Tactical use of AR 9mm carbine?

[cimg]

Other than having ammo compatibity with a side arm, is there any tactical scenerio to have a 9mm over a 5.56 carbine?

[Moltke]

Short answer, yes. Search and read about the MP5 if you are not familiar with it. A short barreled, suppressed 9mm AR would fill a similar role.

[TXinfidel]

Short answer, yes. Search and read about the MP5 if you are not familiar with it. A short barreled, suppressed 9mm AR would fill a similar role.

Typically, It can be said that whatever a pistol cartridge can do, a rifle cartridge can do in its sleep. How ever the business end of this MP5 puts this fat hill billy on the dirt pretty impressively

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sh1cp...ure=plpp_video

[DocGKR]

"Other than having ammo compatibity with a side arm, is there any tactical scenerio to have a 9mm over a 5.56 carbine?"

In this day and age, no for 99% of users.

[Moltke]

I'm sure somebody somewhere will still be better suited with a subgun than an AR... but I don't dispute the point. Anything a pistol caliber can do, a rifle caliber can do better.

[The_War_Wagon]

In this day and age, no for 99% of users.

This.

The 9mm was thought to be the end-all, be-all caliber for SWAT and special operations groups back in the '80's & early '90's, with the adoption of the MP-5 by MANY metro PD's in America. It's also why you see such a proliferation of them in movies (Die Hard, Under Siege, etc.) of the era.

NUMEROUS high-profile shootouts against carbine/rifle-armed bandits - most notably, the North Hollywood shootout in 1997 - led many agencies to start searching for a replacement longarm, with most adopting the AR15/M16/M4 variant for their SWAT/Rapid Response teams, and abandonment of the 9mm altogether.

This was also exacerbated by the adoption of .40 S&W calibered sidearms in the '90's by MANY LE agencies. If your beat cops are carrying 9mm pistols, than 9mm subguns make a LOT of sense - especially to department bean counters. Once the 9mm sidearm is gone, and the subgun deemed, "ineffective," then it gets retired as well.

I suspect Pittsburgh was one of the last metro PD's of consequence still using MP-5's, when the April 4, 2009 Stanton Heights shootout took place. Three Pittsburgh officers were shot & killed that morning, and the suspect - barricaded in a brick home - was peppered with almost 1,000 rounds of 9mm, that was largely ineffective against a 40+ year old residential brick structure. Watching live news coverage of the shooting that morning, one officer could clearly be seen carrying a new CASE of more 9mm to the officers surrounding the home.

By the following Friday, Pittsburgh officers were starting to be armed with new S&W M&P15T rifles - that's how swiftly the 9mm subgun got replaced around here.

IS there a place for the 9mm AR? For home defense perhaps, yes - it's better and more precise than a handgun, and in a densely populated area, full of rowhouses or the like, it's a good choice from a liability standpoint. That said, I live in 'rowhouse central' - and all my AR's are 5.56, save for my .22LR trainer.

[Sry0fcr]

The problem is that the pistol caliber carbine excels in the realm of the pistol but the short barreled carbine has made significant inroads into the same area. I don't think that this makes the PCC useless or obsolete, just really narrows the scope of it's use.

[DocGKR]

"and in a densely populated area, full of rowhouses or the like, it's a good choice from a liability standpoint.'

Why?

5.56 mm actually demonstrates much LESS penetration after defeating common intermediate barriers than any of the common service caliber handguns.

[tpd223]

Having seen both real life and test shootings through various building materials with 9mm and .223/5.56 rounds I strongly concur with Doc.
I fought for ARs back in the late '80s before the patrol rifle thing became popular, people thought I was talking crazy "You'll shoot through schools!!!".

Anyway. My one use for any PCC is my Kel Tec sub2000.
I EDC Glock 9mms daily. When I road trip and I am not taking another long gun along for some reason (carbine class, shotguns for bird hunting, .308 for deer, etc) the sub goes with me.

It's my long gun for when I'm not taking a long gun, only because it has been 100% reliable, and uses my Glock 9mm ammo/mags AND I can pack it in and out of hotels without anyone knowing or having to use a long gun case.

[MegademiC]

The main advantage it has is silencing capabilities which are VERY niche. With th 300blk - if they get expanding subsonic rounds(which I dont think they have yet, but I could be wrong) - that would pretty much make the 9mm carbine obsolete IMO. I just dont see what else it can offer that the 5.56 or 300blk doent do better.

terminal ballistics
silencing
size
recoil might go to 9mm but I havnt shot 300blk(I hear the ss loads are noticably more controlable).

as for the vid above, that officer showed very good trigger control with the quick - short and accurate bursts. Thought it was worth mentioning.