G&R Tactical Drill #1 & #2

[tb-av]

It's the same way with an AR or just about any autoloader. You just have to be attuned to the signals it's sending you.

Yeah, I find the AR very easy to read. the last shot is louder and you don't get the spring sound. Two totally different sounds. I find my 1911 and PPS very hard to notice when I'm under even mild stress and often just casual shooting.

[Axcelea]

Yes open carry. Level 3 of the drill is shooting it from concealed. No time adjustment.


C4

Cool, little bit more involved though but a good drill imo.

Ok, here's a question specific to the drill.

Is there a technique or mindset that one should employ to facilitate realizing that the mag is empty and slide is locked back?

I assume that is a main aspect of this drill. I find myself often not realizing I have fired all the rounds. Are there any "tricks of the trade" to become aware of needing a mag change sooner?

TB

Recoil difference (slide doesn't jolt forward as mentioned), rear of pistol looks different, and trigger doesn't reset are ones I go by although all of them rely on a slide stop and it working. After I get the gun is dry vibe I tilt upward and confirm slide lock while starting the reload process.

The click of doom is a different story since it could be a misfire, or other malfunction or out of ammo (no slide stop or it was accidentally held down).

[C4IGrant]

Ok, here's a question specific to the drill.

Is there a technique or mindset that one should employ to facilitate realizing that the mag is empty and slide is locked back?

I assume that is a main aspect of this drill. I find myself often not realizing I have fired all the rounds. Are there any "tricks of the trade" to become aware of needing a mag change sooner?

TB

IMHO, knowing or feeling that your gun is empty is a "square range" thing. I have seen people in shoot houses enter rooms with an empty gun because they never knew that they were at slide lock.

In most mag change drills, the shooter loads one or two rounds into a mag, shoots gun to slide lock and then E-reloads and fires another couple rounds. The problem with this is that you are not surprised when the gun runs out of ammo (expecting it). This is of little value IMHO.

If you look at the first mag I shoot in drill #2, I pull the trigger on an empty chamber (as I don't know the guns is empty).



C4

[C4IGrant]

I hope I'm not intruding, but I think that is the point of the drill, the feel of the empty gun is the indicator for the needed reload. We all anticipate re-loads when doing drills this preps our mind for the re-load. In a fight you(we) do not focus on how many shots we have taken and the empty gun will take us by surprise. The drill so far is the closest thing I have seen to replicating that surprise.

You are correct. With that said, most of us that shoot a lot do generally know when the gun runs out of ammo (as it has a different "feel" to it). Drill #2 does have the capability to catch you by surprise though.



C4

[glocktogo]

I came up with an IDPA stage that's the nemesis of round counters. You start facing uprange near a barricade. T-1 is left side of barricade for 2 rounds, then move to a barricade or barrel to the right. When you arrive at P-2, from the right side you'll encounter a target that has the head box covered by a white square with a large number between two and five. You fire that number of rounds on T-2. Move to P-3 and repeat on T-3, move to P-4 and repeat on T-4. You finish at P-5 with 2 rounds to T-5 from the right side of a barricade. The total round count is fourteen rounds. Ten of those rounds in the middle are randomized while the shooter is turned uprange before the signal, so that reloads can't be scripted. The shooter can't see T-2 thru T-4 until they reach each position, so they ave no idea how many rounds they'll fore until they arrive and identify the target.

I tell the SO's to randomize the numbers based on division round counts, so every shooter has the same number of target acquisitions.

[C45P312]

Here's a vid from the range yesterday. Didn't check the battery so it ran out before I could film Drill #2. I felt that I can definitely do the level 1 of drill #1 with no problems so I meant to make B-8 centers with the dimensions Grant gave me. Well, with me rushing, I forgot to bring them. Instead, to make it more challenging for me, I went with a retention holster and reloaded from concealment.

Wish I was alone on the range so I could have walked down and got my hits on camera. Who would have known that the range would have been busy on a monday after?!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=awMTno64krc

p.s. can you not embed video here?

[Guns-up.50]

You are correct. With that said, most of us that shoot a lot do generally know when the gun runs out of ammo (as it has a different "feel" to it). Drill #2 does have the capability to catch you by surprise though.



C4

Although we are applying forward pressure to control recoil, the return of the recoil spring has a certain snap to it when in forward motion, the absence of this "snap" is a great indicator for me..

Its hard to put into words, it like driving a standard car you just got to feel it to know when to shift.

[C4IGrant]

Here's a vid from the range yesterday. Didn't check the battery so it ran out before I could film Drill #2. I felt that I can definitely do the level 1 of drill #1 with no problems so I meant to make B-8 centers with the dimensions Grant gave me. Well, with me rushing, I forgot to bring them. Instead, to make it more challenging for me, I went with a retention holster and reloaded from concealment.

Wish I was alone on the range so I could have walked down and got my hits on camera. Who would have known that the range would have been busy on a monday after?!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=awMTno64krc

p.s. can you not embed video here?

Cool man!

Now that someone has actually shot it, I will give you a little background on this drill.

I have assisted a core group of about 20 local shooters go from never owning a pistol to being above average shooters. They are proficient and fundamentally sound. With that said, they commonly want to know what it takes to be classified as an "advanced shooter" or if they would be able to hold their own in an advanced shooting class (KD, Hackathorn, Vickers, etc).

In an effort to show them what it looks like to be an advanced shooter, I came up with a list of 6 core drills or tests. Some are borrowed and modified (10/10/10, 1-5, Defoor Drill #1, etc) and some are our own invention (these two drills). They all have a time standard, tight accuracy reqs and a pass fail rating. We also assign a TWO second penalty for misses in the A zone and fails for missed head shots. The idea for the two second penalty came from Hackathorn. I like it because it puts a PREMIUM on accuracy (since only quality hits matter).

On a side note, I showed Drill #1 to Mr. Hackathorn and he liked it a lot. I believe that he is (or will be using it) in his future pistol classes. So if you hear him say; "Grant Drill" this is it.



C4

[theblackknight]

I came up with an IDPA stage that's the nemesis of round counters. You start facing uprange near a barricade. T-1 is left side of barricade for 2 rounds, then move to a barricade or barrel to the right. When you arrive at P-2, from the right side you'll encounter a target that has the head box covered by a white square with a large number between two and five. You fire that number of rounds on T-2. Move to P-3 and repeat on T-3, move to P-4 and repeat on T-4. You finish at P-5 with 2 rounds to T-5 from the right side of a barricade. The total round count is fourteen rounds. Ten of those rounds in the middle are randomized while the shooter is turned uprange before the signal, so that reloads can't be scripted. The shooter can't see T-2 thru T-4 until they reach each position, so they ave no idea how many rounds they'll fore until they arrive and identify the target.

I tell the SO's to randomize the numbers based on division round counts, so every shooter has the same number of target acquisitions.

Would you change the numbers for every shooter? Otherwise the gamiest of gamers will just listen to # of rounds at each position.

Had one stage where targets with hats on get 2 rounds, nonhats get 1. Each position hats would move targets but not positions so it was still objective.

sent from mah gun,using my sights

[glocktogo]

Would you change the numbers for every shooter? Otherwise the gamiest of gamers will just listen to # of rounds at each position.

Had one stage where targets with hats on get 2 rounds, nonhats get 1. Each position hats would move targets but not positions so it was still objective.

sent from mah gun,using my sights

Changed every shooter, and not always using the same set of numbers either. It might be 3,5,2, then 4,2,4, then 4,3,3, etc. It always totals 14 rounds and only the first and last target remin the same at two each. The scorekeeper scores the targets while the SO has the shooter load and make ready into the side berm. As soon as he's loaded, the SO has him face uprange and while the targets are being taped, the scorekeeper changes the number cards, which are clipped on with Acco clips or clothespins. The stage runs fast and smooth, but the shooter doesn't know what he's getting until he reaches the position.