an exigent circumstance.

[tremiles]

In many states, untrained civilians are protected by "Good Samaritan" laws that do not apply to professional emergency response individuals. It's the main reason I got out of the lifeguard business in my early 20's. Especially considering the amount of trim a beach lifeguard gets despite being slow witted and not particularly attractive by any definition, it was a tough life choice.

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[glocktogo]

The Hippocratic Oath is subordinate to tort law. Welcome to America.

[Kchen986]

In many states, untrained civilians are protected by "Good Samaritan" laws that do not apply to professional emergency response individuals. It's the main reason I got out of the lifeguard business in my early 20's. Especially considering the amount of trim a beach lifeguard gets despite being slow witted and not particularly attractive by any definition, it was a tough life choice.

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Actually, it depends on the state. Usually, instead of a simple negligence standard for liability, the standard rises to gross negligence/recklessness, even for a trained professional. I'm not sure which state you live in, but I would suggest reading the actual statute before arriving at a conclusion.

Further, you will have defenses of necessity and causation, if you decide to stick someone suffering from tension pneumothorax.

[Caduceus]

In many states, untrained civilians are protected by "Good Samaritan" laws that do not apply to professional emergency response individuals. It's the main reason I got out of the lifeguard business in my early 20's. Especially considering the amount of trim a beach lifeguard gets despite being slow witted and not particularly attractive by any definition, it was a tough life choice.

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California is similar to this - Good Sam laws don't cover trained professionals. But, yes, states vary. In general, anything over Red Cross basic first aid is essentially opening yourself up to problems, IMO. If you can argue that every Boy and Girl Scout would be able to do the same thing, you really negate the argument that you screwed up.

That being said, you don't have a Duty to Act if you're not identified as a health care provider. In other words, you don't have to stop unless you have some huge glaring star of life on your car or something that screams EMS provider.

As an EMT-B I've stopped at several MVAs (MVC's, TA's, TC's, whatever you call them). As a physician, hell no.

[ST911]

I was SHOCKED to hear what i was told, to an extent.

I'm not. The reality of the modern legal environment has made things much more complicated, expensive, and risky than they should be.

I had a much longer post for you, but it comes down to this: Do your own cost:benefit, and act according to what you feel obligated to do and what you're willing to pay.

[Texas42]

In Texas, the Good Samaritan laws cover professionals when they don't have a professional duty to respond. There are some stipulations (Don't take payment, no gross negligence ect) I'd really be supprised if most states didn't have similar laws. . . . but Texas is probably the safest place (in terms of liability) to practice medicine.

I wouldn't do anything you were not trained to do or weren't comfortable doing.

Talk to a Medical defense lawyer. Most medical schools have some kind of jurisprudence course for their graduating seniors. You might try and see if you could tag along. (just an idea)

[WARPIG [USMC]]

And that's a sad thing to see...our nation becoming filled with more and more greedy people, just out looking to "get theirs" by whatever means possible...even if someones intentions were to save sometimes life, if something beyond their control went South, they'd open themselves up to an onslaught of lawyers and BS. Truly sad. People have good intentions but they are afraid to use them, "just in case" something can come back and bite them in the ass.

[Hizzie]

Even when I was LE I kinda stuck to the cell phone as my "action". To many variables and too many lawyers.