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Thread: purchase AR/Legion Firearms

  1. #21
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    To the OP; I'm impressed you read that much depth into it.

    To Adam Morehead; That's solid you standing up, hope you do well. Now kick your lawyer in the nads.

  2. #22
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    summary so far

    Well, first, thanks for the replies—it’s always good to learn from others. Here are my takeaways at this point:

    1) These terms are not normal for this industry.
    2) They may change at some point in the future.
    3) Most of their prior customers didn’t read the terms. Or can’t, I suppose. But should have.
    4) Many here don’t think that coating key parts and fluting the barrel in unusual ways are worth the money charged.
    5) Good: Noveske, KAC, BCM, LaRue
    6) Not so good: Mega Arms
    7) Lawyers deserve the (bad) reputation they have.
    8) Legion firearms is responsive if nothing else.

    Again, my primary point in this thread was to learn what are normal terms in the industry and explain my dissatisfaction/call attention to these terms. Mission accomplished.

    To address some of the rest of the comments briefly, I suppose I’ll add Noveske was always at the top of my list, and there is even an outfit here in Phoenix that I can take that gun to and Cerakote it myself. For an added cost, of course. I’m not so much a fan of ‘proprietary’ parts, and I understand a KAC is full of them, so they were a bit further down my list for that reason. But on it. As to the point about buying 2 Colts—good idea, generally. If I took that fork in the road, I’d be looking hard at Rock Rive Arms too.

    I’m ok with cutting/leading edge stuff like Nickel-boron and Cerakote coatings, but only if I have good reason to believe that it is reliable and not just a gimmick. I’m satisfied that these coatings do provide a useful function, the only real decision there is costworthiness. Some of the things I read about LF's hex design affecting vibration and stiffness are technically true (I am a mechanical engineer), however I haven’t seen the evidence the ultimate effect is significant/worth it. For the rest who have not researched, I believe there was a less than formal claim of <1 MOA with 'standard' ammo, which, if true, would justify the price a bit more. To some such as myself.

    Thanks again.

    PS: Adam—Time will tell if you folks do make a change. It’s your business, you’re free to do it as you want—just as I am as a (potential) customer. Regardless, I do appreciate the fact that you responded at all. I’ll assert that I was not ‘trolling’; I read the terms for a reason; and I did find them unacceptable. I remain legitimately concerned about claims of barrel accuracy given these terms. I would suggest that if you have good and/or independent data...publish it! That would go a long way toward me opening my wallet.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by ivokalok View Post
    As to the point about buying 2 Colts—good idea, generally. If I took that fork in the road, I’d be looking hard at Rock Rive Arms too.
    2 colts are infinitely better than all the rra's in the world...
    Last edited by VIP3R 237; 07-12-12 at 22:34.
    I paint spaceship parts.

    Quote Originally Posted by Failure2Stop View Post
    Stippled Glocks are like used underwear; previous owner makes all the difference in value.

  4. #24
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    We have had a very happy business relationship with Jamie and Adam since 2010, both are outstanding guys, and I've heard nothing but great things about Legion Firearms as a company, and their products. In case anyone didn't know, Legion Firearms receivers are 45 degree compatible
    Roger Wang
    Forward Controls Design
    Simplicity is the sign of truth

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by ivokalok View Post
    6) Not so good: Mega Arms
    Uh, you'd be dead wrong on that one bud.
    MEGA Arms makes some of, if not the best AR receivers available - forged or billet. Always in spec, insane finish/anodizing. Just consistent quality.
    Besides a few Noveske FFLs, all I run are MEGA receivers - I've had just about all the others. MEGA is top-tier stuff. If you knew anything about the company and their machine work, you'd know they strive to be the best with the limited products they offer. The arms side is a spin-off from their aerospace manufacturing side. Precision work.

    If you're talking about the NiB finish, then I agree wholeheartedly - pretty darn silly to have an uncoated NiB exterior, but whatever.
    Last edited by Brahmzy; 07-13-12 at 08:43.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iraqgunz View Post
    I knew that. I just didn't want to broadcast it all over the net anymore than it is.
    you knew that. Obviously. You were at the same class as he was when the video was shot. Others on the other hand, may not.

  7. #27
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    OP...glad you pointed all that out...buying something for that amount of money on the internet I too would have read all the disclaimers.

    Legion seems like a messed up head trip company. Personally I'm going to stay away especially with so many other top quality rifle company's on the market.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by mdrums View Post
    OP...glad you pointed all that out...buying something for that amount of money on the internet I too would have read all the disclaimers.

    Legion seems like a messed up head trip company. Personally I'm going to stay away especially with so many other top quality rifle company's on the market.
    I suggest you re-read the entire thread before making that statement, the manufacturer did respond.

    Remember, folks, you can add all sorts of stuff into a EULA, ToS, or purchase agreement, but that does not mean that it has the force of law. I remember some software developer adding a clause that summarized "We own your immortal soul upon installing our software"

    They just did it as a point to show that people never, ever read EULAs, and of course they cant enforce it (well...I hope)

  9. #29
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    Well that's about as "stand up" response as you'll ever see on the Internet. Well done.. Cheers.. Ron

    Quote Originally Posted by adameverywhere View Post
    Hi all,

    I'm Adam Morehead, one of the co-founders of Legion Firearms. First of all, I agree with pretty much everything posted thus far. When we formed the company we wanted to be as rock solid as we could in our terms and conditions, and in reading this feed back I know we went WAY TOO FAR. (BTW Montrala, you're right: our attorney represents several software companies). The legal mumbo jumbo generally makes my eyes glaze over, so I deeply apologize for conveying a douchebag like image. That's certainly not our intent.

    We in no way want to keep anyone's money if they "default". Considering this pertains a web purchase, the credit card is either good or it isn't. If it doesn't work out we'll put the order aside for you, see if there is another payment method available, or whatever it takes to get you Legion gear.

    We love it if you take courses and train with firearms, but if you don't want to, then you don't have to. This clause is really dumb.

    Also, once you buy Legion kit, do what you want with it (except straw purchasing of course). We don't have any rights to it, or you, or anything in your gun safe after purchase. Again, this clause is ridiculous.

    Finally, go ahead and talk about your Legion products. Whether it's good or bad we at Legion (and everyone on the internet) should know. We want to make everyone happy and really appreciate the feed back we get from our customers. This post is in fact good feedback. We f'ed up and we'll fix it. That's what we do.

    Sorry again folks. Thanks for letting me know what we need to change.

    Adam
    Ain't no pockets on a shroud..

  10. #30
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    Interesting thread. Horrible purchase agreement for Legion.


    Adam and the company need to revamp that whole page.
    former cat herder

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