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Thread: Question about the gas key?

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    Question about the gas key?

    Maybe there is an answer to this some place but I can't for the life of me find it. After looking at many designs of piston AR's I have a question. Is lengthening the gas key tube so that it never left the gas tube open to put hot gas and fouling into the bolt carrier possible without causing an overpressure situation? From what I can gather you could put a hole some place along the gas tube to let pressure off, like with a piston? Maybe I'm an idiot but this seems like a much more simple way to take much fouling out the reciever than adding springs, rods, and pistons. If I'm totally off-base then please correct me, but this seems like a much cheaper and simpler fix, As always thanks for the feedback guys!

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    Quote Originally Posted by mastiffhound View Post
    Maybe there is an answer to this some place but I can't for the life of me find it. After looking at many designs of piston AR's I have a question. Is lengthening the gas key tube so that it never left the gas tube open to put hot gas and fouling into the bolt carrier possible without causing an overpressure situation? From what I can gather you could put a hole some place along the gas tube to let pressure off, like with a piston? Maybe I'm an idiot but this seems like a much more simple way to take much fouling out the reciever than adding springs, rods, and pistons. If I'm totally off-base then please correct me, but this seems like a much cheaper and simpler fix, As always thanks for the feedback guys!
    it would be possible but the gas key would need to be incredibly long, it would require a redisgn of the upper gas tube hole, and the barrel nut.

    I have often thought about this as well, but im just not convinced the amount of fowling from the gas key is worth it.
    Quote Originally Posted by C4IGrant View Post
    Colt builds War Horses, not show ponies.
    Quote Originally Posted by Iraqgunz View Post
    This is 2012. The world is going to end this December and people are still trying to debate the merits of piece of shit, cost cutting crap AR's. Really?

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    It would just be drilling the hole a little bigger right? And getting the gas key tube lengthened? Now I'm really thinking about this. I have an extra upper, I am tempted to try this. It would still be cheaper by far than a piston system too. Has anyone done this before?
    Last edited by mastiffhound; 08-08-12 at 02:04.

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    What's the point? A "cleaner" gun? It'll still need lube...it'll still not need to be cleaned constantly.

    All you be doing is spending a lot of money on something that 1) won't net you any real benefits and 2) will likely cause malfunctions at some point in time.

    At the end of the day, all this fouling and carbon and general "dirtiness" that people talk about with mil spec ARs is really a non issue. It DOESN'T hurt anything...it DOESN'T cause malfunctions...

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    Changing the length of the gas key will change how much gas goes into the BCG. If it were made longer, more gas will be used and it will take longer for the rifle to vent overboard the excess. Eugene Stoner designed the AR gas system to be self regulating.

    How much fouling really gets into the receivers? Does it really cause problems with functioning? My AR has close to 2500 rounds (not counting nearly 500 rounds of 22 LR) with little cleaning other than running a bore snake through the barrel every once in awhile, a quick wipe down of the BCG and the application of lube
    Last edited by MistWolf; 08-08-12 at 13:40. Reason: I meant gas key, not gas tube
    INSIDE PLAN OF BOX
    1. ROAD-RUNNER LIFTS GLASS OF WATER- PULLING UP MATCH
    2. MATCH SCRATCHES ON MATCH-BOX
    3. MATCH LIGHTS FUSE TO TNT
    4. BOOM!
    5. HA-HA!!

    -WILE E. COYOTE, AUTHOR OF "EVERYTHING I NEEDED TO KNOW IN LIFE, I LEARNED FROM GOLDBERG & MURPHY"

    http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n289/SgtSongDog/AR%20Carbine/DSC_0114.jpg
    I am American

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    Quote Originally Posted by mastiffhound View Post
    Maybe there is an answer to this some place but I can't for the life of me find it. After looking at many designs of piston AR's I have a question. Is lengthening the gas key tube so that it never left the gas tube open to put hot gas and fouling into the bolt carrier possible without causing an overpressure situation? From what I can gather you could put a hole some place along the gas tube to let pressure off, like with a piston? Maybe I'm an idiot but this seems like a much more simple way to take much fouling out the reciever than adding springs, rods, and pistons. If I'm totally off-base then please correct me, but this seems like a much cheaper and simpler fix, As always thanks for the feedback guys!

    Can be done, google ZM Weapons. I've got no experience with the system:

    http://firearmsandtraining.blogspot....n-details.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by JasonM View Post
    Can be done, google ZM Weapons. I've got no experience with the system:

    http://firearmsandtraining.blogspot....n-details.html
    Amazing, I always thought that was a piston gun, very cool.
    Quote Originally Posted by C4IGrant View Post
    Colt builds War Horses, not show ponies.
    Quote Originally Posted by Iraqgunz View Post
    This is 2012. The world is going to end this December and people are still trying to debate the merits of piece of shit, cost cutting crap AR's. Really?

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by JasonM View Post
    Can be done, google ZM Weapons. I've got no experience with the system:

    http://firearmsandtraining.blogspot....n-details.html
    Awesome, I love it every time I find out I'm not crazy!

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by MistWolf View Post
    Changing the length of the gas key will change how much gas goes into the BCG. If it were made longer, more gas will be used and it will take longer for the rifle to vent overboard the excess. Eugene Stoner designed the AR gas system to be self regulating.
    The excess gas is vented out through the ejection port at about 1/4" of bolt carrier travel as the gas rings open the exhaust ports.
    Extending the gas key really would not accomplish much at all or change how dirty a receiver gets.
    Randall Rausch
    AR15 Barrel Guru
    California Precision Rifle Club founding member

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by AR15barrels View Post
    The excess gas is vented out through the ejection port at about 1/4" of bolt carrier travel as the gas rings open the exhaust ports...
    That's very true, but until the gas key separates from the gas tube, gas is still flowing into the BCG
    INSIDE PLAN OF BOX
    1. ROAD-RUNNER LIFTS GLASS OF WATER- PULLING UP MATCH
    2. MATCH SCRATCHES ON MATCH-BOX
    3. MATCH LIGHTS FUSE TO TNT
    4. BOOM!
    5. HA-HA!!

    -WILE E. COYOTE, AUTHOR OF "EVERYTHING I NEEDED TO KNOW IN LIFE, I LEARNED FROM GOLDBERG & MURPHY"

    http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n289/SgtSongDog/AR%20Carbine/DSC_0114.jpg
    I am American

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