Originally Posted by
dangertree
Fair enough I guess. But having a lighter buffer doesn't make a barrel over gassed. If the gas port is the same size (mine are), then they are the same.
All the best.
Right, but it does make the rifle over gassed. The problem is, moat people don't even know what this means. Again, the typical Stag buyer, from what I've seen, isn't buying it as a duty rifle or even advanced training, they're usually buying it for plinking now and then. That's fine with me.
I still don't see spending $1,000 on any Stag when you can buy a complete BCM or Colt for the same price, or within $75.
The big thing I always look at is what rifles are being used at quality training classes and how they perform. Without fail, Bushmaster, DPMS, Stag, Olympic, Model 1, etc., though not seen in numbers like those manufacturers producing rifles with the professional in mind, they have a higher percentage of failures.
And for me, that's what it comes down to. I have no doubt I could buy a Stag off the shelf, check a few things, change a thing or two with parts I own and get it to run fine. But why? Why would I not just buy a BCM first for the same price and have the reliability I had to work for with the Stag?
Again, most are not going to see any difference as they just don't shoot that much or their shooting takes place on a comfy bench somewhere while they slowly fire a few rounds down range to see how small they can get their groups. Again, that's cool with me. But, if you are defending life, your own, the public's or my country's, then I would think we'd want the best to start with.
If I remember correctly, they were using 4140 barrels and batch testing as well. These are things that are permanent unless you replace the carrier group and barrel.
Also, what bothers me the most, is they won't just make all their rifles the same. They basically have the "Professional package" and the standard "hobby package". This makes no sense to me.
In my experience, those that say certain things don't matter and one brand is "good enough" wither don't shoot enough or don't have anything to compare it to. I've yet to meet someone that trains hard and regulary that has owned both hobby and pro grade weapons and has stated that the hobby rifle was good enough. The only time I ever hear that is from those that own the hobby rifle they're defending and typically, though not always, are not high round count shooters, but more bench shooters. That's all good, just something I've noticed.
For me, the fact that I may need my weapon at work and home and thai train with them numerous times weekly, there is absolutely no reason in this world that I should skimp on quality in any way, just to save $100.... especially when I shoot up that difference 5 times over on a monthly basis.
Dangertree, I'm speaking in general here, not towards you directly. For all I know, you're very experienced mil and LE. Just wanted to make that clear since there all always exceptions to the rule. I'm also not in any way saying your personal experience is wrong. I'm looking at large numbers here. I know numerous guys that beat the hell out of Bushmasters that are still running strong with a couple small tweaks. But, in the big picture, I know of many more that are not as they fail more often than others. I know an experience with a few can always be far different than an experience with hundreds.
Also, I know Noveske uses CMT lower parts. I don't know if they're the same as Stag or not. I also know Stag may individually test parts now. I think testing argument is a bit much, but it's often mentioned. Just wanted to clear a few things up...
Last edited by jonconsiglio; 08-26-12 at 15:47.
Proven combat techniques may not be flashy and may require a bit more physical effort on the part of the shooter. Further, they may not win competition matches, but they will help ensure your survival in a shooting or gunfight on the street. ~ Paul Howe
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