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Thread: Do you judge people by....

  1. #21
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    I don't put much stock in the roll mark. My first gun was built on a Spikes stripped lower and upper. But the guts were centurion, BCM, Geissele, and VLTOR. I did my research, as I expect most people who read these forums enough do.

    My second gun was built on a BCM, though. Frankly, I went that route because I knew going with another stripped Spikes available at my local gun shop would earn ridicule.

    A lot of it comes down to availability. At the price point that I pay for a BCM, LMT, or other lower, then shipping, then transfer fees, did I really come out better than buying the Spikes they had sitting under glass? I didn't think so.

    Now, the other brands they have that I've never heard of (Ardel Engineering, for example), I avoid those.
    "Man is still the first weapon of war" - Field Marshal Montgomery

    The Everyday Marksman

  2. #22
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    I always thought the spikes roll mark looked like Darth Vader.
    Last edited by Koshinn; 10-16-12 at 00:38.
    "I never learned from a man who agreed with me." Robert A. Heinlein

  3. #23
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    It might form a part of a matrix I would use to judge someone. But it would be fairly low on the list.

    A well set-up gun with a roll-mark that doesn't impress me would generate a much more favourable response than a Colt with a grip-pod, a bushnell trophy 3-9 and a CAA stock.

    It may be a result of the more limited (and much more expensive) Canadian market, but I rarely see people whose main issue stems from selecting equipment of insufficient quality.

    What I generally see is people who own guns and don't shoot them much, or, when they do, shoot them in unstructured ways that don't result in increasing skill.

    I would much rather see someone with a cheap Norinco AR and several crates of empty brass than someone with a Mag-Pul'd up Colt with a Centurion rail...who never shoots his prized possession.

    That may be less common in the US where guns are cheap and ammo is still relatively cheap compared to what we pay up here...but it's very common in Canada.

    It's not that I don't think there are objective, measurable advantages to the "tier one" guns...obviously there are. It's just that most of the people I encounter who are having issues, are having USER issues, not gun issues.
    Full disclosure: I'm the editor of Calibre Magazine, which is Canada's gun magazine. In the past I've done consulting work for different manufacturers and OEM suppliers, but not currently. M4C's disclosure policy doesn't seem to cover me but we do have advertisers, although I don't handle that side of things and in general I do not know who is paying us at any given time.

  4. #24
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    I shoot Wolf in my AK. Don't hate me.
    Life is full of choices. I choose Noveske.

  5. #25
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    I do admit that I create possible scenarios in my head about folks based on their firearms and choice of accessories. But I try to give them the benefit of the doubt until I get to know them better.

    Still, there are some indicators that I take as a clue that I don't want to wait around long enough to find out how close folks match up to my prejudices
    INSIDE PLAN OF BOX
    1. ROAD-RUNNER LIFTS GLASS OF WATER- PULLING UP MATCH
    2. MATCH SCRATCHES ON MATCH-BOX
    3. MATCH LIGHTS FUSE TO TNT
    4. BOOM!
    5. HA-HA!!

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  6. #26
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    Here's my list of silly rollmarks that I can think of offhand...

    Service logos
    Spider (I'll admit that I have some lowers with this on it)
    Deer
    Snake
    Bear
    Biohazard symbol
    Zombie in crosshairs
    Skull and crossbones
    "ZOMBIE DEFENSE"
    AR15.com bolt face
    Nuclear energy symbol
    Lion in crosshairs
    Dancing beast thing
    "PLUMCRAZY FIREARMS"
    Pirate symbol
    Bison skull
    Obama
    Crosshairs
    Indian battle ax
    Airplane taking off

    Being that encompasses the majority of stripped lowers out there, it's going to be hard to avoid them. And you're going to pay a markup for an LMT, BCM, S&W, DD, Noveske, or Colt lower. The only two budget lowers with a decent logo is LRB and PSA.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by justin_247 View Post
    Here's my list of silly rollmarks that I can think of offhand...

    Service logos
    Spider (I'll admit that I have some lowers with this on it)
    Deer
    Snake
    Bear
    Biohazard symbol
    Zombie in crosshairs
    Skull and crossbones
    "ZOMBIE DEFENSE"
    AR15.com bolt face
    Nuclear energy symbol
    Lion in crosshairs
    Dancing beast thing
    "PLUMCRAZY FIREARMS"
    Pirate symbol
    Bison skull
    Obama
    Crosshairs
    Indian battle ax
    Airplane taking off

    Being that encompasses the majority of stripped lowers out there, it's going to be hard to avoid them. And you're going to pay a markup for an LMT, BCM, S&W, DD, Noveske, or Colt lower. The only two budget lowers with a decent logo is LRB and PSA.
    Bison skull is Bison Armory...

  8. #28
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    Two male organs trying to crush a bug......bahahahaa that was a good one, sadly my current lower seems to sport that exact thing, to bad its a registered sbr. Onl reason I have it is my local guy had a great deal on the lower and it was properly built, though I quickly replaced the LPK to a Geissele SSA.

    I do have to say though I have a habit of iudging people based off the rifles they are at the range with and I am usually right.
    Last edited by sinlessorrow; 10-16-12 at 01:21.
    Quote Originally Posted by C4IGrant View Post
    Colt builds War Horses, not show ponies.
    Quote Originally Posted by Iraqgunz View Post
    This is 2012. The world is going to end this December and people are still trying to debate the merits of piece of shit, cost cutting crap AR's. Really?

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by sinlessorrow View Post
    Two male organs trying to crush a bug......bahahahaa that was a good one, sadly my current lower seems to sport that exact thing, to bad its a registered sbr. Onl reason I have it is my local guy had a great deal on the lower and it was properly built, though I quickly replaced the LPK to a Geissele SSA.

    I do have to say though I have a habit of iudging people based off the rifles they are at the range with and I am usually right.
    Three words: Black Duct Tape

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carlo@RB1 View Post
    At first I use to think that too. The folks I do know that own rifles with those lowers also own other "high end" lowers which they use primarily for training, competition, etc. I do see an increase of those types of lowers showing up to our courses though. And yes they often malfunction compared to other quality builds. After talking to them about it, I've found they were built from a stripped lower. At least I don't see any issued/duty rifles with these roll marks on them.
    Can you please tell what kind of malfunctions do the "other" lowers have at your courses? And in your professional opinion, who make the lower that is good to go and why?

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