Water Cooler: Ken Hackathorn and the State of the Industry

[Alaskapopo]

Nobody is perfect and in firearms related matters imperfection is a regular occurence. Heck, this universe that we know of would not exist if it wasn't for imperfections. Like Hack says: "Even monkeys fall off trees sometimes".

I dare say, Ken has more instruction and training innovation downrange than anyone including Jeff Cooper. That's a pretty lofty and well-deserved realm.

Like I said a small thing and it lets us know that everyone including our heros are just human.
Pat

[RamZar]

Like I said a small thing and it lets us know that everyone including our heros are just human.

Always good to be mindful of absolutisms and perfectionisms. Striving for them is one thing. Claiming them is ultimately falsehood.

[LHS]

Ken's knowledge is pretty well encyclopaedic. I grew up shooting with him pretty much every weekend, and had no idea just how lucky I was until I moved away and took my first 'paid-for' class. I was struck by how it was just like every Sunday's shooting with Dad & Ken and the guys @ Ft. Harmar.

There is precious little more enjoyable than letting Ken get on a roll on some subject or another. Both the quality of his knowledge and his ability to transfer it to students are legendary, and for good reason. Even more impressive, Ken never got locked into a dogma like Cooper did. I took a class from him two years ago or so, and the techniques were not the same as I remembered from my adolescence. For one thing, he was using a Glock instead of a 1911. But beyond that, many of his points regarding stance, grip, and accessory choice have evolved over the years as he's found things that work better than what he used in the past.

A great example of this is the use of lasers on pistols. I can remember some of the first CT laser grips when someone brought them out to the range. Ken (and most of the other guys there) laughed them off as a gimmick and a crutch. But they gave them a real shot, and wrung them out with an open mind. And despite wanting to hate them, Ken came around and agreed that they have a definite niche use where they can be very helpful, even dominating.

The bottom line is, if it works better, Ken will adopt it and use it. He is a true student of the art, in the finest sense of the word. If you haven't taken a class from him yet, you're doing yourself a disservice.

[RamZar]

Ken's knowledge is pretty well encyclopaedic. I grew up shooting with him pretty much every weekend, and had no idea just how lucky I was until I moved away and took my first 'paid-for' class. I was struck by how it was just like every Sunday's shooting with Dad & Ken and the guys @ Ft. Harmar.

There is precious little more enjoyable than letting Ken get on a roll on some subject or another. Both the quality of his knowledge and his ability to transfer it to students are legendary, and for good reason. Even more impressive, Ken never got locked into a dogma like Cooper did. I took a class from him two years ago or so, and the techniques were not the same as I remembered from my adolescence. For one thing, he was using a Glock instead of a 1911. But beyond that, many of his points regarding stance, grip, and accessory choice have evolved over the years as he's found things that work better than what he used in the past.

A great example of this is the use of lasers on pistols. I can remember some of the first CT laser grips when someone brought them out to the range. Ken (and most of the other guys there) laughed them off as a gimmick and a crutch. But they gave them a real shot, and wrung them out with an open mind. And despite wanting to hate them, Ken came around and agreed that they have a definite niche use where they can be very helpful, even dominating.

The bottom line is, if it works better, Ken will adopt it and use it. He is a true student of the art, in the finest sense of the word. If you haven't taken a class from him yet, you're doing yourself a disservice.

Ken is a true Renaissance man. He's always looking and listening for what the next advance is without closing his mind. Always open-minded and never pigeonholing you into A way.

[Army Chief]

One small thing.
He said with the PPQ that Walther took the P99 and make it a striker fired gun. Well the P99 is also a striker fired gun just with a different trigger.

Good catch.

While a small detail, I wasn't immediately sure if perhaps this was misunderstood by the transcriber of the interview, or if Ken may have said this without giving it a great deal of extra thought, since he was focusing rather specifically upon the merits of the newer gun. Whatever the case, the P99 family of sidearms has always been built around the striker-fired concept. It just wasn't until the advent of the PPQ that they gave us something with the clear potential to pull away from a rather crowded field. That is an admittedly subjective evaluation on my part, but one that I am increasingly comfortable airing as I gain experience with the PPQ.

AC

[WillBrink]

Ken Hackthorn's insightful and experienced thoughts on various subjects including training.

Around the Water Cooler: Ken Hackathorn and the State of the Industry

He sums up why after decades of being a 1911 dedicated shooter, I transitioned to an M&P 9mm. Best line from his interview for me:

"If I'm in a place where I need more than that pistol and those magazines," he said, "I'm in the wrong place with the wrong gun at the wrong time. It's a bad day."

[Rob-ECTT]

I'm sure he has probably done some articles, but has he published any books or training references?

I don't recall if he ever wrote any books or not. He wrote tons of articles for firearms magazines over the years. I remember reading some of them when I was a kid (not a short while ago).

He also did a video series with Bill Wilson of Wilson Combat quite a few years ago, which was probably the best available at the time.

I'm not sure how many of his stories he would want to put into print form, but even leaving out the ones that might come back on people, I'm sure he's still got more than enough floating in his head to make a fascinating book!

[RamZar]

I don't recall if he ever wrote any books or not. He wrote tons of articles for firearms magazines over the years. I remember reading some of them when I was a kid (not a short while ago).

He also did a video series with Bill Wilson of Wilson Combat quite a few years ago, which was probably the best available at the time.

I'm not sure how many of his stories he would want to put into print form, but even leaving out the ones that might come back on people, I'm sure he's still got more than enough floating in his head to make a fascinating book!

I'll ask Ken again about a book. The timing seems right now that he has more time in semi-retirement in Idaho.

The video sets with Bill Wilson are kind of old and not good transfers from VHS but you can still get them at the Wilson Combat website.

[Rosco Benson]

I'm sure he has probably done some articles, but has he published any books or training references?

No books. Years back, Ken used to write some articles for Harris Publications (Combat Handguns), SOF, and SWAT mag. He wrote several articles for SOF's short-lived Fighting Firearms magazine (an excellent magazine, by the way). He had a monthly column in American Handgunner until AH's management decided that two gurus was one too many.

I may have missed some, but those are the ones I recall.

I would be delighted if Ken would write a book (or several). Now that he's semi-retired, I hope he finds the time to.

Rosco

[C4IGrant]

Ken is the ROCK that I grind ALL other firearms instructors against.

When you compare his LE/Mil/Competition background, weapon history knowledge, weapon building knowledge, shooting history knowledge, teaching knowledge/ability and his ability (at the age of 66) to burn you down with most any weapon made, he IS the standard.



C4